This flight to Rwanda

Whole thing is just a stunt to signal to their base and keep them voting for them. There is no actual genuine benefit to it at all.

If this gets you going well done for being thick as shit and gullible as well as a horrible c*nt.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

You still don't have a solution at all then?

---

I'll start preparing the policy document now boss but fully accept that until then there is obviously no other option than Rwanda.

If anyone else feels strongly on this then https://detentionaction.org.uk/ is a good place to start.

So much hypocrisy about :

I'd bolster the Rwanda process by setting up a UK Asylum Gateway Unit .

Great the Human Rights Commission is involved presume they are aware of the 130,000 refugees
in Rwanda already migrants from other African nations and middle eastern countries .

Is Rwanda a country that has now changed ( or allowed to change )

Rwanda maybe see a chance to change they are holding a National Commission for Human Rights in Rwanda tomorrow and Friday .

As Rwanda GDP rises as does perhaps its time to allow then to prove they are a faire country and genuinely needs workers its GDP went up 10.50 USD Billion by the end of 2021, according to Trading Economics global analysts expectations the long-term GDP is looking good moving to 11.00 / 11.50 USD Billion.

This issue would go away tomorrow if Western society funded/fixed those countries where migrants flow from just sucking migrants them into countries they are not part of f it leaves those countries in even worse poverty .

Europe has created this problem by its open borders problem .

France to accept UK offers of UK personal on their shores .

Perhaps the demonstrators should sit outside the French embassy to stop the boats .

This is all come about because the lorry routes have been closed down nothing to do with Brexit and you can clearly see the boats.

Maybe the European Border and Coast Guard Agency ( Frontex ) should be looked at and asked why so many cross many sage European countries is it case they are as racist and not welcoming as some say Rwanda is or could be (from French: Frontières extérieures for "external borders"), is an agency of the European Union

2021 ( Known ) illegal rates was 35k per year can that continue is big question year on year , will it increase, how many are not reported as arriving everyone of of them need access to free housing, health , education , benefits support .

Of course Rwanda is not the answer, France and EU has that in its gift but is still pissed over Brexit and don't like these migrants on their patch either , yes they have them arrive and may take more in , but hey they don't want them and hide behind the European Courts Of Rights decisions but don't deal with its onw racism and poverty.

It has been quite striking how Europe treated the white Ukrainian migrants no camps for them , hotels and houses.

If folk in the UK feel that strongly about these migrants step up offer them a spare room in particular the leftie lawyers making a fortune from legal aid fence cases .

Where is the alternative solution or is it case let them in for politcial correctness and voter appeal ?? but what about the NIMBY's .

Labour needs to say something better than we must talk to our European partners which is the current PR issued statement ..

This is a clever move by the Tories to move away from cake gate / economy / if you notice there is the NI Protocol its to get folk to think hey they are doing stuff , oooh look at them lefties no plans , next we will see the Liberal / Labour accusation to re join the single currency...

Perhaps Labour simply needs to say some anti Tory stuff we agree with :

Scottish / Welsh / NI referendums on independence
Strikes
Raising benefits.
Join the European single currency
Join the European Schengen Area and its policies .
Let all migrants in.
Give everyone a 15% rise .
Tax everyone 60% on earnings over 100k
Get rid of student loans.
Nationalise utilities.
Minimum wages all ages to £15 an hour
Free nursery places form age of 3 .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

Bob, it is the party that you vote for that was recently chastised for racism by the EHRC - but I would never make nudge nudge wink wink allegations that all Labour voters are racists, or perhaps some but not all are etc. Honestly, the lack of self awareness of some of you guys! :facepalm:

Of course there are some racists in any society, but your argument is weak and unfair to just throw it at one side, and it is nothing to do with this case, as you well know.

You don't have any evidence to support what you say, which rather suggests you have no solution to the topic in hand, so are merely distracting by casting aspersions to deflect away from that?

---

You’re making huge assumptions there. First, the only claim I’ve made about the Labour Party in this thread is that they seem scared of their own shadow under Starmer and I’ve never denied that there was a problem under Corbyn when it came to anti Semitism. Also, I don’t know how I can make it more clear that I don’t believe all Leave voters and Tories to be racists, but I’ll always believe that the way the Referendum campaign was conducted put immigration front and centre as an issue and, no matter how much you try to deny it, that among those that centre on immigration as a big issue in this country, there are a proportion who do so on racist grounds.

Do you think the Government do not know this? Do you not think that they know there are a small percentage of easy votes to be gained by pandering to those who rate immigration as among the greatest threats facing the country today? Don’t you think it a bit fishy that the fly em to Rwanda scheme didn’t materialise until Johnson was under increased partygate pressure? Finally, as far as the “well, what would you do?” line that is parroted by the Government’s supporters goes, were any of you proposing the Rwanda solution before Johnson and co did? Of course you weren’t, because it’s a bonkers idea designed purely to move the discussion onto something the Government are happier talking about.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

444 people crossed the channel yesterday by the way. Come on lads, whats the solution? Or is there no problem at all?
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...dc8d9c9b8fc052

---

It was only a few weeks ago that you were posting the figures for channel crossings as being zero and believing that the announcement of the Rwanda policy was the reason for it due to it being a deterrent.

Since nobody with any immigration expertise on a football messageboard can come up with a viable solution to an issue that several governments have been unable to solve, in your eyes we have to blindly accept a policy that goes against our morals until we come up with a better one.

Ok mate :hehe:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I know a Rwandan fella in Barry who escaped the civil war and lives here

He says the country is still incredibly corrupt and people vanish ......and are clearly executed..... on a regular basis

And we are dealing with them ?

It's almost a case of ......is this woman serious ? Yep

---

Fair do’s Sludgie boy. Is there anyone you don’t know 😂

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by life on mars

So much hypocrisy about :

I'd bolster the Rwanda process by setting up a UK Asylum Gateway Unit .

Great the Human Rights Commission is involved presume they are aware of the 130,000 refugees
in Rwanda already migrants from other African nations and middle eastern countries .

Is Rwanda a country that has now changed ( or allowed to change )

Rwanda maybe see a chance to change they are holding a National Commission for Human Rights in Rwanda tomorrow and Friday .

As Rwanda GDP rises as does perhaps its time to allow then to prove they are a faire country and genuinely needs workers its GDP went up 10.50 USD Billion by the end of 2021, according to Trading Economics global analysts expectations the long-term GDP is looking good moving to 11.00 / 11.50 USD Billion.

This issue would go away tomorrow if Western society funded/fixed those countries where migrants flow from just sucking migrants them into countries they are not part of f it leaves those countries in even worse poverty .

Europe has created this problem by its open borders problem .

France to accept UK offers of UK personal on their shores .

Perhaps the demonstrators should sit outside the French embassy to stop the boats .

This is all come about because the lorry routes have been closed down nothing to do with Brexit and you can clearly see the boats.

Maybe the European Border and Coast Guard Agency ( Frontex ) should be looked at and asked why so many cross many sage European countries is it case they are as racist and not welcoming as some say Rwanda is or could be (from French: Frontières extérieures for "external borders"), is an agency of the European Union

2021 ( Known ) illegal rates was 35k per year can that continue is big question year on year , will it increase, how many are not reported as arriving everyone of of them need access to free housing, health , education , benefits support .

Of course Rwanda is not the answer, France and EU has that in its gift but is still pissed over Brexit and don't like these migrants on their patch either , yes they have them arrive and may take more in , but hey they don't want them and hide behind the European Courts Of Rights decisions but don't deal with its onw racism and poverty.

It has been quite striking how Europe treated the white Ukrainian migrants no camps for them , hotels and houses.

If folk in the UK feel that strongly about these migrants step up offer them a spare room in particular the leftie lawyers making a fortune from legal aid fence cases .

Where is the alternative solution or is it case let them in for politcial correctness and voter appeal ?? but what about the NIMBY's .

Labour needs to say something better than we must talk to our European partners which is the current PR issued statement ..

This is a clever move by the Tories to move away from cake gate / economy / if you notice there is the NI Protocol its to get folk to think hey they are doing stuff , oooh look at them lefties no plans , next we will see the Liberal / Labour accusation to re join the single currency...

Perhaps Labour simply needs to say some anti Tory stuff we agree with :

Scottish / Welsh / NI referendums on independence
Strikes
Raising benefits.
Join the European single currency
Join the European Schengen Area and its policies .
Let all migrants in.
Give everyone a 15% rise .
Tax everyone 60% on earnings over 100k
Get rid of student loans.
Nationalise utilities.
Minimum wages all ages to £15 an hour
Free nursery places form age of 3 .

---

You forgot "nationalise the railways" and "the government paying wages instead of businesses".

Wait, sorry. They were socialist policies that you said you wanted :hehe:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tito Fuente

in your eyes we have to blindly accept a policy that goes against our morals until we come up with a better one.

Ok mate :hehe:

---

No, you don't have to do anything. But peoples opposition to something is much stronger if they can suggest a viable alternative. Unless you support the status quo, which is fine, but people do seem to acknowledge an issue, they just can't suggest a means to dealing with it.

That's especially the case when the moral high ground is being claimed and accusations of racism are being thrown around like confetti.

444 people arrived yesterday. We have no idea who they are (yet) all to be housed, processed, cared for, all whilst others are entering legally, and all whilst enriching criminal gangs and people smugglers.

The situation is shit! There's little morality in just criticising a proposal and offering nothing in return IMO

Most sensible people will accept there is a problem but not one of them, including myself, can suggest a viable alternative. Some say set up an asylum processing centre in France. What then happens to those who fail the asylum process? Deport them to their point of origin some say. But the country at their point of origin may refuse to have them back or worse still the seekers will have destroyed their papers meaning they are effectively stateless. It seems it all comes back to the Rwanda solution as the least worse option unless we are content to allow things to continue as they are.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

You’re making huge assumptions there. First, the only claim I’ve made about the Labour Party in this thread is that they seem scared of their own shadow under Starmer and I’ve never denied that there was a problem under Corbyn when it came to anti Semitism. Also, I don’t know how I can make it more clear that I don’t believe all Leave voters and Tories to be racists, but I’ll always believe that the way the Referendum campaign was conducted put immigration front and centre as an issue and, no matter how much you try to deny it, that among those that centre on immigration as a big issue in this country, there are a proportion who do so on racist grounds.

Do you think the Government do not know this? Do you not think that they know there are a small percentage of easy votes to be gained by pandering to those who rate immigration as among the greatest threats facing the country today? Don’t you think it a bit fishy that the fly em to Rwanda scheme didn’t materialise until Johnson was under increased partygate pressure? Finally, as far as the “well, what would you do?” line that is parroted by the Government’s supporters goes, were any of you proposing the Rwanda solution before Johnson and co did? Of course you weren’t, because it’s a bonkers idea designed purely to move the discussion onto something the Government are happier talking about.

---

If you genuinely believe Jeremy Corbyn was an anti semite then you are a victim of the MSM witch hunt to such a degree, that there isn't much hope for you as an independentcritical thinker.

All these people on this thread virtue signalling, if you want Britain to become a third world country. Keep importing the 3rd world. Hopefully you can house some in your spare bedrooms in your white ethno towns that you CHOOSE to live in.
We are taking in an immigrant population over the size of Cardiff each year, so unless you want to start concreting over the green belt, something has to give. As for this Rwanda stunt, it's exactly that. A stunt. Boris let in 1 million migrants last year. He's a joke who is making fools of white working class folk who are most affected by mass immigration.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vindec

Most sensible people will accept there is a problem but not one of them, including myself, can suggest a viable alternative. Some say set up an asylum processing centre in France. What then happens to those who fail the asylum process? Deport them to their point of origin some say. But the country at their point of origin may refuse to have them back or worse still the seekers will have destroyed their papers meaning they are effectively stateless. It seems it all comes back to the Rwanda solution as the least worse option unless we are content to allow things to continue as they are.

---

If we started deporting them the whole racquet would end within months, they'd stop coming.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

If we started deporting them the whole racquet would end within months, they'd stop coming.

---

based on what?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by William Treseder

Fair do’s Sludgie boy. Is there anyone you don’t know 😂

---

He chooses to live in a white ethno town. 99.9% white.
why he feels he can lecture others about taking on mass immigration i don't know. He's either a very dedicated wind up merchant or a bit tapped in the head

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rjk

based on what?

---

Based on basic economics of supply and demand. These economic migrants only began coming when the word got out that Western Europe was a soft touch.This phenomenon only began in a massive way during the 90s.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by caerkid

'the true measure of any society can be found in how it treats its most vulnerable members'

It's hard to see how anyone can support this other than those so emotionally damaged that they take pleasure from hurting those who are worse off .Unfortunately now that Johnson is under pressure he will need to appeal more and more to the nutters on the back benches. Hopefully it's the death throes of a dead duck prime minister and his cult of wierdos but who knows how long it will continue with this awful lot.

Still, let's not criticise because the ex,ex,ex,ex leader of labour once thought about a similar policy for half an hour decades ago so let's just shout whatabout instead. It's a tragedy that the current Labour party are unable to condemn this scheme too heavily, other than for a cost reason, but the fact that they have to be careful to always appeal to Sun readers shows just who runs this country.

The idea that this would stop anyone from trying to get to the UK (often to be with their family) is a joke. It's already a journey which involves significant risk of harm/death so why would a 1 in godknows how big a number chance of being sent to Rwanda put anyone off ?

---

:thumbup:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

Claiming moral high ground? TICK
Anyone who thinks differently is a nutter? TICK
Defending Corbyn? TICK
Random comment on the Sun? TICK
Total absence of understanding of the issue? TICK
Total absence of any viable solution? TICK

---

JamesWales being an arse? TICK

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

If you genuinely believe Jeremy Corbyn was an anti semite then you are a victim of the MSM witch hunt to such a degree, that there isn't much hope for you as an independentcritical thinker.

All these people on this thread virtue signalling, if you want Britain to become a third world country. Keep importing the 3rd world. Hopefully you can house some in your spare bedrooms in your white ethno towns that you CHOOSE to live in.
We are taking in an immigrant population over the size of Cardiff each year, so unless you want to start concreting over the green belt, something has to give. As for this Rwanda stunt, it's exactly that. A stunt. Boris let in 1 million migrants last year. He's a joke who is making fools of white working class folk who are most affected by mass immigration.

---

Yay, bonus points for the use of the cliches virtue signalling and independent/critical thinker.

I said there was a problem under Corbyn, not that he’s an anti Semite - I don’t think it’s quite the same thing.

Agree about the use of the word stunt to describe the Rwanda sideshow.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

If we started deporting them the whole racquet would end within months, they'd stop coming.

---

Sadly most haven't got papers as they are told to destroy or are confiscated by the traffickers meaning there is nowhere to deport them to. Nobody has yet come up with a viable solution.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tito Fuente

You forgot "nationalise the railways" and "the government paying wages instead of businesses".

Wait, sorry. They were socialist policies that you said you wanted :hehe:

---

Glad there is an acceptance of reality and humour in you reply :-) everything I listed would be sizable to fund on top of the 400 billion already spent , plus the fuel subsidy support on its way , we need to cut taxes , for people , and business not chuck more subsidy around it will fire the inflation , qwhat is good is that unemployment is incredibly low .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

:thumbup:



JamesWales being an arse? TICK

---

Rude Socialist reply instead of debate ( tick )

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

:thumbup:



JamesWales being an arse? TICK

---

Thanks hun.

I do understand that the void where solutions can be written has to be filled with something and typically that is an ad hominem attack. :thumbup:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

There's little morality in just criticising a proposal and offering nothing in return IMO

---

Funnily enough my morals feel fine with which side of the 'dont send trafficked people to Rwanda' argument I'm standing on.

You say I'm taking the high ground but an ant's dangly bits couldn't get lower than our government on this one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by life on mars

Rude Socialist reply instead of debate ( tick )

---

I am just quoting JamesWales own words back to him. You remember surely - from the Politics Board just a few days ago where James and Dry Cleaning were doing their Jacob Rees-Mogg and Nadine Dories double act, and you were doing your best Michael Fabricant impression as back up.

As for debate, it is clear that illegal migration is a problem (for the migrants as well) with no easy solutions. Especially as the migrants are a mix of people looking for a better life and those who have suffered threats and torture. I would be on the side of the argument that focusses on prevention more than cure. Brutal regimes (sometimes backed by our government and allies), shattered economies (often in the Middle East following NATO attacks), dysfunctional international relationships that hinder joint action (increasingly with the EU), and a lack of resources to target the criminal gangs smuggling people - migrants, asylum seekers and trafficked women and children - go for the dealers before the users.

What I wouldn't jump on and defend is a cynical deflection policy of removing people without a fair or legal process (see posts above) that is massively expensive, cobbled together as red meat for Tory voters, and places vulnerable people in legal or administrative limbo on a different continent through a contract with a state that is still accused of human rights abuses. At least the ECRH has put a temporary stop on this - and prevented a 54 year old Iraqi torture victim being used as a prop in the Tory culture wars!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by caerkid

Funnily enough my morals feel fine with which side of the 'dont send trafficked people to Rwanda' argument I'm standing on.

You say I'm taking the high ground but an ant's dangly bits couldn't get lower than our government on this one.

---

These trafficked people are paying 5.000 pounds a go and they're coming from a safe secure country. They are economic migrants chancing their arm.
And they're massively encouraged by NGOs funded by Jewish Billionaire Soros and Co

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

I am just quoting JamesWales own words back to him. You remember surely - from the Politics Board just a few days ago where James and Dry Cleaning were doing their Jacob Rees-Mogg and Nadine Dories double act, and you were doing your best Michael Fabricant impression as back up.

As for debate, it is clear that illegal migration is a problem (for the migrants as well) with no easy solutions. Especially as the migrants are a mix of people looking for a better life and those who have suffered threats and torture. I would be on the side of the argument that focusses on prevention more than cure. Brutal regimes (sometimes backed by our government and allies), shattered economies (often in the Middle East following NATO attacks), dysfunctional international relationships that hinder joint action (increasingly with the EU), and a lack of resources to target the criminal gangs smuggling people - migrants, asylum seekers and trafficked women and children - go for the dealers before the users.

What I wouldn't jump on and defend is a cynical deflection policy of removing people without a fair or legal process (see posts above) that is massively expensive, cobbled together as red meat for Tory voters, and places vulnerable people in legal or administrative limbo on a different continent through a contract with a state that is still accused of human rights abuses. At least the ECRH has put a temporary stop on this - and prevented a 54 year old Iraqi torture victim being used as a prop in the Tory culture wars!

---

Expensive! Don't make me laugh! We are, correct me if I am wrong, spending nearly £5m a day to house people coming from a safe country (from the blessed EU no less!) who are rich enough to jump the queue and fund criminal gangs to get here ahead of other people who apply legally.

That's £35m a week, when the country supposedly cannot afford a hundred other things.

This is an extremely complex situation, that is true, and we have to have empathy and clearly prevention is better than cure, correct, but we are where we are and the situation needs sorting because the situation is being massively exploited.

From what I can see, as a floating voter, one side are trying to sort it. The other are offering zero solutions and filling that gap with insults at those who are at least offering them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

Expensive! Don't make me laugh! We are, correct me if I am wrong, spending nearly £5m a day to house people coming from a safe country (from the blessed EU no less!) who are rich enough to jump the queue and fund criminal gangs to get here ahead of other people who apply legally.

That's £35m a week, when the country supposedly cannot afford a hundred other things.

This is an extremely complex situation, that is true, and we have to have empathy and clearly prevention is better than cure, correct, but we are where we are and the situation needs sorting because the situation is being massively exploited.

From what I can see, as a floating voter, one side are trying to sort it. The other are offering zero solutions and filling that gap with insults at those who are at least offering them.

---

floating voter??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

These trafficked people are paying 5.000 pounds a go and they're coming from a safe secure country. They are economic migrants chancing their arm.
And they're massively encouraged by NGOs funded by Jewish Billionaire Soros and Co

---

Ah, there we have it - blame the Jews.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rjk

floating voter??

---

Yeah. I split my vote in the last local elections.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

Yeah. I split my vote in the last local elections.

---

Ukip and Tory?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by William Treseder

Fair do’s Sludgie boy. Is there anyone you don’t know 😂

---

I know stanni , for that is his name , very well

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Ukip and Tory?

---

Tory and Labour.

The fact that I debate with far-left people and those who view things completely in black and white terms on here when I think they are wrong doesn't mean I don't recognise there are fine Labour councillors and a sensible party there beneath it all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

He chooses to live in a white ethno town. 99.9% white.
why he feels he can lecture others about taking on mass immigration i don't know. He's either a very dedicated wind up merchant or a bit tapped in the head

---

I am moving soon . I might move in next door to you 😏

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I am moving soon . I might move in next door to you 😏

---

Haha
Cowbridge not white enough for you any more?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Undercoverinwurzelland

Ah, there we have it - blame the Jews.

---

Jews are generally big proponents of immigration into Europe and America, they openly boast about it. Yet they don't want immigration into Isreal which has extremely strict immigration laws.
Here's a quote from Barbara Learner Spectre, a very influential Jewish advocate of mass immigration.

"Europa has not yet learned how to be multicultural. Europe is not going to be the monolithic societies they once were in the last century. Jews are going to be at the center of that. It's a huge transformation for Europe to make. They are now going into a multicultural mode, and jews will be resented for our leading role”

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

Jews are generally big proponents of immigration into Europe and America, they openly boast about it. Yet they don't want immigration into Isreal which has extremely strict immigration laws.
Here's a quote from Barbara Learner Spectre, a very influential Jewish advocate of mass immigration.

"Europa has not yet learned how to be multicultural. Europe is not going to be the monolithic societies they once were in the last century. Jews are going to be at the center of that. It's a huge transformation for Europe to make. They are now going into a multicultural mode, and jews will be resented for our leading role”

---

and so he doubles down with some more anti semitism

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rjk

and so he doubles down with some more anti semitism

---

I'm not being anti semitic.
What have i said that's inaccurate?

How is it anti semetic to say Jews are big advocates of mass immigration. When the adjoining quote confirms it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lither_1927

I'm not being anti semitic.
What have i said that's inaccurate?

How is it anti semetic to say Jews are big advocates of mass immigration. When the adjoining quote confirms it?

---

:facepalm:

Go and educate yourself

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JamesWales

Expensive! Don't make me laugh! We are, correct me if I am wrong, spending nearly £5m a day to house people coming from a safe country (from the blessed EU no less!) who are rich enough to jump the queue and fund criminal gangs to get here ahead of other people who apply legally.

That's £35m a week, when the country supposedly cannot afford a hundred other things.

This is an extremely complex situation, that is true, and we have to have empathy and clearly prevention is better than cure, correct, but we are where we are and the situation needs sorting because the situation is being massively exploited.

From what I can see, as a floating voter, one side are trying to sort it. The other are offering zero solutions and filling that gap with insults at those who are at least offering them.

---

If you're fuming at it costing £35m a week you must be apoplectic at brexit..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Ukip and Tory?

---

:hehe:

Protective ring around the Pritster required

https://youtu.be/tNiarD3-8B4

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alfresco

What's the solution?

---

whatever it is, it's not sending refugees and asylum seekers to Rwanda.