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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
a very small minority out of a very large crowd. Numerous groups, including Hillsborough Support Networks asked for respectful silence, so I think the tiny minority shouting 'Liveeeerpoooool' have made themselves look a bit stupid. Credit to the crowd really, there were many secretly hoping they would be more disrespectful so they could slag off Liverpool fans / Merseyside in general etc.
These minute's silences (or applause) are always wholly fake. It's an obedience/conformity test to be respectful to what someone else deigns as appropriate for how they should behave.
Why stop at clapping in some instances? Why not ask everyone to hop on one leg instead or make train choo-choo noises?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
The point being that much of the media fudged the truth about the minute's silenced being honoured when it was cut short to 40 seconds.
I don't disagree with you. But I'm not sure it's worth dwelling on if a few idiots shout something out. Judging by the article below, that would have been jumped upon as an 'anti-Liverpool' attack etc.
We all know that Celtic would never honour the silence and beyond them perhaps Liverpool were the only threat given their (slightly confused) history with the royal family and 'the establishment' more generally. Given there was near unanimous silence, I think most people would be content with that and move on.
You can get a feel for the general subtext surrounding Liverpool fans by this article in the Liverpool Echo:
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spor...field-25011092
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Organ Morgan.
These minute's silences (or applause) are always wholly fake. It's an obedience/conformity test to be respectful to what someone else deigns as appropriate for how they should behave.
Why stop at clapping in some instances? Why not ask everyone to hop on one leg instead or make train choo-choo noises?
Why smile at someone when you see them? Why shake their hand? Why wear a tie to a wedding? Why say sorry when someone dies? Why smile at a joke even if it isn't funny?
There's a whole host of social norms and behaviours that we adhere to that you would be correct in saying make limited sense on their own.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Of course, as do many other countries, but demonstrably how are they better off for it? Starting from scratch I don't doubt it's a better route to go down, but we aren't starting from scratch and I think we would lose more than we gain in becoming a republic now.
what would we lose exactly?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
"Thousands of NHS operations and appointments look set to be cancelled on the day of the Queen's funeral.
The introduction of a last-minute bank holiday has meant hospitals are now postponing some routine treatments which had been booked in for Monday."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-62902341
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
"Thousands of NHS operations and appointments look set to be cancelled on the day of the Queen's funeral.
The introduction of a last-minute bank holiday has meant hospitals are now postponing some routine treatments which had been booked in for Monday."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-62902341
Crazy , GP's should be open ..
To be fair it doesn't take much these days to lock-down , whose decision was this before we blame our King ?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
life on mars
Crazy , GP's should be open ..
To be fair it doesn't take much these days to lock-down , whose decision was this before we blame our King ?
The Bank Holiday was declared by the government because of the funeral.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rjk
what would we lose exactly?
It's a fair question, and I am not ideologically a monarchist at all (quite the opposite really) so I don't dispute for a second that life would continue 99.9% the same as it is now. I could argue that on this, I support the status quo, so it is for others to make the case for changing something, but nontheless, a few thoughts;
1 / Global exposure. I've been struck by this - it's led the news websites, rolling news and papers in many countries for days. Some may argue that is not positive, but it is great advertising for the country and culture. Edinburgh and Scotland in particularly looked glorious. I think having a reigning monarch helps maintain that and is a significant part of the tourist offer. Cardiff will be in the worlds eye on Friday. We cannot buy that level of exposure.
2 / Stability. The UK is actually a pretty stable country and we have dealt with constitutional change in a generally stable manner over the last couple of centuries. I do wonder if an apolitical head of state does help with that. I'd suggest that perhaps it does
3 / Tradition. I'm not saying we live our lives for tradition alone, but it does matter. What else is it about Cardiff City playing in blue other than tradition? It's not a tradition I greatly care for, but many do, and I think I would miss elements of it if we had an elected politician as head of state
4 / It aint broke. The new King is powerless. He has now control over laws that impact us. If he did I would think 100% differently, but he doesn't. In a practical sense, removing him wouldnt lead to any better laws. It may even lead to worse if we had a president and prime minister from the same party? I've seen more people on here this week talk about the Queen than they ever do the Welsh health or education system - these are things we can and should influence far more.
5 / Kate Middleton is an absolute megababe and the thought of her as queen is hot.
More than anything, I just don't see the point. We know it doesn't make enormous practical sense, but nor does religion for most of us, but sometimes you take that away from a society and a void fills it that may be less positive than what it replaced.
And thats not to say that there aren't a great many things the Royal Family could do better, because there is. In the absence of any Republic being imminent, perhaps that would be a more useful conversation?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
It's a fair question, and I am not ideologically a monarchist at all (quite the opposite really) so I don't dispute for a second that life would continue 99.9% the same as it is now. I could argue that on this, I support the status quo, so it is for others to make the case for changing something, but nontheless, a few thoughts;
1 / Global exposure. I've been struck by this - it's led the news websites, rolling news and papers in many countries for days. Some may argue that is not positive, but it is great advertising for the country and culture. Edinburgh and Scotland in particularly looked glorious. I think having a reigning monarch helps maintain that and is a significant part of the tourist offer. Cardiff will be in the worlds eye on Friday. We cannot buy that level of exposure.
The USA had global exposure with Trump and Russia has global exposure with Putin. It doesn't really mean anything per se.
2 / Stability. The UK is actually a pretty stable country and we have dealt with constitutional change in a generally stable manner over the last couple of centuries. I do wonder if an apolitical head of state does help with that. I'd suggest that perhaps it does
The UK is more unstable than some neighbouring countries that do not have royal families that are worshipped a la House Windsor - and the UK seems far more volatile than some of those countries.
3 / Tradition. I'm not saying we live our lives for tradition alone, but it does matter. What else is it about Cardiff City playing in blue other than tradition? It's not a tradition I greatly care for, but many do, and I think I would miss elements of it if we had an elected politician as head of state
Bear-baiting and sending children up chimneys was traditional - and not being able to get red of someone who achieved their position merely by being born in the right bad is ridiculous.
4 / It aint broke. The new King is powerless. He has now control over laws that impact us. If he did I would think 100% differently, but he doesn't. In a practical sense, removing him wouldnt lead to any better laws. It may even lead to worse if we had a president and prime minister from the same party? I've seen more people on here this week talk about the Queen than they ever do the Welsh health or education system - these are things we can and should influence far more.
The elitist and class system in this country is indeed broke. Hereditary monarchy, hereditary peers, the political dominance of those who had private schooling and/or attended one or two universities, the sleazy honours system, the nepotism, the still-existing class divide etc
5 / Kate Middleton is an absolute megababe and the thought of her as queen is hot.
:tumbleweed:
More than anything, I just don't see the point. We know it doesn't make enormous practical sense, but nor does religion for most of us, but sometimes you take that away from a society and a void fills it that may be less positive than what it replaced.
Both royalty and religion are infanitising. Let's grow up and realise we need neither.
And thats not to say that there aren't a great many things the Royal Family could do better, because there is. In the absence of any Republic being imminent, perhaps that would be a more useful conversation?
It's depressing that people can't imagine a life without the medieval concept of kings, queens, princesses, golden carriages, the inherited title of the Church of England and the like.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
It's a fair question, and I am not ideologically a monarchist at all (quite the opposite really) so I don't dispute for a second that life would continue 99.9% the same as it is now. I could argue that on this, I support the status quo, so it is for others to make the case for changing something, but nontheless, a few thoughts;
1 / Global exposure. I've been struck by this - it's led the news websites, rolling news and papers in many countries for days. Some may argue that is not positive, but it is great advertising for the country and culture. Edinburgh and Scotland in particularly looked glorious. I think having a reigning monarch helps maintain that and is a significant part of the tourist offer. Cardiff will be in the worlds eye on Friday. We cannot buy that level of exposure.
2 / Stability. The UK is actually a pretty stable country and we have dealt with constitutional change in a generally stable manner over the last couple of centuries. I do wonder if an apolitical head of state does help with that. I'd suggest that perhaps it does
3 / Tradition. I'm not saying we live our lives for tradition alone, but it does matter. What else is it about Cardiff City playing in blue other than tradition? It's not a tradition I greatly care for, but many do, and I think I would miss elements of it if we had an elected politician as head of state
4 / It aint broke. The new King is powerless. He has now control over laws that impact us. If he did I would think 100% differently, but he doesn't. In a practical sense, removing him wouldnt lead to any better laws. It may even lead to worse if we had a president and prime minister from the same party? I've seen more people on here this week talk about the Queen than they ever do the Welsh health or education system - these are things we can and should influence far more.
5 / Kate Middleton is an absolute megababe and the thought of her as queen is hot. :yikes: :yikes: :yikes:
More than anything, I just don't see the point. We know it doesn't make enormous practical sense, but nor does religion for most of us, but sometimes you take that away from a society and a void fills it that may be less positive than what it replaced.
And thats not to say that there aren't a great many things the Royal Family could do better, because there is. In the absence of any Republic being imminent, perhaps that would be a more useful conversation?
This is not the time for these sorts of thoughts!!
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
It's depressing that people can't imagine a life without the medieval concept of kings, queens, princesses, golden carriages, the inherited title of the Church of England and the like.
I can imagine it, but like I said, I just don't think you've made a strong case for how it would be better or make any demonstrable difference to my life.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I can imagine it, but like I said, I just don't think you've made a strong case for how it would be better or make any demonstrable difference to my life.
I think you are pro-establishment by default but I'm not here to convert you.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
I think you are pro-establishment by default but I'm not here to convert you.
I assure you I am not. There probably isn't a more vocal supporter of respecting how the British electorate vote on here.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I assure you I am not. There probably isn't a more vocal supporter of respecting how the British electorate vote on here.
The British electoral system has been neutered, as all local candidates are now vetted by the central office of each political party, so in essence they have been filtered for ideological obedience.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Interesting answers to a question about the media coverage of the Royal death and accession - the coverage in no way matches what the majority of those who expressed an opinion want then and yet still the mainstream media doesn't reflect this. Coverage is being catered specifically for about 43 per cent of the country.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/entertai.../09/13/a0980/2
A clear majority thought it was right to cancel sporting events on the weekend though.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics.../09/12/7bf5e/2
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
With another 5 days' coverage to take into account in the coming days I would wager that the 49% in the first poll will only increase. The media seems to gorging on the proceedings and devouring itself.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
With another 5 days' coverage to take into account in the coming days I would wager that the 49% in the first poll will only increase. The media seems to gorging on the proceedings and devouring itself.
There'll be the investiture of the Prince of Wales to look forward to. From an environmental point of view, at least all the bunting and flags will get re-purposed.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Very interesting, I love stuff like that.
Another observation: there is remarkly little difference depending on age, geographic location, gender etc etc.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Very interesting, I love stuff like that.
Another observation: there is remarkly little difference depending on age, geographic location, gender etc etc.
Who are the 'don't knows' and why don't they know? It always makes me wonder!
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Citizen's Nephew
Who are the 'don't knows' and why don't they know? It always makes me wonder!
Not sure, but I suspect they don't post on this thread..
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Not sure, but I suspect they don't post on this thread..
😆🤙
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Excellent article, as usual, by Polly Toynbee
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
“As businesses close and funerals are halted, fear of being attacked by a rightwing mob is stifling freedom of expression following the Queen’s death.”
This was the same for Covid though , people with apposing views were cancelled, and called out.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TWGL1
“As businesses close and funerals are halted, fear of being attacked by a rightwing mob is stifling freedom of expression following the Queen’s death.”
This was the same for Covid though , people with apposing views were cancelled, and called out.
No, people who were spreading disinformation about the vaccine, 5g etc were called out, which I suppose would be the equivalent of protesters turning up to the Queen's funeral to claim she's not really dead
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
No, people who were spreading disinformation about the vaccine, 5g etc were called out, which I suppose would be the equivalent of protesters turning up to the Queen's funeral to claim she's not really dead
You mean hundreds of eminent scientists and doctors such as those from the Great Barrington Decoration ?
Or those arguing the PCR test had a high false positive rate ?
Or those saying they should only isolate the vulnerable and elderly ?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
Excellent article, as usual, by Polly Toynbee
I’ve been very critical of the BBC’s coverage, but she makes a good point - they would have been slaughtered by the “libertarian” bullies if they’d tried to also represent the views of those who thought differently to the “official” view.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Citizen's Nephew
Who are the 'don't knows' and why don't they know? It always makes me wonder!
I don't know.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
I don't know.
There’s always one! Reminds me of the Life of Brian “you’re all different”
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TWGL1
You mean hundreds of eminent scientists and doctors such as those from the Great Barrington Decoration ?
Or those arguing the PCR test had a high false positive rate ?
Or those saying they should only isolate the vulnerable and elderly ?
All those people were cancelled? How?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
I’ve been very critical of the BBC’s coverage, but she makes a good point - they would have been slaughtered by the “libertarian” bullies if they’d tried to also represent the views of those who thought differently to the “official” view.
No they wouldn't at all. This is the point. Libertarians do support views from all sides. Polly's newspaper very very rarely do.
Here's supposed 'right wing' libertarians (Sic) Guido Fawkes and Free Speech Union supporting them
https://order-order.com/2022/09/14/c...r-free-speech/
Here's the guardian, making it's opinion on free speech perfectly clear: "You agree with us or shut up you racist!"
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...dont-boo-cheer
https://www.theguardian.com/football...otball-grounds
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
No, people who were spreading disinformation about the vaccine, 5g etc were called out, which I suppose would be the equivalent of protesters turning up to the Queen's funeral to claim she's not really dead
Is that the same 5G that is central to the IOT? I'd reserve judgement on that, until you fully understand exactly what it entails. Regarding spreading disinformation about the vaccine, the scorecards are coming in, and some of them don't look so good.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
All those people were cancelled? How?
Fact checkers, MSM, official diktak, social media, and people like you unwittingly amplifying all of it, etc.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Fact checkers, MSM, official diktak, social media, and people like you unwittingly amplifying all of it, etc.
No, how are they all cancelled? What form has that “cancellation” taken for those thousands of people? Just because many people loudly disagree with you it doesn’t mean you’re cancelled
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Is that the same 5G that is central to the IOT? I'd reserve judgement on that, until you fully understand exactly what it entails. Regarding spreading disinformation about the vaccine, the scorecards are coming in, and some of them don't look so good.
12.7 billion doses given worldwide. I think the scorecards are just fine regardless of you lot with your AIDS theories and black eyed ghost children
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
12.7 billion doses given worldwide. I think the scorecards are just fine regardless of you lot with your AIDS theories and black eyed ghost children
In that case, can you point me to the long-term safety data that backs up your statement? Thanks in advance.
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
No, how are they all cancelled? What form has that “cancellation” taken for those thousands of people? Just because many people loudly disagree with you it doesn’t mean you’re cancelled
In that case, I would expect to see them on the BBC and in newsprint, and also on social media feeds, but in reality they have to resort to obscure websites if they want to make their opinions known, and then muppets like you attack these websites :biggrin:
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
In that case, can you point me to the long-term safety data that backs up your statement? Thanks in advance.
I don’t need to, we’re talking current scorecards…your words not mine
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
In that case, I would expect to see them on the BBC and in newsprint, and also on social media feeds, but in reality they have to resort to obscure websites if they want to make their opinions known, and then muppets like you attack these websites :biggrin:
You can’t find them on social media feeds?
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Re: “The silent majority” - yeah right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
delmbox
I don’t need to, we’re talking current scorecards…your words not mine
You said they are safe. How many placebo's were given? What are the side-effects after 3-years, 5-years and 8-years, etc.
