Printable View
Any promotion to the PL was a mere pipedream before Tan’s funding (Yes we were close when he joined but likely to go to the wall let’s be honest). Any anti Tan sentiment never comes with a solution. Who else is interested in investment ?Quote:
Originally Posted by sneggyblubird
It does come with a solution. Shape up or actively look to sell the club. People will buy a club with potential at the right price.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Blue
If he doesn't have a serious rethink then we may be in a worse place than before he arrived very soon.
The argument that all debts are payable to him isn't rhe case anymore either. If Dalman's firm and the like now want their pound of flesh they can and will.
We need a club strategy an identity and something like a Director of Football (on the Board and reporting direct to the owner) who can plan, recruit, oversee the full age and gender range of club teams - especially the work of the Academy - and ensure that there is continuity and progression whenever a manager leaves (is poached by a Premier League club for eye-watering compensation).Quote:
Originally Posted by Undercoverinwurzelland
There were a couple of times when Tan seemed open to that approach - when Glenn Roeder came in as an advisor and when Slade was given that Head of Football (?) title after he was sacked. Neither lasted long and the Slade one looked like a ‘soften the blow’ non job - although maybe he could have made something of it if he hadn’t left for another go at management?
Is Tan’s mam still around to nudge him in the right direction?
12 consecutive years in the Championship or above under his ownership, mostly competing at the top end. Plus all the charitable work he has done in the area, including setting up the Cardiff City foundation, raising millions of pounds in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
A cabal of about 20-25 people on this board who hate Tan (and always have) is hardly representative of our fan base either. Most people would have more common sense than that.
Tan must be a brilliant business man otherwise he wouldn’t have been so successful. Inspired management choices are likely to have been made by him in his commercial life away from football.
Why doesn’t he learn from his mistakes at Cardiff City - he must have the intelligence to do just this? It is galling this seems not to be the case.
Without his money we would have really struggled- I don’t see anyone else offering £3 million per month to keep us afloat. So far from perfect, reluctantly I am luke warm happy with Tan as we seemingly have no other choice.
A lot of people who hated Tan left when we turned red and haven’t come back ( there was a whole row of season ticket holders behind me who cancelled en masse and very few have returned since). I rarely attended a game in red but came back when we returned to blue. Maybe it’s my age but I’m convinced a little bit of passion for our club died in all of us when he went through with that monstrosity of a decision , even if you carried on going to games, it’s never been the same since. The promotion under Warnock was good but nowhere near the levels of passion I saw for the club in the Dave Jones era and beforeQuote:
Originally Posted by dml1954
And he is paying for that now, no wonder Warnocks not coming back, Tan would probably rather us go downQuote:
Originally Posted by Enoch Mort
Didn’t someone post on here the other day that Brighton are £450 million in debt? I don’t know if that’s actually true as they don’t spend big, in fact I think there team cost less than £50 million, and they sell big also…..Quote:
Originally Posted by Moodybluebird
That's not really the point. We still do not have the planning and recruitment structure in place to help drive the club forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
Who knows eh? Most will know they have to deal with Tan who wants to try and get back the millions he’s lost through his own shambolic decision making over the years, or Dalmans, take your pick…..if you were selling your house and every agent told you it’s worth 250k, your not going to get 350 are you…even though you want it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Blue
I believe the main problem as noted by the OP is Dalman and Choo, both only less than part time in running the Club. Tan for some reason has a mental block in seeing how they run the Club which is worse than a Sunday League Club. Until he moves those two on and gets people in who know the day to day runnings then things will stay the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
With all due respect your last sentence may represent the way you and some others feel and thats fair enough and I get why you feel that way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
But Neil Warnocks promotion season nowhere near the passion of the Dave Jones era and before. That just isnt true of our fan base as a whole.
There have been incredible atmospheres and passion shown home and away.
Its pretty shit at the moment due to the team and our lowly league position.
Ultimately everything comes down to what happens on the pitch.
The atmosphere and noise in the Ninian Stand has deteriorated over the years though. I dont know if thats because those wanting to stand and sing have moved to the Canton.
The Tan argument really centres around whether he is willing to admit that mistakes have been made in the past by the non-footballing side, rather than just blaming the footballing side management.
All transfers are the responsibility of the Transfer Committee, so if Tan feels like he’s been hoodwinked into overpaying, then he should ensure that he’s getting better advice, rather than repeating the same cycle - perhaps a Director of Football would help…? 🤔
Who else to replace Tan as owner? Well, these things are always kept out of the public domain and all my gazillionaire friends are busy with other things. Seriously, though, I’d love to see a consortium led by Bale and including other local heroes, but that’s probably a dream.
Whilst the achievements and financial support under Tan cannot be ignored, the fact that we are in relegation trouble - again - changing managers regularly and no publicly declared plan, philosophy or regular fan engagement is more than a cause for concern.
Swansea are the polar opposite of us. Their owners are not very forthcoming on the financial side, but in every other way they are years ahead of us and it’s embarrassing.
Happy that we have an owner who's been happy to chuck money at the club for years.
Not happy that he continues to employ people to run the club who don't appear to have a clue how to.
Yes, I did. 6th biggest debt in PL, owed mainly to their owner.Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
The ideal scenario is someone with serious money and a real interest in taking the club upwards purchases the club and we move forward.
I very much doubt that will happen anytime soon. I doubt theres serious interest.
Unbelievably some people think Sam could buy us back.🤣🤣🤣
The play-off final in 2010 was hardly a pipe dream.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Blue
Let me ask you a question: had you ever heard of Vincent Tan before he got involved with City?
Its like going back 15 - 20 years. Even David Sullivan is getting mentioned again.
What nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Blue
In 2006/07 we led the Championship for months and were well in contention for a playoff spot until a disastrous end of season run.
In 2008/09 we needed 2 points from our last 4 games to finish in the playoffs having also been in the running for automatic. We missed out.
In 2009/10 we got to the playoff final and lost.
In 2010/11 we led the division for a while and got to the playoffs again, but lost.
There's a common reason why we failed to go up during this time and it wasn't to do with funding. We had a policy of paying high wages and little in transfer fees but we still spent well. There's no doubt at all in my mind that we should have gone up during this time, when we arguably were in a better position to stay up with the players we had and the football we played.
The “you have to bring a solution” argument is bullshit. I don’t need to come in with a new buyer to see the shit he’s done to our club.
No your correct to see the shit hes done.Quote:
Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927
But we still need a buyer and someone to pay off all the debts and run the club.
I dont see us moving forward until hes gone and the club is taken over though.
Who knows maybe someone will come in.
As far as I'm concerned, it's just a weird standpoint. After all, how many of us had heard of Vincent Tan before he got involved with City? Furthermore, how many of the current Premier League and Championship football club owners had any of us heard of before they got involved in the sport?Quote:
Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927
Some genuinely seem to believe that this old Malaysian fella is the only rich bloke out there who has any interest in the idea of owning a Championship club. I guess they think City will simply fold when he eventually turns his toes up.
I’m not sure I’d look at our playoff record like it’s a badge of honour….isn’t it won 3 ( when we won promotion to this league) lost 9 or something? I guess it shows some success moving forward but almost anything could after the previous 25 yrs….pre 2003Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
Why should a new buyer have to pay for Tans debts? They won’t pay an extra 50 million will they? He just won’t be able to sell us….Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927
What debts? There are none. It is all payable to Ta....oh wait.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
Apparently, according to a few on here if there was interest then we should all know about it. Despite what you say being absolutely correct. Most owners are well down th3 road to owning a club before anybody has heard of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
And Dalman.Quote:
Originally Posted by blue lewj
Lets hope thats the case then and a sale really is imminent.Quote:
Originally Posted by blue lewj
That's exactly what I meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
The excuse of 'its fine, it is all payable to Tan' is suddenly no longer the case.
The debt to equity and debt free under Tan dream cannot be realised while money is owing to companies outside of Tan's own money.
Why do we owe Dalman £30 million anyway? That’s a lot of debt to suddenly build up? Doesn’t Tan always say he keeps putting money in last few yrs, so which is it because it surely can’t be both that would mean the club is being run far worse than I thought possible if they are both chucking in millions each month:shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
I agree with this statement - without Tan we would be in the same state as BuryQuote:
Originally Posted by blue lewj
They (Wrexham) have Shaun Harvey as the DoF, and they have Humphrey Kerr as the 'Owner's man on the Board'. He's there to see that Rob and Ryan's money is spent properly, and that the business is looked after. In effect, he is their equivalent of Ken Choo or Mehmet Dalman - he's a guy that they can trust, to keep their best interests at heart. In Cardiff's case, Vincent Tan will take their advice over anyone else's. And that's all well and good. In business, you need guys you can trust.Quote:
Originally Posted by blue matt
The difference is, of course that 1. We don't have a Director of Football, and 2. Humphrey Kerr has taken the time and effort to learn everything he can about the game, and about the club. I'm not sure you can say that about Dalman, who didn't even take the time to get to know the new manager.
We have to get real. The club has so much debt nobody will buy it. It took Newcastle a few years to sell their club and they are a much better bet than us. The reality is that CCFC is unaffordable unless Tan is willing to accept a hefty loss which is unlikely. We may not be able to accept Tan's decisions but we cannot afford to live without him. Whatever people think he is an honourable man and could have walked away from the club before racking up millions of his own personal debt. He needs great credit for that in my book.
7 playoff campaigns, 1 win, 1 other final, 5 semi final failures. 1 win and 6 defeats at home is by far the worst home playoff record in the football league. In total we've won 5 playoff fixtures, drawn 2 and lost 9. Following our 1-0 win at Leicester, we had lost 6 out of 8 playoff games, 4 on the trot without scoring.Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
He'd get a lot more credit from me if he sold at a huge loss and walked. After all he can afford it and it would be the honourable thing to do. Whatever happened to hari kari after failure?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
I have been asking the same question every six months or so for the last four , five , six years ........but .....Quote:
Originally Posted by Cardiff-Cal
Where are we on the debt to equity thing he promised ?
He's putting money in which is good but is it at all possible that a football club might break even these days ?
If we are running at a loss, doesn't that mean the club is poorly run ?
He has been here for a decade and the club is still making losses month upon month.
Other clubs develop youth, install a modern managerial setup , hire managers who are not steve bruce, mick mccarthy or neil warnock.
Other owners manage not to alienate fans.
We are in a worst state now on the field than when he came. The people put in charge of footballing decisions are not qualified. Financially, I IMAGINE we are better off than a decade ago but I haven't heard anything about our current debts etc for years.
I know a number of people who were season ticket holders for decades who not only don't go anymore but are also indifferent to bad or good results. I feel the same.
I don't know what the answer is. We need to get this fckin debt off our backs and we need people in charge that are not ignorant novices in order that we begin planting some seeds that by 2033 begin to blossom. If Tan is in charge in a decades time do you honestly think the club will be in a better place ? I don't know why anyone would think so.
He is a very bad owner in my opinion.
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...-debt-10875878Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
Debt free in five years.
The article is from 2016.
Guess that means we are no longer in debt.
Fairplay to him for the 68 million....but where do we stand at the moment ? Or is this just hot air ?
We can't be debt free anytime soon, and certainly not in the sense of Tan converting debt to equity, as we've started taking loans from other companies now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Divine Wright
If the meal we've made of paying the first Sala instalment is anything to go by then I can't see us paying that company off for some time.