The Manics

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25-05-23, 21:42
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Johnny

Their early stuff was a bit retro, influenced by The Clash and Guns N' Roses. The track Little Baby Nothing wouldn't be too out of place on a Meat Loaf album, but very good nevertheless.

In a way they were sort of a reaction against all those Shoegazing bands from the Home Counties that were prevalent in indie rock during the early 90s.

I always thought The Girl Who Wanted to Be God was such a superb song.

I hated those shoegazing bands

Slowdive

Christ they were boring

Mind you I am a metal head so I shouldn't really have gone to see them

Bloody students
25-05-23, 21:55
Alan Lung

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I am a metal head

You should have mentioned this before.
25-05-23, 21:56
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Lung

You should have mentioned this before.

Well now you know

Deal with it
25-05-23, 21:56
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I hated those shoegazing bands

Slowdive

Christ they were boring

Mind you I am a metal head so I shouldn't really have gone to see them

Bloody students

Most of them were weak as ****, but I like Slowdive, and Lush.
25-05-23, 21:57
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

Most of them were weak as ****, but I like Slowdive, and Lush.

Lush had that half Japanese female guitarist and singer ?

I liked Curve , in small doses
25-05-23, 22:22
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

Most of them were weak as ****, but I like Slowdive, and Lush.

Hardly weak, Swervedriver were excellent...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0DTBOQOdf4
25-05-23, 22:26
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

Hardly weak, Swervedriver were excellent...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0DTBOQOdf4

They were a rock band , not a feckin student shoegazing bunch of students
25-05-23, 22:37
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

They were a rock band , not a feckin student shoegazing bunch of students

They had a harder edge, but Swervedriver were in the thick of the shoegaze scene, and Mezcal Head is one of the most acclaimed shoegaze albums. A lot of the shoegaze bands had connections with Oxford and ended up at Creation Records.
25-05-23, 22:43
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

They had a harder edge, but Swervedriver were in the thick of the shoegaze scene, and Mezcal Head is one of the most acclaimed shoegaze albums. A lot of the shoegaze bands had connections with Oxford and ended up at Creation Records.

I lived in Oxford when it was all kicking off

205 cowley road , 5 minutes walk from the Venue where they all played

Saw Radiohead there who I thought were boring
25-05-23, 22:53
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I lived in Oxford when it was all kicking off

205 cowley road , 5 minutes walk from the Venue where they all played

Saw Radiohead there who I thought were boring

Here's some more Swervedriver playing live. They probably influenced grunge too. They are a very underrated band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhoS0JIuH44
25-05-23, 23:08
Wash DC Blue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I lived in Oxford when it was all kicking off

205 cowley road , 5 minutes walk from the Venue where they all played

Saw Radiohead there who I thought were boring

Wouldn’t it be easier to list the cities in the UK that you haven’t lived?
26-05-23, 00:06
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue

Wouldn’t it be easier to list the cities in the UK that you haven’t lived?

If you like

Newport
26-05-23, 01:36
Alan Lung

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Newport

I doubt you'd last 2 minutes there.
26-05-23, 03:31
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

Hardly weak, Swervedriver were excellent...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0DTBOQOdf4

I like Swervedriver. I don't really consider them to be a shoegaze band though. I don't really think MBV are shoegaze either.
26-05-23, 05:01
gabbsthenewt

Re: The Manics

"I eat too much to die and not enough to stay alive. I'm sitting in the middle waiting."

Hope Richie is resting in peace somewhere wherever he is

:flare:
26-05-23, 08:15
Robin Friday's Ghost

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Lush had that half Japanese female guitarist and singer ?

I liked Curve , in small doses

Miki Berenyi. She recently did a collaboration with the fantastic Fashion Weak.
26-05-23, 09:48
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin Friday's Ghost

Miki Berenyi. She recently did a collaboration with the fantastic Fashion Weak.

That's her

Emma Anderson on other guitars ?

I think the drummer or bassist killed himself and they split up ?
26-05-23, 13:51
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

I don't really think MBV are shoegaze either.

Loveless is the genre defining shoegaze album.
27-05-23, 03:20
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

Loveless is the genre defining shoegaze album.

It's the best album of that era. But to me, it's not shoegaze. Kevin Shields is a genius. He had a vision and he wasn't shuffling around around looking at his pedals. Isn't Anything and especially Loveless are wall-of-sound, full-on sonic attacks. Massive drums and loads of guitar tracks. Imagine if it was a bloke singing and not Bilinda Butcher. No one would even consider it shoegaze. As far as I know, no one called it shoegaze at the time. That was reserved for the London and Home Counties bands and "the scene that celebrates itself" as Melody Maker called it.
27-05-23, 09:26
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

It's the best album of that era. But to me, it's not shoegaze. Kevin Shields is a genius. He had a vision and he wasn't shuffling around around looking at his pedals. Isn't Anything and especially Loveless are wall-of-sound, full-on sonic attacks. Massive drums and loads of guitar tracks. Imagine if it was a bloke singing and not Bilinda Butcher. No one would even consider it shoegaze. As far as I know, no one called it shoegaze at the time. That was reserved for the London and Home Counties bands and "the scene that celebrates itself" as Melody Maker called it.

You are on your own here then. Nothing wrong with that as it's only a generally accepted label. This video traces the path to shoegaze and it's backed up in the comments by a member of the Pale Saints. Funnily enough, I like most of these bands including the wall of sound stuff and Husker Du.

Before Loveless: How Shoegaze Became Shoegaze
27-05-23, 11:02
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

You are on your own here then. Nothing wrong with that as it's only a generally accepted label. This video traces the path to shoegaze and it's backed up in the comments by a member of the Pale Saints. Funnily enough, I like most of these bands including the wall of sound stuff and Husker Du.

Before Loveless: How Shoegaze Became Shoegaze

Swervedriver actually remind me of Husker Du a little bit.
27-05-23, 11:09
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

I can dig heavier stuff like MBV and the guitar festivals of Spacemen 3 and Spiritualised

But the namby pamby indie lite stuff can naff off
28-05-23, 08:22
AfricanBluebird

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

I can dig heavier stuff like MBV and the guitar festivals of Spacemen 3 and Spiritualised

But the namby pamby indie lite stuff can naff off

MBV were the loudest band I've ever seen live. Loveless is fantastic.

Spiritualised & Spacemen 3 also excellent.

The Jesus and Mary Chain reign supreme from the genre, of course. I am partial to the Wedding Present.. Ear piercing.

I think all had some energy, noise and authenticity that others didn't have. I probably wouldn't call them shoegaze.

Sludge ia right though, many of the later so called shoegaze bands were just awful and on par with all those awful britpop nonsense bands. One or two crept through with some great tunes and proper heavy guitar and booming bass, but so many were 'meh'.

Not shoegaze, but a special mention to 'James' .. Wonderful live and the later stuff really plays well live. 'Curse curse' is a very funny and uplifting tune.

Ill be travelling and will miss Queens of the Stone Age next month in Cardiff castle.. Great live band.
29-05-23, 08:28
Fatty Thornton

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

MBV were the loudest band I've ever seen live. Loveless is fantastic.

Spiritualised & Spacemen 3 also excellent.

The Jesus and Mary Chain reign supreme from the genre, of course. I am partial to the Wedding Present.. Ear piercing.

I think all had some energy, noise and authenticity that others didn't have. I probably wouldn't call them shoegaze.

Sludge ia right though, many of the later so called shoegaze bands were just awful and on par with all those awful britpop nonsense bands. One or two crept through with some great tunes and proper heavy guitar and booming bass, but so many were 'meh'.

Not shoegaze, but a special mention to 'James' .. Wonderful live and the later stuff really plays well live. 'Curse curse' is a very funny and uplifting tune.

Ill be travelling and will miss Queens of the Stone Age next month in Cardiff castle.. Great live band.

I saw James with a live orchestra back in April, in the St Davids Hall - wonderful experience. Also going to QOTSA in the castle, I am very much looking forward to that!
29-05-23, 09:38
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

MBV were the loudest band I've ever seen live. Loveless is fantastic.

Spiritualised & Spacemen 3 also excellent.

The Jesus and Mary Chain reign supreme from the genre, of course. I am partial to the Wedding Present.. Ear piercing.

I think all had some energy, noise and authenticity that others didn't have. I probably wouldn't call them shoegaze.

Sludge ia right though, many of the later so called shoegaze bands were just awful and on par with all those awful britpop nonsense bands. One or two crept through with some great tunes and proper heavy guitar and booming bass, but so many were 'meh'.

Not shoegaze, but a special mention to 'James' .. Wonderful live and the later stuff really plays well live. 'Curse curse' is a very funny and uplifting tune.

Ill be travelling and will miss Queens of the Stone Age next month in Cardiff castle.. Great live band.

QOTSA were fantastic in their early days , first album is immense

Kyuss , Fu Manchu , Nebula are other decent stoner rock bands
29-05-23, 09:38
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatty Thornton

I saw James with a live orchestra back in April, in the St Davids Hall - wonderful experience. Also going to QOTSA in the castle, I am very much looking forward to that!

QOTSA yes
29-05-23, 13:21
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird

MBV were the loudest band I've ever seen live. Loveless is fantastic.

Spiritualised & Spacemen 3 also excellent.

The Jesus and Mary Chain reign supreme from the genre, of course. I am partial to the Wedding Present.. Ear piercing.

I think all had some energy, noise and authenticity that others didn't have. I probably wouldn't call them shoegaze.

Sludge ia right though, many of the later so called shoegaze bands were just awful and on par with all those awful britpop nonsense bands. One or two crept through with some great tunes and proper heavy guitar and booming bass, but so many were 'meh'.

Not shoegaze, but a special mention to 'James' .. Wonderful live and the later stuff really plays well live. 'Curse curse' is a very funny and uplifting tune.

Ill be travelling and will miss Queens of the Stone Age next month in Cardiff castle.. Great live band.

The JAMC are nowhere near shoegaze.
29-05-23, 14:39
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

The JAMC are nowhere near shoegaze.

They were certainly heavy on the over drive

An indie band that were a rock band but didn't want to admit it
29-05-23, 21:55
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

The JAMC are nowhere near shoegaze.

They couldn't be if Loveless was also nowhere near shoegaze :wink:
30-05-23, 06:59
AfricanBluebird

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatty Thornton

I saw James with a live orchestra back in April, in the St Davids Hall - wonderful experience. Also going to QOTSA in the castle, I am very much looking forward to that!

Yeah my brother went to that and said it was fantastic.

I was travelling for work and missed it.
30-05-23, 20:58
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

They couldn't be if Loveless was also nowhere near shoegaze :wink:

Shoegaze didn't exist in 1985.

I saw a top 5 "essential" shoegaze records recently and the Cocteau Twins were in it. 1982. Shoegaze?
30-05-23, 21:14
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

Shoegaze didn't exist in 1985.

I saw a top 5 "essential" shoegaze records recently and the Cocteau Twins were in it. 1982. Shoegaze?

Genre: a category of artistic, musical, or literary composition characterized by a particular style, form, or content.
30-05-23, 21:53
Divine Wright

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Nicky Wire is a soppy spurs fan

The drummer , Liverpool

Dunno what you're moaning about ....that's about as Welsh as you get.

People who follow Welsh football teams is probably a small minority of the overall football following population in our country.

Same as people who vote for english political parties, watch english tv and read english newspapers.

I'd echo some of the sentiments on here regarding how successful they have been whilst maintaining substance in terms of the songs' messages.

Desgin for Life live , back when it was fresh is stirring to say the least.
30-05-23, 22:43
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

Genre: a category of artistic, musical, or literary composition characterized by a particular style, form, or content.

In hindsight. Are you saying the JAMC and the Cocteau Twins are shoegaze bands?
30-05-23, 22:56
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

In hindsight. Are you saying the JAMC and the Cocteau Twins are shoegaze bands?

It's self-explanatory, categories are organised by style, form or content.
30-05-23, 23:48
SLUDGE FACTORY

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Wright

Dunno what you're moaning about ....that's about as Welsh as you get.

People who follow Welsh football teams is probably a small minority of the overall football following population in our country.

Same as people who vote for english political parties, watch english tv and read english newspapers.

I'd echo some of the sentiments on here regarding how successful they have been whilst maintaining substance in terms of the songs' messages.

Desgin for Life live , back when it was fresh is stirring to say the least.

What is about as Welsh as you can get ?

I am not a manics fan , I appreciate that others do but I don't rate them

Just because a lot of Taff's support English football teams does not mean that its OK and it can't be commented on .

I think it's embarrassing to see the manics hang Welsh dragons on their amps and then hear that nicky wire hoovers his front room in a spurs shirt

It's pathetic

He may as well hang a flag of St George out of his window
31-05-23, 11:05
Divine Wright

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

What is about as Welsh as you can get ?

I am not a manics fan , I appreciate that others do but I don't rate them

Just because a lot of Taff's support English football teams does not mean that its OK and it can't be commented on .

I think it's embarrassing to see the manics hang Welsh dragons on their amps and then hear that nicky wire hoovers his front room in a spurs shirt

It's pathetic

He may as well hang a flag of St George out of his window

I'm not stickin' up for them per se.

....just saying everyone is probably a bit of a hypocrite in that regard. Doesn't mean you can't be pro-independence or whatever the purest embodiment of being a welsh person is.

You vote labour , not Plaid. You drink english IPA, not Tomos Watkin. etc etc

I grew up in Bargoed and I think most of the kids in my school supported Liverpool ....maybe Everton......as did I until my father (whose father was a Cardiffian and took him to watch Cardiff) took me to my first city match. The other kids' parents probably didn't care about football much. I think had I grown up where I did and my father was from a similar background to my mother, I might well have never supported Cardiff City. I might still be pro-indy ....

...same thing with folk on this board who are butcher's apron wavers ....their parents are probably from abroad or something ...or more specifically , england.

in fact, I think it's far weirder to be a Cardiff City fan and love the union, england, the queen....or king...
31-05-23, 11:24
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

It's self-explanatory, categories are organised by style, form or content.

No it isn't. And no they are not.
31-05-23, 19:18
Wales-Bales

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCBlue

No it isn't. And no they are not.

Are you now saying the Merriam-Webster dictionary is wrong?
01-06-23, 11:57
NYCBlue

Re: The Manics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wales-Bales

Are you now saying the Merriam-Webster dictionary is wrong?

I'm saying you are wrong. You've chosen to oversimplify something that is quite complex. You cannot categorise art in a manner of your chosing when its creator does not wish it to be catergorised so. Ask William Reid if he was in a shoegaze band. Or if you feel really brave ask Siouxsie if she was in a Goth band.

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