Right; whether shirt pulling all over the pitch and wrestling in the box constitutes a foul or not. Refs think not, fans think so. But we're all good on what a penalty is!Quote:
Originally Posted by William Treseder
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Right; whether shirt pulling all over the pitch and wrestling in the box constitutes a foul or not. Refs think not, fans think so. But we're all good on what a penalty is!Quote:
Originally Posted by William Treseder
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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
And that's why we got VAR, so the referee's team could see things from all angles, just as the TV viewers do. What a success that's been!
So many times on MOTD over the years, no matter what the game was like, nearly always the first comment in the studio was "Let's get this sorted first Alan. Was it a penalty/a red card/offside?". The whole game would be boiled down to one referee's decision. Never mind the other 89 minutes that had been spent trying to score.
But players are coached to do this, all players. You can tell that by the way they fall under contact. Tuerto is right, if it's not this then it'll be something else. We shouldn't expect refs to get things right when there are a couple of dozen players whose job and career depends on fooling them.
Bring back the obstruction rule. Always thought football was meant to be played with the legs but nowadays there's wrestling all over the pitch
I noticed in Poland’s last game, that they eliminated pushing and shoving in the box at corners, by all their players standing on the goal area line and then running in when the corner was taken
I thought it was great
Ya, they say “he played well, shielding the ball out of play” !!!Quote:
Originally Posted by fugsyphil
No he/it wasn’t, it was f uck ing obstruction
I’m of the opinion that if a player has no intention of playing the ball while holding a player off he’s committing an offence. Free kick for obstruction every time.Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUETIT
get the shirts rugby league players wear they need help putting them on they are that tight, like me with a normal shirt !!!!
It's truly absurd that at a time when we have something like VAR in place that is supposed to be an aid to officials in any area of the pitch, we also have the most blatant shirt pulling and wrestling going on in penalty areas every time a ball is delivered into it from a dead ball situation. VAR has made the penalty area fouling much worse because players know that you either have to be really stupid or really unlucky to be penalised, particularly if you are a defender.Quote:
Originally Posted by lardy
I was watching some Championship game over the weekend where a cross came into the far post and one of the full backs grabbed the player he was supposed to be marking's shirt almost out of force of habit even though the attacker was not going to reach the ball, which was sailing into the keeper's hands. Ten years or so ago, I'm pretty confident a penalty would have been given and the defender concerned would have had the riot act read to him by his manger for such lazy and shoddy defending - today, defenders don't give a second thought to grabbing the shirt of the nearest player to them when the ball is in the penalty area because modern day officials, lmost always, ignore this blatant fouling.
The blatant fouling that is tolerated these days devalues the game and makes it less of a spectacle, I don't know one supporter who enjoys all of the grappling even when it involves their own team and, if I had the power, I would make its eradication one of my priorities. Then, when managers, players and coaches found their next way of cheating that they they thought they could get away with, I'd make that the next thing to be got rid of from the game.
Completely agree, Although I'm not one for going in on a referees, I have the utmost sympathy for them, the way they are scrutinized now is obscene in my opinion, they're scrutinized more than people in positions of power who really do need it. I've always been. Of the opinion that you win some, you lose some, and that's one of the reasons I like football. Players, coaches, owners need to take a while lot of responsibility for the way the game is in terms of life level cheating, maybe they should speak out, as well as fans groups, bloggers and YouTubers.........Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
Not wanting to argue with you, but shirt pulling and grappling are fouls. We know, and the referees know. They just seem reluctant to enforce it, in certain circumstances, for what ever reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by lardy
It should be made public that every ref & linesman will be receiving instructions from the governing bodies that the letter of the law has to be adhered to, make it plain that the directive is coming from the top. No doubt some will still berate the officials but if it’s well publicised that it’s come from the ruling bodies only the dimwits will carry on abusing the officials. Unfortunately there are many dimwits in the game. If it’s applied across the board there should be no grey area. Many’s the time I’ve seen shirt tugging & grappling ignored but have my heart in my mouth when one of ours does it shortly after fearing that this time it’ll be penalised.
Goal area line..which line is that then?Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUETIT
18 yard line, edge of the box perhaps.Quote:
Originally Posted by kendoddsdadsdogsdead
What about a striker holding the ball up and pinning a defender while waiting for support? That's an art in itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
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Originally Posted by kendoddsdadsdogsdead
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Originally Posted by splott parker
I forgot how to spell meter Steve :hehe:
If he’s pushing an opponent with the ball nowhere in sight, it’s a foul. Harry Kane is guilty of this, that is ‘making a back’ against a defender, who if he wins the ball in the air is in danger of plunging over the top of Kane. Very dangerous foul play, could result in injury.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
If you have touched the ball last you can do some of that but if not it's obstruction (Kenny dalglish was a master at it)Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Dalglish was brilliant at it. It's just shielding the ball, it's not like the player in question has put the ball up his jumper. There are those on here who seem to think that a player should give the opposition a fair and just opportunity to get the ball back, absolutely crazy in my opinion, and i would love to play against them if i was in a position to play anymore. Thanks very much..........Quote:
Originally Posted by fugsyphil
The sticking point seems to be, ‘Is a player in possession of the ball if he hasn’t touched it and has no intention of touching or playing it?’Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
I’d like to think that’s he’s not in possession and if he’s pushing, backing in and in any way preventing an opponent legitimately, as in not being the one pushing, pulling or shielding, getting to the ball, a free kick should be awarded. If he plays/touches the ball he’s in possession, much the same as a tackle, if the tackler gets the ball vigorously but fairly that ok, even if the player who’s tackled hits the deck in a heap. If he tackles vigorously and misses the ball completely. It’s a free kick.
If the ball is at the players feet then he or she are in possession, it's not obstruction, and the player shielding the ball has absolutely no obligation to move or change their body shape, as long as the ball is at the players feet. If a player does the same thing without the ball then it's an obstruction. Players shield the ball constantly, they turn in on themselves if there's no options available, Ramsey used to do it a lot, in order to change the angle and put himself in a position where he's not face on with a defender, it's just protecting the ball, it's not foul play, wherever a player is on the field of play.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
why not do what they do in (ice) hockey. instant penalty with only the more serious offences getting yellow and red.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
Don’t get that, do you mean that he’s protecting the ball and not touching it all? Wouldn’t he have to touch it in order to move away with it or pass? Otherwise two players are ‘dancing’ and the ball is static. If the ball is being played past them and, we’ll say Ramsey, impedes an opponent preventing him getting to the ball it’s surely a foul.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
If the ball is at a players feet, whether they touch it or not, it's fine, if it's not within distance of the feet then it's not ok to back into an opponent, that's an obstruction. The position of the ball is crucial.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
Just read up on it. A player is generally considered to be in possession of the ball when they have it under control, if the player has their foot near the ball but doesn’t make contact, they are not considered to have possession, they must make contact or have some control over it. Simply having your foot near the ball doesn’t mean you possess it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Anyway it does seem very much a spectator/player issue. Players on the whole seem to accept the situation and don’t seem to make a song and dance about it, I s’pose they view it as tit for tat. Whereas spectators see it as a disruption of a, perhaps, flowing move or definite fouls that should be penalised.
It should definitely be a free kick when a defender is shepparding the ball out of play but opts to move away from the ball to obstruct an attacker from getting to it. Often there is no way the defender could reach the ball to touch it but it's never given as a foul
they should trial it in the women's game and see if it catches onQuote:
Originally Posted by BLUETIT
A player is going to have go some way into not touching the ball if an opposition player is attempting to dispossess them. I'm fine with it, so are the authorities by the looks of it, and the players managers and coaches, and most of the fans......... :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
I wouldn’t say the fans, most are up in arms if one of their own are obstructed, having their shirt pulled, grappled to the ground etc and nothing is given. As I say players seem to accept it, coaches/managers have a melt down though, waving their arms like loonies:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Over the stuff you mention, not the shielding of the ball stuff, there's hardly any furore over that.Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
I shout like f*ck at defenders shielding it and shepherding it out for a goal kick……you don’t sit close enough to me:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
I sit next to Dai Hunt in order to drown out the noise........Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
My ventriloquism reaches all parts!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
"Sausages"Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
Haven’t you heard Dai Hunt? ‘Gluegirds, Gluegirds’Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
Memories of Bob Carolgees and spit the dog,Quote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
And Charlie the Monkey.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto