Police commissioner requests 'immediate review' of decision to ban Maccabi Tel Aviv fans

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

A lot of one sided posts on that Amsterdam event, people ignoring what they want and amplifying other things. The reality is it was a serious event, there was anti Palestinian behaviour from some Maccabi fans, which was responded to in kind by some wholly disproportionate violence after the game towards them, including a lot of stuff that appears to be antisemitic (references to "Jew hunts" etc), and more vandalism from Maccabi fans and others before order was restored.

It's a two-sides thing. Anyone saying otherwise is lying and there's multiple reports on it all.

All of that is reason to ensure the game is marked as a high profile game needing some serious police planning, but none of it means that all Maccabi fans should be banned or that normal Jewish Israeli fans shouldn't feel safe in Birmingham, which we have been told recently is a safe and welcoming city.

Overturn the ban. Let the fans attend. Plan the event to keep people safe, which we do for dozens of games every weekend, and don't let the racists or bigots win.

Football can bring us together. It should be given a chance to do so.

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We are the world, we are the children...........

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

We are the world, we are the children...........

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I'm not

It's a funny old world.

80 year old Enid from Chalfont Saint Peter is arrested for wearing a Palestine Action pin badge and deemed a supporter of terrorism, nobody monds Enid as she's a harmless old bint expressing her right to free speech.

30 year old Avi from Haifa, travels to the UK, on arrival can chant 'death to the Arabs' 'Rape Arab Women' and glorify a genocide and get's a free pass to do it even though it's probably going to end up in a massive kerfuffle.

James Wales nuance radar thinks this is quite correct and Enid should be hanged, drawn and quartered whilst Avi is given the George Cross.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

We are the world, we are the children...........

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JW is a closet hippy! Wow, what a revelation.

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Originally Posted by Coyote

Most football fans don't come from a nation that has been allowed to get away with genocide in recent history, or chant pro-genocide slogans.

If you'd like to see football fans get injured in mass, preventable violence, please feel free to advocate for the unapologetically genocidal. I'm sure future generations won't look upon you badly for this, surely not. Life without a conscience or inner dialogue must be interesting, if nothing else.

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So you want to ban football fans (some won't be angels of course) because they come from a nation whose politics and policies you disagree with?

If the police do their jobs there won't be much issue.

If we are talking of there being people from the local area wanting to engage violently with the Israeli fans because they are Israeli then it seems likely that's an issue with the population of that area and maybe villa shouldnt be allowed in European competition. Just as silly a suggestion.

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Originally Posted by Jordi Culé

It's a funny old world.

80 year old Enid from Chalfont Saint Peter is arrested for wearing a Palestine Action pin badge and deemed a supporter of terrorism, nobody monds Enid as she's a harmless old bint expressing her right to free speech.

30 year old Avi from Haifa, travels to the UK, on arrival can chant 'death to the Arabs' 'Rape Arab Women' and glorify a genocide and get's a free pass to do it even though it's probably going to end up in a massive kerfuffle.

James Wales nuance radar thinks this is quite correct and Enid should be hanged, drawn and quartered whilst Avi is given the George Cross.

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When you have to make things up to prove a point, it does undermine your argument.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

We are the world, we are the children...........

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Absolutely!

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

When you have to make things up to prove a point, it does undermine your argument.

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And completely ignores some of the vile abuse peaceful Jewish people in this country have experienced in the last couple of years.

Some of the pro Palestine protestors are deeply unhinged people. But that's all good as the BBC rarely covers anything like that.

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Originally Posted by Rjk

I'm not

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I bet your XG says differently.

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Originally Posted by Jordi Culé

It's a funny old world.

80 year old Enid from Chalfont Saint Peter is arrested for wearing a Palestine Action pin badge and deemed a supporter of terrorism, nobody monds Enid as she's a harmless old bint expressing her right to free speech.

30 year old Avi from Haifa, travels to the UK, on arrival can chant 'death to the Arabs' 'Rape Arab Women' and glorify a genocide and get's a free pass to do it even though it's probably going to end up in a massive kerfuffle.

James Wales nuance radar thinks this is quite correct and Enid should be hanged, drawn and quartered whilst Avi is given the George Cross.

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It's all about balance....

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

It's all about balance....

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And Israeli citizens are all angels..."somewhere over the rainbow"

I support the ban, not to punish the average Israeli football fan, but to undermine the Israeli Govt.

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Originally Posted by Trigger

If we are talking of there being people from the local area wanting to engage violently with the Israeli fans because they are Israeli then it seems likely that's an issue with the population of that area and maybe villa shouldnt be allowed in European competition. Just as silly a suggestion.

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Can you see the irony here?

The footballing authorities didn't give Tel Aviv fans a ban due to their single behaviour. This is Birmingham's local authorities, it was based on "

ive people were taken to hospital as riots broke out in several areas of the Dutch capital.

Amsterdam police and prosecutors said "antisemitic" rioters "actively sought out" Israeli supporters to attack and assault them. Footage emerged online which showed fans pulling down a Palestinian flag in central Amsterdam and anti-Arab chants could be heard.

A report from the Amsterdam mayor's office said the violence stemmed from a "toxic combination of antisemitism, hooliganism and anger" about the war between Israel and Gaza and other conflicts in the Middle East.

Maccabi Tel Aviv's next European 'away' game, against Besiktas on November 28, was moved to Debrecen in Hungary by UEFA after Turkish authorities decided not to stage it in Turkey. Hungarian authorities decided to play the game behind closed doors.[/I]

https://www.skysports.com/football/n...tions-answered

If the authorities are worried about potential violence, should the game not be played behind closed doors or moved?

Let's be honest, it would be much cheaper to ban all away fans for all games. They should "bubble" the game from Tel Aviv if they are that concerned.

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Originally Posted by llan bluebird

The footballing authorities didn't give Tel Aviv fans a ban due to their single behaviour. This is Birmingham's local authorities, it was based on "

ive people were taken to hospital as riots broke out in several areas of the Dutch capital.

Amsterdam police and prosecutors said "antisemitic" rioters "actively sought out" Israeli supporters to attack and assault them. Footage emerged online which showed fans pulling down a Palestinian flag in central Amsterdam and anti-Arab chants could be heard.

A report from the Amsterdam mayor's office said the violence stemmed from a "toxic combination of antisemitism, hooliganism and anger" about the war between Israel and Gaza and other conflicts in the Middle East.

Maccabi Tel Aviv's next European 'away' game, against Besiktas on November 28, was moved to Debrecen in Hungary by UEFA after Turkish authorities decided not to stage it in Turkey. Hungarian authorities decided to play the game behind closed doors.[/I]

https://www.skysports.com/football/n...tions-answered

If the authorities are worried about potential violence, should the game not be played behind closed doors or moved?

Let's be honest, it would be much cheaper to ban all away fans for all games. They should "bubble" the game from Tel Aviv if they are that concerned.

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As in all walks of life, it’s easier for the authorities to punish the majority for the sins of the minority.

Maccabi fans in action in Greece against Olympiakos

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ZqHSdAxPD7k

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Originally Posted by Jeff Mansfield

Maccabi fans in action in Greece against Olympiakos

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ZqHSdAxPD7k

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Enough said! Does Keir Starmer really want blood on his hands in Birmingham? He'd be well advised to keep his nose out of this

Undoubtedly, its a high-profile game, bubble it from Tel Aviv to BHX and coach them to and from, so the hangers on don't join in, make it more expensive and kill the issue.
The local SAG is making a political point. Are Tel Aviv fans worse than Napoli or Balkan fans?

I don't think Israel should be in European competitions; it amplifies "their special" global status, but unilaterally banning certain clubs outright is the wrong way to go, or if you can't guarantee supporters' safety, play it behind closed doors.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

Enough said! Does Keir Starmer really want blood on his hands in Birmingham? He'd be well advised to keep his nose out of this

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Why is everyone dodging the elephant in the room? There are areas of Birmingham which are unsafe to anyone who is not a Muslim not just Israelli football fans although I am sure there as some who are still in denial

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Originally Posted by NinianKnight

Why is everyone dodging the elephant in the room? There are areas of Birmingham which are unsafe to anyone who is not a Muslim not just Israelli football fans although I am sure there as some who are still in denial

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Because there is no elephant in the room. We are talking about foreign fans invading here and behaving violently. The areas of Birmingham you talk about are populated by British people and yes the areas may well be dangerous but that's irrelevant to this discussion.

However, one thing's for sure, if these Israelis get the green light by our supine Government then they will get a rude awakening if they cause trouble in the areas you refer to. Maybe it would be a worthwhile lesson for them.

FWIW Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have a dreadful record for racism and violence, going as far as to racially abuse their own Arab and Black players.

They caused mayhem in Amsterdam, burning Palestine flags, attacking taxis and shouting racist abuse. Then they got the big old victim card out when they got a deserved kicking after the match.

If that had been British fans indulging in that sort of behaviour they'd have been banned and nobody would have said a word about it but because their Israeli, attempting to stop their violence , just like peacefully protesting about a genocide is 'Anti Semitic",

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Originally Posted by Cardiff Ultra

FWIW Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have a dreadful record for racism and violence, going as far as to racially abuse their own Arab and Black players.

They caused mayhem in Amsterdam, burning Palestine flags, attacking taxis and shouting racist abuse. Then they got the big old victim card out when they got a deserved kicking after the match.

If that had been British fans indulging in that sort of behaviour they'd have been banned and nobody would have said a word about it but because their Israeli, attempting to stop their violence , just like peacefully protesting about a genocide is 'Anti Semitic",

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Nail on the head.

Few people including JamesWales had a nightmare in this thread

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Originally Posted by jon1959

Of course it will be reversed, but wrongly so.

Maccabi Tel Aviv initiated the trouble in Amsterdam - chants of 'Death to Arabs', tearing down Palestinian flags, vandalising homes and taxis (brown drivers!) and chanting for the IDF (many of them were reservists) during a genocide.

The reaction spilled over into violent ambushes, and some of the social media posts organising the response were certainly anti Semitic. But the Amsterdam and state politicians (but not the police) framed the whole thing as an anti Semitic incident - and echoed every warped and 'we are the victims' statement from the Israeli government.

Now Starmer, Badenoch, Davey and co are doing the same as the Dutch politicians. No recognition that Maccabi Tel Aviv have a history of racist thugs in their following and no recognition that protests are likely to be more about the Israeli genocide, and will certainly (if they are allowed to happen) include a large number of British Jews who oppose Israeli actions and words.

This is part of a deliberate and continuing strategy to demonise the opponents of genocide, to turn every anti Israel protest into yet another false allegation of anti Semitism, and to 'normalise' relations with Israel asap. Now there is an almost (but not complete) ceasefire and the IDF are now only occupying 55% of Gaza - and still blocking aid - this is the chance to introduce a reset and demonstrate state amnesia again.

There is always the chance that the decision on banning Maccabi fans was a fully informed and reasonable one - but the better option would have been for UEFA, FIFA and the Eurovision Warbling Contest to throw Israel out as they did Russia. Of course that would have required consistency and integrity - so was always going to be ignored or the decision deferred.

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There is no doubt that Chelsea have their share of racists in their following. There was absolutely no doubt that we had our share of hooligans in our following in the 70’s and 80’s. Etc etc.
Where the issue lies imo and has done for as long as I can remember, is the authorities take the easiest and laziest decision, by punishing the majority.
There will no doubt be Macabi fans who just want to attend the Villa game and support their team.
The racists and trouble makers of all teams, should be identified and banned from every ground on the planet. An even easier task these days with all the security and CCTV.

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Originally Posted by NinianKnight

Why is everyone dodging the elephant in the room? There are areas of Birmingham which are unsafe to anyone who is not a Muslim not just Israelli football fans although I am sure there as some who are still in denial

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Which areas and how do you know?

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Originally Posted by delmbox

Which areas and how do you know?

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Farridge told him!

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Originally Posted by delmbox

Which areas and how do you know?

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Handsworth for me. It is not the type of area I would wander around after dark, that's for sure

[QUOTE=splott parker;5618549]Farridge told him![/QUOTE
Who’s Farridge?
By the way. It was a Tory MP who came out with that shite.

[QUOTE=William Treseder;5618554]

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Originally Posted by splott parker

Farridge told him![/QUOTE
Who’s Farridge?
By the way. It was a Tory MP who came out with that shite.

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I thought it was this clown https://www.theguardian.com/media/20...ingham-muslims but I think there might have been a few at this particular circus

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Originally Posted by Cardiff Ultra

FWIW Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have a dreadful record for racism and violence, going as far as to racially abuse their own Arab and Black players.

They caused mayhem in Amsterdam, burning Palestine flags, attacking taxis and shouting racist abuse. Then they got the big old victim card out when they got a deserved kicking after the match.

If that had been British fans indulging in that sort of behaviour they'd have been banned and nobody would have said a word about it but because their Israeli, attempting to stop their violence , just like peacefully protesting about a genocide is 'Anti Semitic",

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Apparently, they're not even the worst team in Israel for it. That "distinction" goes to Beitar Jerusalem. Makes Millwall and Rangers look like fun for all the family.

I wonder what the reaction would be If the Tel Aviv fans had to get here by hiding inside lorries and then boarding small boats

[QUOTE=William Treseder;5618554]

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Originally Posted by splott parker

Farridge told him![/QUOTE
Who’s Farridge?
By the way. It was a Tory MP who came out with that shite.

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I use James O’Brien’s pronunciation, sounds better:thumbup:

Nothing to see here, the little darlings.

https://news.sky.com/story/tel-aviv-...ested-13453239

The Israeli police are obviously antisemetic.

Considering the coverage the Aston Villa ban has been given, the news this evening about the abandonment of the Tel Aviv derby game should be headline news on the BBC’s news and sports pages. So far the story hasn’t appeared on either. No surprise there.

I don’t usually buy into the criticism of the BBC, but the bias of their coverage in recent months has been ****ing disgraceful.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

Considering the coverage the Aston Villa ban has been given, the news this evening about the abandonment of the Tel Aviv derby game should be headline news on the BBC’s news and sports pages. So far the story hasn’t appeared on either. No surprise there.

I don’t usually buy into the criticism of the BBC, but the bias of their coverage in recent months has been ****ing disgraceful.

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I respected them for joining Reuters and AP News to condemn attacks against journalists, but they seem to have gotten cold feet. There's absolutely a pressure campaign being sent their way.

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Originally Posted by Coyote

I respected them for joining Reuters and AP News to condemn attacks against journalists, but they seem to have gotten cold feet. There's absolutely a pressure campaign being sent their way.

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You can imagine the pressure they're under from the Government who will cut their funding if they don't toe the line.

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Originally Posted by ninian opinian

Nothing to see here, the little darlings.

https://news.sky.com/story/tel-aviv-...ested-13453239

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Keir b****y Starmer and his underlings should have their arses glued to seats and their eyes taped open wide so that they watch that match report very carefully.

From the never reported British Jews who support the ban - and demonstrate against genocide in Palestine:

https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org...cles-for-you_1

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

You can imagine the pressure they're under from the Government who will cut their funding if they don't toe the line.

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And we know the government are under pressure from donors and the ultra-capitalist class.

Meanwhile:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football...s/cgr4n07509wo