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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hilts
🤣
It's Larry Grayson having a meltdown
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Making light of political violence. Can you point to a more extreme position?
Imagine if someone took a shot at Hilary Clinton and killed a bystander and then people were making light of it online. Would you think they were good people?
More hyperbole.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Along with a healthy dose of whataboutism.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jordi Culé
You're always on good form when you act all hysterical and concerned about other individuals lack of political morals or viewpoints. It's touching that you care.
Staying on track.
The attempt on Trump as you've pointed out is as serious as Jo Cox, David Amiss, Pelosi husband (who was obviously he was shagging a bloke according to some) and Capitol Hill. They're all attacks on political democratic values.
My observation have been concerned with Trumps uncaring attitude when the victim has been a political opponent and the lack of outrage by some on here when comparing other politically motivated attacks to Donny getting his ear pierced. To my untrained eye there's a lack of consistency in calling out wrongdoings. I'll happily be put right on this.
On a personal note, it's not surprising he's been the victim of an attempt on his life really. Do I care? Not really.
Top post! That's a +1 from me. :thumbup:
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
More hyperbole.
It literally is the exact same scenario as has happened.
What if you Bob. What do you make of the assassination attempt?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
You really are a sanctimonious hypocrite aren't you!
I didn't instantly refer to Israel/Gaza, I commented on a post by someone else that highlighted Israel Katz's hypocrisy about political violence. Hypocrisy shared by so many Trump fans on social media!
I admit to making light of the situation by posting a joke image of Trump as Vincent. Luckily I held back my killer line about the War Of Jenkins' Ear! If I had realised you were so sensitive about the comic misuse of post impressionist icons i would have thought twice - before still posting it!
I'm still waiting to hear (ha!) why you think I want to see an American civil war just because I haven't 'condemned' (was that the word you used?) the attack on Trump. That is seriously weird on so many levels. You are on a wind up aren't you?
No, there was an attempted murder, you made a joke about it and then instantly linked to the war in Gaza that has nothing to do with it.
The only correct thing to do is to condemn it. It doesn't matter if you don't like his politics. Other people don't like politicians you like. Doesn't mean trying to kill Jeremy Corbyn is okay.
It's not hard.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
No, there was an attempted murder, you made a joke about it and then instantly linked to the war in Gaza that has nothing to do with it.
The only correct thing to do is to condemn it. It doesn't matter if you don't like his politics. Other people don't like politicians you like. Doesn't mean trying to kill Jeremy Corbyn is okay.
It's not hard.
I suspect that some would have more sympathy with your self proclaimed sense of balance if we saw some evidence of it. This morning LoM posted a hideous attempt at a joke around Biden's mental faculties that was rightly called out and then removed by the mods without a pipsqueak of protest from you about its inappropriateness.
Yet when Jon puts up a Van Gogh meme it is an assault on decency. Similarly someone referencing Trump's role in the assualt on Capitol Hill where people died is whattaboutism before you offer some crude whatabouts around Hilary Clinton and Jeremy Corbyn without a sniff of irony.
For what it is worth I think Trump is a hideous individual whose persona and politics divide and repel. I absolutely want him and his credo to be roundly defeated and repudiated at the ballot box. It is not for some triggered halfwit of whatever political orientation to think that they have the right to shortcut that process just because you think he's a dangerous twat.
You are right to point out that innocent people were killed and injured in that assassination attempt, but you are not unique in thinking that was an abomination.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
I suspect that some would have more sympathy with your self proclaimed sense of balance if we saw some evidence of it. This morning LoM posted a hideous attempt at a joke around Biden's mental faculties that was rightly called out and then removed by the mods without a pipsqueak of protest from you about its inappropriateness.
Yet when Jon puts up a Van Gogh meme it is an assault on decency. Similarly someone referencing Trump's role in the assualt on Capitol Hill where people died is whattaboutism before you offer some crude whatabouts around Hilary Clinton and Jeremy Corbyn without a sniff of irony.
For what it is worth I think Trump is a hideous individual whose persona and politics divide and repel. I absolutely want him and his credo to be roundly defeated and repudiated at the ballot box. It is not for some triggered halfwit of whatever political orientation to think that they have the right to shortcut that process just because you think he's a dangerous twat.
You are right to point out that innocent people were killed and injured in that assassination attempt, but you are not unique in thinking that was an abomination.
Top post.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
I suspect that some would have more sympathy with your self proclaimed sense of balance if we saw some evidence of it. This morning LoM posted a hideous attempt at a joke around Biden's mental faculties that was rightly called out and then removed by the mods without a pipsqueak of protest from you about its inappropriateness.
Yet when Jon puts up a Van Gogh meme it is an assault on decency. Similarly someone referencing Trump's role in the assualt on Capitol Hill where people died is whattaboutism before you offer some crude whatabouts around Hilary Clinton and Jeremy Corbyn without a sniff of irony.
For what it is worth I think Trump is a hideous individual whose persona and politics divide and repel. I absolutely want him and his credo to be roundly defeated and repudiated at the ballot box. It is not for some triggered halfwit of whatever political orientation to think that they have the right to shortcut that process just because you think he's a dangerous twat.
You are right to point out that innocent people were killed and injured in that assassination attempt, but you are not unique in thinking that was an abomination.
I don't think I am unique in saying it was an abomination. Others are saying it too.
I didnt see LOM's post Im sorry, but I would gladly criticise it if you explain what it was. Whether it was worse than Jon making light of a guy being shot (and another killed) I don't know. Are you saying jons post should be removed too?
I didnt do "whataboutery*. I didn't compare it to an entirely different situation, I compared it to the exact same scenario by with different characters.
As you say. It's an abomination. You don't fkn well try to kill people because you don't like their politics. That quite literally is as extreme an opinion as you get and I have zero tolerance for anyone flirting with that.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
It was up for a significant amout of time in the Trump thread on the main board you have contributed to but the gist of it was that if someone took out Biden with a headshot he wouldn't feel a thing as he is more or less brain dead already. Where you place that in your heirarchy of abominations is not clear but in mine it sits way above a parody meme of Trump as Van Gogh.
You are of course free to report any post to the moderators. I don't know if in this instance someone did that or that the mods thought it was so ill judged that they decided to remove the thread themselves!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
No, there was an attempted murder, you made a joke about it and then instantly linked to the war in Gaza that has nothing to do with it.
The only correct thing to do is to condemn it. It doesn't matter if you don't like his politics. Other people don't like politicians you like. Doesn't mean trying to kill Jeremy Corbyn is okay.
It's not hard.
On balance I'd have to say I hate Corbyns politics as much as trumps. But I wouldn't laugh or think he deserved it if Corbyn got shot, because he has never directly incited people into political violence.
Trump on the other hand, has on numerous occasions incited or tried to incite political violence. If people think he deserves it/don't care it happened to him on the basis that he has incited it in the past then I think it's an understandable position. May not be to your liking, but a British person thinking trump had it coming is understandable. If they thought the same about Hilary it wouldn't really be understandable, because Hilary doesn't have a track record of whipping this kind of nonsense up.
Trump and a section of his supporters have taken politics and democracy into some really dark places in the US. We don't know for sure that has contributed to the shooting, but it certainly can't be ruled out.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
It was up for a significant amout of time in the Trump thread on the main board you have contributed to but the gist of it was that if someone took out Biden with a headshot he wouldn't feel a thing as he is more or less brain dead already. Where you place that in your heirarchy of abominations is not clear but in mine it sits way above a parody meme of Trump as Van Gogh.
You are of course free to report any post to the moderators. I don't know if in this instance someone did that or that the mods thought it was so ill judged that they decided to remove the thread themselves!
Yes, completely inappropriate although bear in mind it was not said after a literal shot on Bidens head, whereas others were said after someone tried to kill Trump, so not exactly the same in that context.
But yes, not appropriate at all.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
No, there was an attempted murder, you made a joke about it and then instantly linked to the war in Gaza that has nothing to do with it.
The only correct thing to do is to condemn it. It doesn't matter if you don't like his politics. Other people don't like politicians you like. Doesn't mean trying to kill Jeremy Corbyn is okay.
It's not hard.
I am looking forward to you 'condemning' the thousands of incidents of political violence in the past few weeks against people for whom you do not have deep sympathy. Two faced does not do it justice!
I haven't commented on the attempted assassination of Trump (other than the van G meme - which is very funny - and a better image than the one Trump will be feeding on for the next 6 months!). But if a Cardiff City supporters message board is that important I am happy to add my voice to those who are opposed to the actions of Thomas Matthew Crooks.
Got to admit though - there are other attempted (and actual) murders in the past few days that affect me more - not in the USA - even if the international political impact will be less. I have noted your lack of condemnation in those cases!
Your repeated reference to Gaza (via Israel Katz' social media posts) continues to be revealing. I didn't make the link. I commented on the link. You have nothing to say about the hypocrisy that was exposed in the original post. I suppose hypocrites stick together?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I don't think I am unique in saying it was an abomination. Others are saying it too.
I didnt see LOM's post Im sorry, but I would gladly criticise it if you explain what it was. Whether it was worse than Jon making light of a guy being shot (and another killed) I don't know. Are you saying jons post should be removed too?
I didnt do "whataboutery*. I didn't compare it to an entirely different situation, I compared it to the exact same scenario by with different characters.
As you say. It's an abomination. You don't fkn well try to kill people because you don't like their politics. That quite literally is as extreme an opinion as you get and I have zero tolerance for anyone flirting with that.
You did do whataboutery and you know it.
We appear to come at an issue like this from opposite points of view, I see an attempted assassination of a politician I profoundly disagree with, an odious man who has used racist language in the past, who has mocked the disabled and seems to target minorities as as a matter of course, and take it as read that 99 per cent of people, at least, condemn it, no matter what Trump’s shortcomings are.
On the other hand, it would appear that you think that any one who doesn’t condemn the attempted assassination is implicitly condoning it. I’ve got to ask you which attitude out of the two is the more reasonable and realistic?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Yes, completely inappropriate although bear in mind it was not said after a literal shot on Bidens head, whereas others were said after someone tried to kill Trump, so not exactly the same in that context.
But yes, not appropriate at all.
Thanks for that well honed balance again.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
I even wonder if it was Melania who hired the shooter!
She’s come out to appeal for calm and restraint. She’d better start with her own husband. Greet speech by the Governor today, setting a good example. It will be very interesting how Trump conducts himself from here. A bit of a shock that gunmen can turn on him no doubt.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
You did do whataboutery and you know it.
We appear to come at an issue like this from opposite points of view, I see an attempted assassination of a politician I profoundly disagree with, an odious man who has used racist language in the past, who has mocked the disabled and seems to target minorities as as a matter of course, and take it as read that 99 per cent of people, at least, condemn it, no matter what Trump’s shortcomings are.
On the other hand, it would appear that you think that any one who doesn’t condemn the attempted assassination is implicitly condoning it. I’ve got to ask you which attitude out of the two is the more reasonable and realistic?
I've not said that. I'm saying it should be condemned. Others make light of it or pass it off or justify it.
It is completely unacceptable to try to murder someone. It's as simple as that. Its not how politics should be done.
By definition we all have different opinions on politicians. Some that you may support will also have done things that you accuse Trump of, but in no way should anyone entertain that as being a legitimate means of expression. It isnt.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
Thanks for that well honed balance again.
You are welcome.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
You are welcome.
So to set the record straight you condemn assassination attempts on political figures therefore I take it you condemn the same attacks on people like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot etc etc.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I've not said that. I'm saying it should be condemned. Others make light of it or pass it off or justify it.
It is completely unacceptable to try to murder someone. It's as simple as that. Its not how politics should be done.
By definition we all have different opinions on politicians. Some that you may support will also have done things that you accuse Trump of, but in no way should anyone entertain that as being a legitimate means of expression. It isnt.
You don’t seem to realise what you’re saying - you really do appear to believe that you’re a voice of reason on here when, increasingly, you’re nothing of the sort, you’ve become shrill and deliberately argumentative.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
To return to the main event, I'm sure this will guarantee Trump the presidency later this year.
It will pump up his base. It will feed all his deranged conspiracy theories. It will ensure Biden isn't deposed by the Democrats and will go on to an epic fail in the final debates and vote. It will ensure the Democrats are divided and demotivated.
It will also ensure more $$$ flows into the Trump campaign - not only through the sale of mugs and tee shirts (maybe sales to mugs!)
I'm sure this was just about a lone wolf and a massive security failure - not a Democrat conspiracy, and not a Republican conspiracy - even though Trump will gain.
The end result will be much more dangerous and damaging than a supporter killed, two more injured and a pierced ear under the wig!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
To return to the main event, I'm sure this will guarantee Trump the presidency later this year.
It will pump up his base. It will feed all his deranged conspiracy theories. It will ensure Biden isn't deposed by the Democrats and will go on to an epic fail in the final debates and vote. It will ensure the Democrats are divided and demotivated.
It will also ensure more $$$ flows into the Trump campaign - not only through the sale of mugs and tee shirts (maybe sales to mugs!)
I'm sure this was just about a lone wolf and a massive security failure - not a Democrat conspiracy, and not a Republican conspiracy - even though Trump will gain.
The end result will be much more dangerous and damaging than a supporter killed, two more injured and a pierced ear under the wig!
I'm sure it couldn't possibly be the case but one could imagine what a political masterstroke this would be had it been planned by certain people close to the Republican party.
Yes this now guarantees Trump the presidency though one would have thought it had been handed to him on a plate by Biden himself.
I see over 2000 t-shirts of the fist pumping Trump after the incident have already been sold and more are in urgent demand. Expect to see many of these being worn in the coming months.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
To return to the main event, I'm sure this will guarantee Trump the presidency later this year.
It will pump up his base. It will feed all his deranged conspiracy theories. It will ensure Biden isn't deposed by the Democrats and will go on to an epic fail in the final debates and vote. It will ensure the Democrats are divided and demotivated.
It will also ensure more $$$ flows into the Trump campaign - not only through the sale of mugs and tee shirts (maybe sales to mugs!)
I'm sure this was just about a lone wolf and a massive security failure - not a Democrat conspiracy, and not a Republican conspiracy - even though Trump will gain.
The end result will be much more dangerous and damaging than a supporter killed, two more injured and a pierced ear under the wig!
Do you know why he had his shoes off?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Do you know why he had his shoes off?
Bunions?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Do you know why he had his shoes off?
:hehe: No - tell me please?
Was it that he knew what was coming and (like escaping an aircraft) he wanted to hit the deck as easily as possible?
Or was it that he had converted to Islam and planned to throw his shoes at a big photo of Joe Biden?
The world needs to know!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
:hehe: No - tell me please?
Was it that he knew what was coming and (like escaping an aircraft) he wanted to hit the deck as easily as possible?
Or was it that he had converted to Islam and planned to throw his shoes at a big photo of Joe Biden?
The world needs to know!
I've no idea, it just seemed a bit random given the sequence of events.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Do you know why he had his shoes off?
Bone spurs apparently, they also helped Trump dodge bullets in Vietnam.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jordi Culé
Bone spurs apparently, they also helped Trump dodge bullets in Vietnam.
And dodge going there
https://www.businessinsider.com/dona...am-war-2018-12
I am proud to be an American !
At least I know I am free ( to dodge the draft)
That song is 🤯
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Come on you Spurs!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jordi Culé
Bone spurs apparently, they also helped Trump dodge bullets in Vietnam.
Now, now :hehe:
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Melania speaking sense, puts some politicians to shame.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
You don’t seem to realise what you’re saying - you really do appear to believe that you’re a voice of reason on here when, increasingly, you’re nothing of the sort, you’ve become shrill and deliberately argumentative.
I agree entirely with Keir Starmer:
“I am appalled by the shocking scenes at President Trump’s rally and we send him and his family our best wishes.
“Political violence in any form has no place in our societies and my thoughts are with all the victims of this attack.”
https://www.gbnews.com/politics/keir...g-donald-trump
My moral code doesn't take into account whether someone has my political views or not. Trying to murder someone (and killing someone else in the process) is wrong every single time
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I agree entirely with Keir Starmer:
“I am appalled by the shocking scenes at President Trump’s rally and we send him and his family our best wishes.
“Political violence in any form has no place in our societies and my thoughts are with all the victims of this attack.”
https://www.gbnews.com/politics/keir...g-donald-trump
My moral code doesn't take into account whether someone has my political views or not. Trying to murder someone (and killing someone else in the process) is wrong every single time
Most sane people agree with Starmer. It will be interesting to follow your moral code, particularly when it comes to people with a different political persuasion though!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
Most sane people agree with Starmer. It will be interesting to follow your moral code, particularly when it comes to people with a different political persuasion though!
Please do hold me to account on that Cyril. I look forward to it.
If someone tries to shoot a politician and kills a member of the public again you will see me condemn it entirely.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Please do hold me to account on that Cyril. I look forward to it.
If someone tries to shoot a politician and kills a member of the public again you will see me condemn it entirely.
Oh, I missed the shooting a politician and a member of the public caveat, I thought it was a statement for life!
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
You should read what Starmer really thinks on the Arsenal message board. Forget the sterile press releases. We all know it's places like this that are the cutting edge of political discourse.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
Oh, I missed the shooting a politician and a member of the public caveat, I thought it was a statement for life!
I guess it's easier when you can spout off about theoretical things but maybe you missed the point that that is what has as actually happened and that's what we are talking about?
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I guess it's easier when you can spout off about theoretical things but maybe you missed the point that that is what has as actually happened and that's what we are talking about?
My moral code doesn't take into account whether someone has my political views or not.
Sorry missed the nuances in this.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
My moral code doesn't take into account whether someone has my political views or not.
Sorry missed the nuances in this.
There is no nuance on that, that's why.
Some things are black and white. Like trying to kill someone and actually killing someone else. That's bad.
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Re: The Donald Trump thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
There is no nuance on that, that's why.
Some things are black and white. Like trying to kill someone and actually killing someone else. That's bad.
The strange thing is in the set of circumstances you seem to want to make a stand on I don't think many, if any, disagree with you.
The nuance bit was that you bring that stark stated train of thought about your moral code to every exchange on here. We all know that's pants, but if you want to believe it then I guess what's the harm until your self delusion gets exposed the next time you go off on one!
