Brexit ( should I say or should I go )

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Originally Posted by Nelsonca61

Yes I do think for myself.
1. Great Britain had a Coal Mining industry before the EU (we are still importing coal)
2. Great Britain had a Steel Industry before the EU (we will continue to import steel)
3. Great Britain had a British car industry before the EU
4. Great Britain had a Ship Building industry before the EU
5. Thick Welders like myself could afford to get on the housing ladder before the EU
6. Water, Gas, Rail, Electric were owned by British companies
7. British Nuclear power was owned and controlled by British companies
8. The bankers did not get bailed out before the EU
9. The Gold reserves were not sold off to Pound land before the EU
10. The privatisation of anything that wasn't nailed down didn't start until after joining the EU
11. The distribution of wealth, always obscenely biased, has gone of the scale
12. Youth unemployment is now, and has been for some time following the euro model, where is their future after 40 years of Brussels ?
13. Trade with Europe was plentiful
14. Trade with other parts of the world not subjected to a Brussels rule

During this period of British erosion we are judged to be the best performing economy within the EU, does it not make you wonder how bad it is for many in the other countries of the EU Superstate?

During this period I have been through Labour and Tory governments who both have sat back and allowed
Brussels to suck cash, veto laws, introduce their laws and whilst you casually side line it all against
Tory and labour Governments, there is a common denominator and that is Brussels.

I remember the winter of discontent and much of the bad shite, it wasn't a bed of roses, but they were days that
you knocked your neighbours door and if they had 1/2 a bag of sugar and you had none, you were given some.

The EU aided by Tory and Labour governments have changed peoples mindsets into a more more more society,
2nd holiday, 2nd car, Joe Bloggs owning 5 houses to rent, debt is good, have to be a shareholder, etc. etc.

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You forget that we were the,'sick man of Europe' before we joined the Common Market. The EU haters conveniently forget this.
The one positive is that finally organisations as diverse as the Midwife's Association through to the NFU are extolling the benefits of the EU.
I dread the thought of the raving right wingers getting their way come Refefendum Day.

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Originally Posted by CCFC_Urawa_Reds

The pro-EU propaganda is almost criminal. However, which way to vote? I believe an OUT vote will be better for The UK as a whole .. but an IN vote may be better for Wales.

If we do vote OUT .. at least we will be able to deport foreign criminals and radical hate preachers who are wasting tax payers' money.
Oh ... and we can tell The EU's "human rights" bill (which seem to protect criminals more than victims) to f right off !

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Good. I'm glad you find the EU in propaganda almost criminal. About time the propaganda was the other way around after having to tolerate years of the right wing press and Farage slagging off the EU with their lies and distortion.

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Originally Posted by Pearcey3

You forget that we were the,'sick man of Europe' before we joined the Common Market. The EU haters conveniently forget this.
The one positive is that finally organisations as diverse as the Midwife's Association through to the NFU are extolling the benefits of the EU.
I dread the thought of the raving right wingers getting their way come Refefendum Day.

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I didn't forget at all fella, I remember the bad times, for me an out vote is the best option of the two evils.
The day I started my apprenticeship, The AUEW were on a 3 day week, I'll never forget that, it was my 1st introduction
into unionised workshops, incidentally and after a 30 year absence, and vowing never ever to again join after being subjected
to their bully boy tactics as a 21 year old, I joined a union in October last year.

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Originally Posted by Nelsonca61

I didn't forget at all fella, I remember the bad times, for me an out vote is the best option of the two evils.
The day I started my apprenticeship, The AUEW were on a 3 day week, I'll never forget that, it was my 1st introduction
into unionised workshops, incidentally and after a 30 year absence, and vowing never ever to again join after being subjected
to their bully boy tactics as a 21 year old, I joined a union in October last year.

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Have we moved onto a different topic?

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Originally Posted by Nelsonca61

I didn't forget at all fella, I remember the bad times, for me an out vote is the best option of the two evils.
The day I started my apprenticeship, The AUEW were on a 3 day week, I'll never forget that, it was my 1st introduction
into unionised workshops, incidentally and after a 30 year absence, and vowing never ever to again join after being subjected
to their bully boy tactics as a 21 year old, I joined a union in October last year.

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OK. You chose not to mention it in your long list of how good things used to be at a time when we were being bailed out by the IMF, having previously devalued the pound, with inflation and unemployment at higher levels than now abd with three day weeks,power cuts etc etc.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Have we moved onto a different topic?

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have we ?

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

I agree with much of what you say (yes it surprised me too), to make it work it would inevitably pass more powers to the EU which I don't think is a good thing.
I agree with many of the points on this list of ten but the most important one for me is reguarding democracy, any laws or decision making need to be made in this country for this country, without that I don't think we have any chance of doing what's in our best interests.
http://www.nakedpolitics.co.uk/home/...d-leave-the-eu

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So which Laws passed by Brussels have had an adverse affect on the life Mrs SR?

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Originally Posted by Pearcey3

OK. You chose not to mention it in your long list of how good things used to be at a time when we were being bailed out by the IMF, having previously devalued the pound, with inflation and unemployment at higher levels than now abd with three day weeks,power cuts etc etc.

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I'm sure I did mention the winter of discontent somewhere in the thread.

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Originally Posted by Nelsonca61

I'm sure I did mention the winter of discontent somewhere in the thread.

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Yeah but that was later though in 78/79.

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

I don't know to be honest, it's not something I have thought about, what do you think?

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is just a question, answers are personal. It's something I've been interested in since the referendum was announced.

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Originally Posted by Pearcey3

Yeah but that was later though in 78/79.

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Ok. you got me on the year for this particular set of strikes. :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Actually, you have demonstrated quite beautifully how little the EU has actually changed things in the UK.

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That's your view of it Eric, I am quite clear what I think, even if you think I have not demonstrated it correctly, this will be a free vote for the people to vote how they want I respect anyone voting they way they wish to go, I will be voting out, for me it's the best option of two bad options.

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Originally Posted by Pearcey3

So which Laws passed by Brussels have had an adverse affect on the life Mrs SR?

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Does my decision have to be based on what's had an adverse affect on my life? I'm not really thinking of my life, I'm thinking of the future of my kids tbh.


(I'm not right wing btw)

[QUOTE=Mrs Steve R;4616682]Does my decision have to be based on what's had an adverse affect on my life? I'm not really thinking of my life, I'm thinking of the future of my kids tbh.


(I'm not right wing btw)

I didn't think you were right wing but it's the obsession with Europe amongst right wing Tories which is why we are having this referendum. I think you will give me that.
What happens if your children want to work in Europe when they grow up?
Most youngsters want to stay in the EU. They are the future.

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Originally Posted by Nelsonca61

That's your view of it Eric, I am quite clear what I think, even if you think I have not demonstrated it correctly, this will be a free vote for the people to vote how they want I respect anyone voting they way they wish to go, I will be voting out, for me it's the best option of two bad options.

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All your reasons have nothing really to do with being in the eu though. Do some actual research before making your decision please.

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Originally Posted by Pearcey3

I didn't think you were right wing but it's the obsession with Europe amongst right wing Tories which is why we are having this referendum. I think you will give me that.
What happens if your children want to work in Europe when they grow up?
Most youngsters want to stay in the EU. They are the future.

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Just wanted to make sure :hehe:

What if they want to work anywhere else in the world? people manage to do it all the time so I don't really see that as an issue.

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

Just wanted to make sure :hehe:

What if they want to work anywhere else in the world? people manage to do it all the time so I don't really see that as an issue.

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It really isn't that easy outside the eu. Ask anyone trying to work in the us or the hassle people go to, to work in austrailia.

The eu it's easy for our graduates to get good experience currently. It's probably the one reason making me want to vote either way.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

All your reasons have nothing really to do with being in the eu though. Do some actual research before making your decision please.

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As you said previously though, the most experienced people can't agree what is for the best, in all honesty it's a guess in most cases. Who can second guess what state Europe will be in in 5/10/15 years time etc.

At least Nelson has given it some thought, whether you agree with those points or not. How many people will just vote along traditional right/left wing patterns.

The problem is, where do you get genuine correct information from? It's difficult to know what is true and what isn't. Both sides are claiming the other are spouting propaganda so who do we believe?

Maybe that's a point but there are some unbiased journals etc that you can read. At the end of the day it just shows how stupid a referendum it is.

If it's really beneficial for us to leave they should make the decision for us, what else are they elected for?

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

Just wanted to make sure :hehe:

What if they want to work anywhere else in the world? people manage to do it all the time so I don't really see that as an issue.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

It really isn't that easy outside the eu. Ask anyone trying to work in the us or the hassle people go to, to work in austrailia.

The eu it's easy for our graduates to get good experience currently. It's probably the one reason making me want to vote either way.

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Yeah it might not be as easy but it's not impossible, what's a bit of hassle if it's really what you want to do? A friend of ours went on a hairdressing course just to get in to Australia, he was the last person you would want to give a pair of scissors to :hehe: he's still there though.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Maybe that's a point but there are some unbiased journals etc that you can read. At the end of the day it just shows how stupid a referendum it is.

If it's really beneficial for us to leave they should make the decision for us, what else are they elected for?

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You say it's stupid but it appears to be quite close to call, so surely that's what democracy is about. I wouldn't call that stupid.

What I call stupid is MPs with political agendas pushing what is best for them instead of the country. Which ever way the vote goes it will be the will of the people so there can be no complaints.

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

Yeah it might not be as easy but it's not impossible, what's a bit of hassle if it's really what you want to do? A friend of ours went on a hairdressing course just to get in to Australia, he was the last person you would want to give a pair of scissors to :hehe: he's still there though.

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I don't think Sweeney Todd had to worry about immigration points. :coat:

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Originally Posted by TruBlue

You say it's stupid but it appears to be quite close to call, so surely that's what democracy is about. I wouldn't call that stupid.

What I call stupid is MPs with political agendas pushing what is best for them instead of the country. Which ever way the vote goes it will be the will of the people so there can be no complaints.

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Why not let the public vote on every decision then?

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Originally Posted by Mrs Steve R

Yeah it might not be as easy but it's not impossible, what's a bit of hassle if it's really what you want to do? A friend of ours went on a hairdressing course just to get in to Australia, he was the last person you would want to give a pair of scissors to :hehe: he's still there though.

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It's a lot more than a bit of hassle, getting a job in the states is more or less impossible if you aren't being sponsored by a British company. I've worked in a few European countries and it's almost as easy as getting a job here. For me that's one thing that's great about the EU.

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Originally Posted by TruBlue

I don't think Sweeney Todd had to worry about immigration points. :coat:

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:hehe:

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Why not let the public vote on every decision then?

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I think we should get more of a say somehow.