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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
Why do you think Momentum are far left and what does that mean? I don't support Momentum btw, but if they're one extreme and the likes of the BNP and Britain First are on the other, I know which organisation is far more peaceful, inclusive and wanting the best for everyone.
Let's also consider that Labour were a centre left party when it romped to a massive majority in 1997. Under Blair it moved more and more right and became unelectable as a result. Labour's move back left resulted in a huge growth in membership and a close showing in the 2017 election despite being given little fair play by a media desperate to keep being allowed to evade taxes.
I said further left. Momentum I've little doubt have some far left involved. Far left, far right are every bit as bad as each other.
Blair didn't lose an election, Brown did. The membership growth isn't that irrelevant, it's voters that matter at end of day - and Labour keep saying "500k" but have refused to give actual figures the last few years.
2017 imo Labour had a perfect storm of "new" Leader promising the earth along with May running one of the worst political campaigns ever... and still failed to win.
It's easy to blame the media and not politicians.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
xsnaggle
Trampie, I never question a person's own political beliefs. The OM thing was more a dig at him as he is a complete conspiracy theorist, but it was only in jest. no offence meant!!
Well, if he was Organ he'd want you to think that.
Trampie, do you use Youtube at all?
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric Cartman
Happy to concede that one after a bit more research, certainly presented in a disingenuous way.
Found this, seems quote was doctored.
https://twitter.com/notcalledjohn/st...120192/photo/1
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
Organ would say that - you're an egger? Oh dear...
Thatcher was when? Society moves on, Organ / Trampie. Since Major, elections have been won and lost by the center. Labour lurched left under Corbyn, abandoned the center ground and lost as a result.
There is no point in Labour winning a UK General Election if they are not on the left as people would be voting for a brand and not for left wing policies, totally pointless.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
Well, if he was Organ he'd want you to think that.
Trampie, do you use Youtube at all?
I'm aware of it but I don't use it.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dandywarhol
The 2017 election campaign was undermined by the right wing.
Labour came close but not close enough to winning.
Just imagine NHS funding would have been boosted significantly.
Labour might well have listen to the warnings in 2017 about a world wide pandemic coming,and that we were not prepared.
NHS would have had the right equipment that had been stored in warehouses.
If only Heineken done elections.
Get brexit done.**** everything esle.
Have a read and a listen to this.
The western world has been preoccupied by greed and profit,
The wise man built his house on rock.The foolish man built his on sand.https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/geor...ry?id=69979013
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trampie09
There is no point in Labour winning a UK General Election if they are not on the left as people would be voting for a brand and not for left wing policies, totally pointless.
People vote for a brand anyway for the most part!
The batteground is the center. Center-left, center-right. Extremes on both sides only ever appeal to a small demographic.
That was Corbyn's fault, looking to left only and failing to grasp needed to attract votes from Tories, not purely appeal to core base.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trampie09
I'm aware of it but I don't use it.
Present but didn't inhale, huh?
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
People vote for a brand anyway for the most part!
The batteground is the center. Center-left, center-right. Extremes on both sides only ever appeal to a small demographic.
That was Corbyn's fault, looking to left only and failing to grasp needed to attract votes from Tories, not purely appeal to core base.
If you look at the political compass site the Conservative party are off the scale right wing, Plaid are very close to the centre (slightly left), Labour was off the scale right wing until Corbyn also.
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Re: Labour Report Published
If anyone has an interest in the Data Protection side of this (just me maybe!) Morrisons' recent Supreme Court judgement could be relevant here. In that case a rogue employee ,who had been subject to a disciplinary, leaked online the payroll files of close to 100,000 staff.
Initially the ICO fined them and it was upheld at appeal but just a few weeks ago the Supreme Court overturned both decisions as it decided (probably fairly in the end) that a company cannot be held reasonably responsible for employees going rogue and committing criminal acts.
So in terms of any data protection enforcement it will all depend on if this document was hacked due to poor security or had been released as a deliberate act by someone with a grudge.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trampie09
If you look at the political compass site the Conservative party are off the scale right wing, Plaid are very close to the centre (slightly left), Labour was off the scale right wing until Corbyn also.
What political compass site is that? Isn't that purely a subjective assessment anyway?
Labour off the scale right wing? Are you seriously claiming Labour were akin to NF, BNP et al before Corbyn???
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
What political compass site is that? Isn't that purely a subjective assessment anyway?
Labour off the scale right wing? Are you seriously claiming Labour were akin to NF, BNP et al before Corbyn???
The political compass site, they used to show the parties over the years (not sure if they still do), I remember reading a comment about Labour after somebody seen their position on a graph when they were right wing pre Corbyn where they noted they were almost a facist party, it made me smile but I thought fair enough hard to argue with that, you could barely get a fag paper between Labour and Conservative policies at the time, I used to call Labour red Tories it used to upset some old Labour voters but that is where the Labour party was.
As regards NF/BNP types their policies could be said to be populist just like Trump and Boris parties of today.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Good grief, I'm convinced you genuinely believe what you wrote, Organ / Trampie.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
Good grief, I'm convinced you genuinely believe what you wrote, Organ / Trampie.
I will give you a tip butt, I never lie and have no agenda so it's difficult to trump me in a debate, that is why I always get banned.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trampie09
I will give you a tip butt, I never lie and have no agenda so it's difficult to trump me in a debate, that is why I always get banned.
You're not trumping anyone nor is it a personal thing as you seem to believe....
If you're claiming Labour were right wing pre Corbyn, you're bonkers.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
You're not trumping anyone nor is it a personal thing as you seem to believe....
If you're claiming Labour were right wing pre Corbyn, you're bonkers.
They were right wing, no doubt about it, the political compass site pitched them as right wing, Tony Blair was more of a Tory than Margaret Thatcher was, they did not call them Red Tories for nothing.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
Why do you think Momentum are far left and what does that mean? I don't support Momentum btw, but if they're one extreme and the likes of the BNP and Britain First are on the other, I know which organisation is far more peaceful, inclusive and wanting the best for everyone.
Let's also consider that Labour were a centre left party when it romped to a massive majority in 1997. Under Blair it moved more and more right and became unelectable as a result. Labour's move back left resulted in a huge growth in membership and a close showing in the 2017 election despite being given little fair play by a media desperate to keep being allowed to evade taxes.
:thumbup:
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trampie09
They were right wing, no doubt about it, the political compass site pitched them as right wing, Tony Blair was more of a Tory than Margaret Thatcher was, they did not call them Red Tories for nothing.
So your evidence Labour under Milliband - Milliband ffs - was right wing was a website right?
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
You're not trumping anyone nor is it a personal thing as you seem to believe....
If you're claiming Labour were right wing pre Corbyn, you're bonkers.
I believe this may be what they're referring to: https://www.politicalcompass.org/uk2015
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
Why do you think Momentum are far left and what does that mean? I don't support Momentum btw, but if they're one extreme and the likes of the BNP and Britain First are on the other, I know which organisation is far more peaceful, inclusive and wanting the best for everyone.
Let's also consider that Labour were a centre left party when it romped to a massive majority in 1997. Under Blair it moved more and more right and became unelectable as a result. Labour's move back left resulted in a huge growth in membership and a close showing in the 2017 election despite being given little fair play by a media desperate to keep being allowed to evade taxes.
Top post Eric 👏
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
City123
Bonkers.
Red Ed Milliband, elected by the unions... was on the right...
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
Bonkers.
Red Ed Milliband, elected by the unions... was on the right...
The unions aren't necessarily left wing
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric Cartman
Imagine this will get move to Politics forum.
Interesting intervention from Andy Burnham, who has (since losing to Corbyn in 2015) become probably my favourite politician. Good honest guy who knows his own faults.
https://twitter.com/AndyBurnhamGM/st...24188454076421
Just take that in for a second...
'Always felt like the Party machine opposed my pro-public NHS & social care policies between 2010 & 2015'. I always assumed Burnham upped sticks and ran for Mayor of Manchester because he was sick of Corbyn, looks like it was the other people he was sick of.
I was at one of Burnham's hustings when he was running for leader. Surprisingly disappointing. Either he thought he had it in the bag, or he knew already he had lost. Failed to inspire me. A politician who is good at soundbites but lacks real conviction.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tell it like it is
Bonkers.
Red Ed Milliband, elected by the unions... was on the right...
You don't understand butt for many years Labours policies were right wing, they were a right wing party that called themselves a left wing party, lol, and the London press also loved to call them left wing when they were actually right wing the proof of the pudding is in the eating and their policies were right wing, they weren't looking to renationalise vital industries on mass, they weren't looking to greatly increase taxes or to increase the welfare state, they weren't looking to greatly increase council house building or reinstate clause 4.
The unions are also right wing, in the main it's only higher paid workers and middle class types that are union members, many gig economy workers on zero hour contracts and minimum wage workers and part time workers are not in unions, many shop assistants, cleaners, hairdressers, farm labourers etc are not in unions, unions are often for the elite types teachers, civil servants, train drivers etc.
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Re: Labour Report Published
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Vindec
Unfortunately virtually all of the decent Labour politicians were marginalised during the Corbyn era. Starmer has a lot of work to do but has started by getting rid of the dross and bringing some decent talent back into the fold. He's now got to sort out those who have ruined the Party in HQ. He's got 4 years to get the Party's act together.
Corbyn was wrong to surround himself with yes men and women. Created a cult that eventually destroyed him. Boris Johnson is going the same way.
