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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
So, if 20 or 30 million people without skills turn up, how are your friends who are free of prejudices going to handle the economic situation?
And in one swoop you suggest that having prejudices is ok to preserve the economic situation. Interesting.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
In the minds of some people migrants aren’t even human, they “flood” into countries, they somehow manage to claim benefits and get free houses whilst managing to take all the jobs.
The thing is it’s mostly complete bollocks, it’s planed in the media by the Tory government to pass the blame of everything else that’s going wrong.
The same happens with working class people who have to claim benefits too.
I cannot believe people still fall for it and use it as an excuse for their prejudice.
Complete open borders wouldn’t work but the arguments against immigration are usually just ignorant.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
And in one swoop you suggest that having prejudices is ok to preserve the economic situation. Interesting.
No I didn't. Can't you read? I said even if you are free from prejudices open borders are still an economic problem, just like the NHS and the housing situation is an economic problem. That's is why every country in the world is protective of its own borders.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
He said Morrissey is racist for wanting what every other country in the world wants. I'd love to be able to rock up in any country that I choose, but unfortunately I can't. You've got to jump through hoops for the few who will even consider letting you in.
Hey, there's this great thing that all the kids are talking about called the EU, I think you would like it.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
In the minds of some people migrants aren’t even human, they “flood” into countries, they somehow manage to claim benefits and get free houses whilst managing to take all the jobs.
The thing is it’s mostly complete bollocks, it’s planed in the media by the Tory government to pass the blame of everything else that’s going wrong.
The same happens with working class people who have to claim benefits too.
I cannot believe people still fall for it and use it as an excuse for their prejudice.
Complete open borders wouldn’t work but the arguments against immigration are usually just ignorant.
100% correct.
The effect of the media is very worrying. Back in 2008 the government spend billions upon billions bailing out the banks. The opposition agreed to this bailout.
Within no time, the media helped encourage people to blame immigrants, benefit cheats and Labour overspending on the state of the economy. The interesting part of this is that not one single independant fiscal organisation (OBR, IFS, BoE, etc) agreed with any of this. People seem to forget it was all about the banks. It's been one of the greatest manoeuvers in blame in history. We've been told the economy has been in a dreadful state for years. It's been so dire, to the point where the deficit has never even really been brought under control, that we're now going to be spending money like confetti, presumably all borrowed - a situation that all leading economists and financial institutions suggest will get significantly worse when we leave the EU.
I can only presume that the debt isn't as dreadful as we are led to believe and austerity was all about an attack on the worst off in society.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
No I didn't. Can't you read? I said even if you are free from prejudices open borders are still an economic problem, just like the NHS and the housing situation is an economic problem. That's is why every country in the world is protective of its own borders.
Whether someone is free from prejudices or not is irrelevant to the possibility of an economic problem in your scenario. It was a surprising line that you used, suggesting that freedom from prejudices could lead to this, so one could easily assume you meant the opposite for people wanting the opposite scenario.
Of course, we know for a fact that those who want the strongest border controls tend to be those who have prejudices. To suggest otherwise would be silly. The usual line is that "we don't want them coming in".
Anyway, to another point, you are aware that the UK controls over half of the immigration that comes in already?
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
100% correct.
The effect of the media is very worrying. Back in 2008 the government spend billions upon billions bailing out the banks. The opposition agreed to this bailout.
Within no time, the media helped encourage people to blame immigrants, benefit cheats and Labour overspending on the state of the economy. The interesting part of this is that not one single independant fiscal organisation (OBR, IFS, BoE, etc) agreed with any of this. People seem to forget it was all about the banks. It's been one of the greatest manoeuvers in blame in history. We've been told the economy has been in a dreadful state for years. It's been so dire, to the point where the deficit has never even really been brought under control, that we're now going to be spending money like confetti, presumably all borrowed - a situation that all leading economists and financial institutions suggest will get significantly worse when we leave the EU.
I can only presume that the debt isn't as dreadful as we are led to believe and austerity was all about an attack on the worst off in society.
The media who are saying this don't want us to leave the EU. It's all smoke and mirrors. What we do know is the majority of British people voted to leave the EU. This majority need to organise and do what's best for Britain, with no more labour v tory distractions. So yeah, you are right about the media, but I'm not sure how you are going to convince everybody else regarding your insight.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric Cartman
Hey, there's this great thing that all the kids are talking about called the EU, I think you would like it.
Exactly I’ve worked in a foreign country for the last 3 years and have worked in another before. I didn’t have to jump through any hoops other than learning a language and you can ever get by without doing that.
I think Morrissey is racist because he supports for Britain who are known racists. They were called nazis by 2 UKIP members ffs.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
I think Morrissey is racist because he supports for Britain who are known racists. They were called nazis by 2 UKIP members ffs.
Don't trust any opinion except your own, everybody has an angle, especially politicians and the media.
Interesting question, given the unique collection of knowledge you have accumulated over time, what percentage of this knowledge would you consider to be absolutely true?
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Baker
I meant Mike Joyce sorry. The drummer who sued them.
Fair enough.
If there ever were to be a Smiths reunion, Mike Joyce won't be a part of it.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Originally Posted by
ninianclark
Slightly off the original point, but please give it 5 mins, re open borders and who can come in. My Mrs is friends with a woman who is trying to claim asylum in the UK, she's from Albania. Her ex husband forced her into prostitution, tried to kill her and did lots of other things to her I wont repeat. The reason she is claiming asylum here is that she used to work here and her daughter was born here.
They have been put into accommodation, and living above her is another woman and her daughter. They are also Albanian and also claiming asylum. The difference being that this woman is claiming she is single, her ex husband is in jail in Albania etc etc . As it turns out - that is bollox, her husband comes to visit her at the flat on a regular basis, the woman is also a prostitute and now it seems has put her daughter (13) on the game.
My Mrs friend is too scared to tell anyone about it as she thinks it will affect her claim, and the mafia gang will kill her.
My point being - has it really come to this, Albanian mafia, child prostitution, benefit claims etc - if this is what eu integration , open borders means then - stuff it. And that is why people think the way they do - that doesnt make them racist - in my book anyway.
You always have these weird anecdotes for every thread, we know they’re bollocks btw. Don’t waste your time making them up in future.
Secondly who the **** has asked for complete open borders in this thread?
Thirdly Albania isn’t even in the eu. So they don’t get freedom of movement.
Wanting controlled immigration doesn’t make anyone racist. Wanting no immigrantion and making up complete bollocks to justify it doesn’t make you racist, but people question your motives. When you have been doing this non stop for years it’s obvious why.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
The media who are saying this don't want us to leave the EU. It's all smoke and mirrors. What we do know is the majority of British people voted to leave the EU. This majority need to organise and do what's best for Britain, with no more labour v tory distractions. So yeah, you are right about the media, but I'm not sure how you are going to convince everybody else regarding your insight.
It'll be interesting to see how Brexit pans out. Whenever Theresa May suggests a soft Brexit, her approval ratings increase. YouGov have reported that for several months more and more leave voters are convinced Brexit is a bad idea. The further we go along this journey, the more we see significant job losses threatened if we have a hard Brexit.
Ultimately, the whole thing will be decided by whoever wins the warfare in the Conservative party.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Morrissey pens dreary songs that sound depressingly similar as he's a lousy singer. He can't play an instrument either. He's almost as talentless as mega feckwit Ozzy Osbourne is.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
It'll be interesting to see how Brexit pans out. Whenever Theresa May suggests a soft Brexit, her approval ratings increase. YouGov have reported that for several months more and more leave voters are convinced Brexit is a bad idea. The further we go along this journey, the more we see significant job losses threatened if we have a hard Brexit.
Ultimately, the whole thing will be decided by whoever wins the warfare in the Conservative party.
The media are also desperate for brexit, darce and his Tory pals are desperate for the tax loopholes it will exploit. Just look at the front pages of te express, mail, sun, times and telegraph during the last 2 years. He’ll try and have you believe his conspiracy theories but he’s living in a dream world.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
It'll be interesting to see how Brexit pans out. Whenever Theresa May suggests a soft Brexit, her approval ratings increase. YouGov have reported that for several months more and more leave voters are convinced Brexit is a bad idea. The further we go along this journey, the more we see significant job losses threatened if we have a hard Brexit.
Ultimately, the whole thing will be decided by whoever wins the warfare in the Conservative party.
Yes, the remain fear campaign run by the media, business & prominent individuals is having an effect. I've always thought we would never leave, as nobody ever have once the propaganda taps have been turned on. I also think the EU is going to collapse sooner rather than later, so we'd best be out of it before then.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ninianclark
100% true , so I'm sorry to disappoint you, they were being housed over by the old Lynx Hotel on newport - but there again I couldnt give a monkeys what you think to. Open borders / EU etc has been the narrative in this thread (along with sh1t music - and people deciding they dont wont to allow someone to perform) . I know Albania isnt in the EU, that is why they claim asylum in EU countries. I also know (as Im sure you do perhaps) they are an accession country and as part of the EU presidents report have been identified along with Kosovo, Macedonia etc as probable joiners in 2020. Which is when the new 8 year EU budget is defined.
The EU has never revealed it's true intentions, we just get little tidbits here and there.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7095657.stm
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
The delusion Jesus Christ it’s ridiculous.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ninianclark
To sum up - certain parties want to make it as difficult as possible using red tape as the ammunition - which is the scenario Tony Blair, Nick Clegg, Mandelson etc want.
ps Morrisey is still sh1t and The Smith's barely listenable :hehe:
Politicians are master illusionists, they are very good at creating problems that need solving, in order to further their agendas.
Regarding Morrissey and The Smiths, they are musically and lyrically interesting, and they turned out to be very influential for a lot of bands who followed. Johnny Marr is a unique and inventive guitarist. The world would be if poorer place if they hadn't come along when they did.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Yes, the remain fear campaign run by the media
That's utter nonsense. The vast majority of the national newspapers want Brexit, the harder the better so they can avoid the EU closing down the tax loopholes they enjoy.
What I can't understand is your total refusal to believe there could be any downside to Brexit, despite so many concerns from so many people, organisations, businesses, politicians etc. Any concerns must be project fear and are instantly dismissed.
I'd love to start hearing evidence from educated economists and those far more in the know than our politicians what will be great about Brexit. At the moment it just seems like a total leap of faith, borne about due to a lunatic belief that the UK is superior to the rest of the world.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
I can't believe anyone would say the media are anti brexit unless they never saw any of it, the bbc still hasn't covered Mogg moving his hedgefund to dublin and nothing about aarong banks and the russians, nothing about muller investigating farage either. Other than the guardian and the independent every other paper has been unbelievably pro brexit.
We've had headlines like "enemies of the people" etc for almost 2 years now. The media wants brexit because the owners will save millions on tax.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ninianclark
Slightly off the original point, but please give it 5 mins, re open borders and who can come in. My Mrs is friends with a woman who is trying to claim asylum in the UK, she's from Albania. Her ex husband forced her into prostitution, tried to kill her and did lots of other things to her I wont repeat. The reason she is claiming asylum here is that she used to work here and her daughter was born here.
They have been put into accommodation, and living above her is another woman and her daughter. They are also Albanian and also claiming asylum. The difference being that this woman is claiming she is single, her ex husband is in jail in Albania etc etc . As it turns out - that is bollox, her husband comes to visit her at the flat on a regular basis, the woman is also a prostitute and now it seems has put her daughter (13) on the game.
My Mrs friend is too scared to tell anyone about it as she thinks it will affect her claim, and the mafia gang will kill her.
My point being - has it really come to this, Albanian mafia, child prostitution, benefit claims etc - if this is what eu integration , open borders means then - stuff it. And that is why people think the way they do - that doesnt make them racist - in my book anyway.
OMG :hehe::hehe::hehe: :facepalm:
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
That's utter nonsense. The vast majority of the national newspapers want Brexit, the harder the better so they can avoid the EU closing down the tax loopholes they enjoy.
BBC, Guardian. I rest my case.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
We've had headlines like "enemies of the people" etc for almost 2 years now. The media wants brexit because the owners will save millions on tax.
Not if the Tories get voted out after Brexit. We the people will have full control over our sovereignty, as opposed to being in the EU where decisions were made by an unelected and informal Euroroup.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
If you think the bbc have been anti brexit you haven't been watching.
The guardian is the only paper that's been printing pro brexit stories, have a look at the others (that have far greater readership) and have a look at the propaganda they are spinning.
The Sun
BeLEAVE in Britain
Queen Backs Brexit
Dover and Out
Up yours senors
Who do you think EU are
See EU later
The Mail
Death to traitors
Take a Bow Britain
Enemies of the people
Let's reignite british spirit
The great delusion
The express
We must get out of the EU
Vote Leave Today
No Turning back on EU exit
Get Britain out of the EU
EU exit boosts house prices!
The telegraph
Vote leave, change history
Birth of a new britain
I'll make brexit great
The Brexit Mutineers
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
If you think the bbc have been anti brexit you haven't been watching.
Most people cannot decipher the tea leaves, but some students of propaganda most certainly can.
From YouGov ..
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.ne...oplines-01.png
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
BBC, Guardian. I rest my case.
The BBC don't want Brexit? Really? That's not the impression I get whatsoever, which must mean they are relatively impartial on it.
I'd expect the Grauniad to support it.
However, the Mail, Express, Sun, Star, Times, Telegraph and Metro support it. All right wing papers owned by billionaire tax avoiders who shift their profits overseas. (Metro is owned by the Mail, while the Express was bought out recently by TMG but until then the same applied).
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
BBC, Guardian. I rest my case.
That's your case? Wow!
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
being in the EU where decisions were made by an unelected and informal Euroroup.
Which decisions are made for us on their behalf, which laws are you looking forward to repealing, what say does the UK currently have in the EU in terms of making laws, how many laws in the UK have been imposed on us without our say so by the EU and how many laws in the UK originated from the EU?
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Originally Posted by
jon1959
That's your case? Wow!
It's more than enough for starters :thumbup:
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
That's your case? Wow!
He's even wrong about one of them. Utterly deluded, he's been proven to spout shit on this matter yet he still carries on. You can't educate the brain dead.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
So people who bother to answer YouGov pollsters are now students of propaganda? Or they are just repeating back the nonsense that the majority media (and you) spout?
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
So people who bother to answer YouGov pollsters are now students of propaganda? Or they are just repeating back the nonsense that the majority media (and you) spout?
It's always somebody else's fault innit. It must be such a burden being a chosen receptacle for truth :biggrin:
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-an...nd-brexit-bias
The bbc are scared to death of the tories and talks of cutting the license, they've been following the party line on europe for ages now. Farage is on every week it seems, Andrew Neil is about as brexit as it's possible to be too. They aren't covering anything about Farage announcing that brexit had failed even though he knew it hadn't to crash the pound of anything about aaron banks donating russian money.
The worst thing about brexit really is we are just going to end up being Norway anyway, freedom of movement, higher fees and no say. Nothing will change except more of our taxes being spent.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Croesy Blue
http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-an...nd-brexit-bias
The bbc are scared to death of the tories and talks of cutting the license, they've been following the party line on europe for ages now. Farage is on every week it seems, Andrew Neil is about as brexit as it's possible to be too. They aren't covering anything about Farage announcing that brexit had failed even though he knew it hadn't to crash the pound of anything about aaron banks donating russian money.
The worst thing about brexit really is we are just going to end up being Norway anyway, freedom of movement, higher fees and no say. Nothing will change except more of our taxes being spent.
Don't give up so easily mate, the NWO people are made of much sterner stuff than you are :thumbup:
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
It's always somebody else's fault innit. It must be such a burden being a chosen receptacle for truth :biggrin:
I thought you were implying (again) that you were the chosen receptacle for truth. :biggrin:
And if I've read you right the fault always lies with anyone but Trump and Rees-Mogg.
Beware the Deep State and the Illuminati. :thumbup:
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
I thought you were implying (again) that you were the chosen receptacle for truth. :biggrin:
And if I've read you right the fault always lies with anyone but Trump and Rees-Mogg.
Beware the Deep State and the Illuminati. :thumbup:
You are right, the battle is being fought at a much higher level than we the people.
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Re: Morrissey cancels tour over racism issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
I thought you were implying (again) that you were the chosen receptacle for truth. :biggrin:
Conspiracy theorist are always right because even if you disprove them your source will be part of the “agenda”. You can never win against them and that’s why a lot of underachievers latch onto buzzard conspiracies because it gives them a feeling of superiority over everyone who doesn’t believe them:
The strange thing is there are genuine conpiracies with brexit, the links between Aaron Banks and Russian money have already been outed. Alas the conspiracy theorist isn’t interested in the ones that have actual evidence or don’t support their narrow world view.