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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansfmachine wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:34
Lol I put the local candidate up as it is very topical around these parts. Where I expect UKIP to poll at least 15%!! Yeah sure UKIP have their racists but like I said so do the others a little research would highlight this.
My mistake.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
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Originally Posted by nathansfmachine wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:37
Quality googling http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/thumbup.gif
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
And No, I don't know them personally.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Hey there are some cracking comments in there. Chris Walker 30th April was the winner for me.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
I having difficulty in finding a lib dem racist but I guess that's down to there not being many lib den politicians about.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 11:23
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
to say i despise immigrants is quite pathetic, and actually ignorant and sneaky
I think you know that's what he means though..... http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/sherlock.gif
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
The answer to that is build more infrastruture. Please dont try to tell me his reason for not doing that is becasue he is some sort of eco warrior. I think we all know why he says the things he says.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
I like Farage and have a lot more time for him than many other politicians I can think of.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
So we build one of the most affluent countries in the capitalist system, sometimes at the expense of other nations, creating a power structure to keep us near the top of that list, and because successive governments have cocked it up and racked up too much debt (a debt that doesn't really affect them personally) we punish other poorer countries to 'get our house in order'.
There is a moral issue here. And even if we did have this as policy with the promise we'd send aid again later, I wouldn't trust anyone with those kinds of morals to keep that promise.
It's like being in an old boat and suggesting to the man who's been pushed overboard that we'll come and rescue him when we've got a bigger, better boat.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
I agree with you, but I think you knew Farage wasn't on about there isn't anymore square miles to build houses and that he was referring to the infrastructure. Which isn't as silly an argument as the way you suggested it.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
I think if you pop into most Labour clubs on a Friday or Saturday night you'll find views expressed that would be considered extremely racist. I don't think having a holier than thou attitude for any party proves anything other than the person's naivety.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 08:52
Firstly i think that Cameron made a big error in allowing 6/7 of airtime to be given to political opponents - he should have just fought it out with Miliband and got 50% airtime. Last night was an unsuprising attack on him - he should have thought it through.
Even as I write this I realise this task is beyond you, but try anyway - you never know you might just learn something.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansfmachine wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:09
I like Farage and have a lot more time for him than many other politicians I can think of.
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/thumbup.gif at least he doen't lie like the rest of them.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penarth Blues wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:53
Firstly i think that Cameron made a big error in allowing 6/7 of airtime to be given to political opponents - he should have just fought it out with Miliband and got 50% airtime. Last night was an unsuprising attack on him - he should have thought it through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 08:52
Farage is probably the bravest politician in the country - he says what people think. He is right to say that NHS tourism is draining. If people are coming from abroad with HIV and getting thousands of pounds of treatment its because its not available where they come from. Its sad, its awful but they have their own countrys and i actually do begrudge paying for their care if its at Welsh peoples expense. We have to have our own house in order - thats basic economics.
Do they receive such a great welcome currently? There is limited integration and they're getting blamed by one of our main politicians. Surely better to have fewer and treat them better than more and treat them worse.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
As for being nr Wrexham, well I can understand why you put Norway on your location. They are both remote places and both look lovely when covered in snow. The Norweigen women are prettier though the beer is cheaper in Wrexham.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 16:22
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
to say i despise immigrants is quite pathetic, and actually ignorant and sneaky
20% of people support SOME of their views. either 1 in 5 british people are racist bigots or there really is something wrong. If it is a democracy surely they have a voice?
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tich rogers wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:57
I like Farage and have a lot more time for him than many other politicians I can think of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansfmachine wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:09
Thats a fairly typical Politician.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:35
Not a case of following the man or following any party, but when Farage and Wood explained and admited we can do nothing to control immigration because of the European Union, they were speaking the truth.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
Tony Benn and Michael Foot were against giving away powers to Brussels for a reason, those powers undermine the rights, wages and working comditions of people living and working in Britain.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Absolutely spot on,agree with all of that,we are just suckers for others to sponge off us,you would not get away with it in the USA or Australia,so why should we be bothered what the world opinion thinks of us.
It makes my blood boil when i see migrants chasing trucks bound for the UK,if i were a driver of one of these i'd stop in a layby and attach a pipe to my exhaust and gas the lot of them on the way to their dream ticket.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 18:09
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
I think you know that's what he means though.....
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/sherlock.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
The answer to that is build more infrastruture. Please dont try to tell me his reason for not doing that is becasue he is some sort of eco warrior. I think we all know why he says the things he says.
If people are concerned about the suppression of wages and genuinely want to do something about it, they need to tackle the employers. Blaming migrants for the suppression of wages will achieve precisely **** all and will allow the problem to continue unchallenged.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 01:12
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 18:09
I think you know that's what he means though.....
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/sherlock.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
The answer to that is build more infrastruture. Please dont try to tell me his reason for not doing that is becasue he is some sort of eco warrior. I think we all know why he says the things he says.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
Poor people see their wages suppressed by increased immigration while higher earners see their living standards rise, sorry Archie but that's the way it is.
Agree with all of that.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
I actually envy you a little. Life appears so simple to idiots.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Farage cannot back-up any of his claims of the NHS being drained by people coming from abroad with HIV to get free treatment.
Wheres the 'real' research Farage?
As usual Farage is plying the public with ill-founded scare mongering claims.
In fact many low-income countries have free HIV treatment.
Much of our aid money goes to HIV prevention and treatment aboard - therefore cutting aid money *may* result in more people coming to the UK.
I agree about Zero hours though Penguin.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Tim Muff wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 04:54
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
to say i despise immigrants is quite pathetic, and actually ignorant and sneaky
Are there problems with the immigration system? Yes... but the UKIP solution will in the long run have a detrimental effect on Britain and the people who rely on us when we offer a sanctuary for them when it's difficult in their own countries. I am still proud of that.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 01:12
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 18:09
I think you know that's what he means though.....
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/sherlock.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
The answer to that is build more infrastruture. Please dont try to tell me his reason for not doing that is becasue he is some sort of eco warrior. I think we all know why he says the things he says.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
Poor people see their wages suppressed by increased immigration while higher earners see their living standards rise, sorry Archie but that's the way it is.
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/thumbup.gif
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 06:33
Penguin may I simply ask why your location says Norway, do you live and work there, are you a Norweigan or in fact and immigrant you seem to despise so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Tim Muff wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 04:54
im near Wrexham. Im not even NOrwegian im Welsh....
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:34
to say i despise immigrants is quite pathetic, and actually ignorant and sneaky
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompeyblue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 10:12
my original post says STOP inward migration for three years except for essential professionals like doctors and nurses.
the same as running a business.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 01:12
I don't think Farages argument is that we are full to the brim and people are going to fall off the island. When he suggests we are "full up" he means that we don't have the infrastructure to deal with , lack of schooling, roads, housing, health provisions etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 18:09
I think you know that's what he means though.....
http://www.ccmb.co.uk/images/smiley_icons/sherlock.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 14:02
The answer to that is build more infrastruture. Please dont try to tell me his reason for not doing that is becasue he is some sort of eco warrior. I think we all know why he says the things he says.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruBlue wrote on Fri, 03 April 2015 13:45
Poor people see their wages suppressed by increased immigration while higher earners see their living standards rise, sorry Archie but that's the way it is.
Sorry Archie, but that's the truth. read the report.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfricanBluebird wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 06:28
Farage cannot back-up any of his claims of the NHS being drained by people coming from abroad with HIV to get free treatment.
anyone who doesnt think setting a number for annual inward migration that is actually workeable is mad. As Farage said though, under EU, we simply can not.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:35
It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.
It's interesting that former left wing politicians used to say the 3 million unemployed in the thatcher era was an economic ploy to increase labour pools and drive down wages whereas now the Labour Party tie themselves up in knots over increased immigration.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:52
It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:35
Well said, couldn't agree more.
The other parties, one of whom will get my vote, would be more honest if they stated that unlimited immigration may have some negative consequences but it's a price worth paying in the grand scheme of things.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Why do we no longer train our own nurses and instead import short term agency staff from abroad at massive cost?
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/nov/01/nhs-spending- agency-nurses-cuts
Dr Peter Carter, Chief Exc Royal College of Nursing " these figures beggar belief" " we are spending too much on temp staff from overseas"
Its not racist or bigoted to believe this country should go back to training our own kids.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 10:33
Why do we no longer train our own nurses and instead import short term agency staff from abroad at massive cost?
Nursing has become very unattractive you 'our own kids'. My good lady is a nurse and it pays very poorly indeed when you consider her qualifications, the responsibility she has, the importance of her work and the pressure she is under.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:35
It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.
By far and away the most significnat factor on the labour force is the capitalist system and the desire to keep costs down and maximise profits. But hey, lets not talk about that, let's divert attention from that and focus on johnny forigner - that way we can let the real culprits get away scott free - and while we are at it, some of us can use it to cover up sinister prejudices we have.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibald leitch wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 11:37
It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:35
The birth rates in the UK have an impact on the labour force, the number of people gainging specific qualifications has an impact on the labour force, the stock market has an impact on the labour force, technological advances have an impact on the labour force, the availability of natural resources has an impact on the labour force. There are a myriad of factors that can have an impact on the labour force - even the bleeding weather!
I have never expressed any 'sinister prejudices' on this message board in any shape or form. I would hope that no-one is more of an anti-xenophobe than me.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Penguin wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:31
Im not actually sure Farage is a racist either. I might be wrong but if he is, then 20% of the UK are racist too. My wife would stop a truck to save a snail from being crushed but even she says that she feels there is something in what he says - anyone who suggested my wife was a racist would see my eyes streaming with tears of laughter.
What on earth have snails got to do with being racist? This thread just keeps on giving.
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Re: The 'debate', a brave Farage, and zero hours.
[quote title=Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 11:47][quote title=archibald leitch wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 11:37][quote title=Taunton Blue Genie wrote on Sat, 04 April 2015 08:35]It's disingenuous to think that a substantial increase in the labour force has absolutely no effect on wages. I detest UKIP but even a broken clock is correct occasionally.[/quote]The birth rates in the UK have an impact on the labour force, the number of people gainging specific qualifications has an impact on the labour force, the stock market has an impact on the labour force, technological advances have an impact on the labour force, the availability of natural resources has an impact on the labour force. There are a myriad of factors that can have an impact on the labour force - even the bleeding weather!By far and away the most significnat factor on the labour force is the capitalist system and the desire to keep costs down and maximise profits. But hey, lets not talk about that, let's divert attention from that and focus on johnny forigner - that way we can let the real culprits get away scott free - and while we are at it, some of us can use it to cover up sinister prejudices we have. [/quote]I have never expressed any 'sinister prejudices' on this message board in any shape or form. I would hope that no-one is more of an anti-xenophobe than me.[/quote]No - that was not aimed at you specifically - hence my comment 'some of us'. Perhaps i was being a little too cryptic, apologies if you thought i meant you.
