Covid 19.....You are going to get it ....100%

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

Lawnmower had a dry cough, a fever and lost his sense of taste.

Until the tests are available to all we will stumble around in the darkness.

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Which is correct. I hope he is recovering, and I hope he gets an antibody test when they are available.

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

Cant find much in there to argue with . That's how I see it going , truth is no one knows .

I opened with my opinion. I am mechanic who drives a truck and runs a small business. What do I know ?

If something good comes from this , will it be our attitude to greed and the destruction we are doing to the planet?

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I think we'll all have reassessed our priorities in life, and that is a good thing.

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

There is no cure .

There wont be a vaccine for some time .

For the country to move forward and get back on its feet , on the whole ,we all have to get it .

Once the number of deaths drop below a certain point , restrictions will be lifted and we will start again.

The deaths are being controlled , which is of course sensible .

The hospital in the millennium stadium is a sign of things to come .

The only positive I can think about it at the moment is a lot of us have had it and aren't aware.

Anyone disagree with my interpretation of the current situation ?

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I would agree with this myself makes complete sense.
My experience was I had severe flu like no other I've had.
The flu went after 5 days but had severe breathing difficulties after climbing the stairs, It was like somebody had thrown a bag of flour up in the air constantly and you were trying to breath. This finally went after almost 2 weeks. A few days ago so I can see why it has been killing a lot of people.
So if your quite fit and healthy I'd say just get it out the way as it can make you a prisoner in your own mind until you get it.
Now I've had it I go out and I feel invincible about it now.

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Originally Posted by uncle bob

I would agree with this myself makes complete sense.
My experience was I had severe flu like no other I've had.
The flu went after 5 days but had severe breathing difficulties after climbing the stairs, It was like somebody had thrown a bag of flour up in the air constantly and you were trying to breath. This finally went after almost 2 weeks. A few days ago so I can see why it has been killing a lot of people.
So if your quite fit and healthy I'd say just get it out the way as it can make you a prisoner in your own mind until you get it.
Now I've had it I go out and I feel invincible about it now.

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Were you tested?

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

What is dangerous about debating the possibility that this could go on for a long time? Compared to others in this thread who

A Still go out cycling
B Have been ill and assume they are immune from Covid-19
C Assume a friend has had it and query why not everyone he has been with has had it (conspirational theory stuff)

I have

A Explored and reasoned why I think this COULD BE with us a long time. I will be happy if and when I am wrong, and I'll continue reading the journals and change my opinions based on those.

You are trying, in a blinkered way, to make mileage out of the fact that I use words like "could be" but everything is a "could be". It's obvious that if my "could be" was a nice one you'd have less of a problem. It's plain that you are unable to apply critical or scientific thinking to this. I am not ruling anything in or out - there is no embarrassment if I am wrong, that's not how this stuff works (although that is exactly how it works on a forum where people fall out over trivial matters)

I have seen something similar written on a scientific forum, and it's not surprising that it has had a more mature response from a more pragmatic audience than my posting on a football message board. It reasons that countries will face shortened periods of restrictions over the next decade - many of those placed to protect the economy from a longer lockdown like Spain, Italy and eventually us are experiencing.

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And so we get to the crux of the matter .

Firstly , cycling hasn't been banned , Unless of course I missed that memo.
My mistake was to cycle further than my local area. It has been brought up , I have been suitably criticised. I have seen the error of my ways and said I wouldn't repeat it . Yet you have brought it up at least three times on this thread .
We have asked you what your roll in life is , I am going to say you are not a leader , leaders do not chastise people time and time again for the same mistake , it makes them look small minded and unintelligent .

Its great you have shared your superior knowledge with us all . thank you.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

I think if that happens unless it’s done ridiculously slowly we would end up with too many deaths.

How many have it now? 1% of the population? 5%?

We’ve already had 4000 deaths.

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I've read they think 10% of the population has had it, if so there is a hell of a way to go?

Originally with the herd immunity theory they talked of 60% of the population getting it, mainly children and workers, it would bring it to a halt?

It seems a bit low to me but we certainly won't get to 100%.

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

And so we get to the crux of the matter .

Firstly , cycling hasn't been banned , Unless of course I missed that memo.
My mistake was to cycle further than my local area. It has been brought up , I have been suitably criticised. I have seen the error of my ways and said I wouldn't repeat it . Yet you have brought it up at least three times on this thread .
We have asked you what your roll in life is , I am going to say you are not a leader , leaders do not chastise people time and time again for the same mistake , it makes them look small minded and unintelligent .

Its great you have shared your superior knowledge with us all . thank you.

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Why have you taken it so personally? You're not the only one flouting the rules, although you are one of the few correcting their ways.

I was merely comparing me theorising where this may take us, with the actions of people who flout the rules, and people who claim they have had the illness without tests.

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

There is no cure .

There wont be a vaccine for some time .

For the country to move forward and get back on its feet , on the whole ,we all have to get it .

Once the number of deaths drop below a certain point , restrictions will be lifted and we will start again.

The deaths are being controlled , which is of course sensible .

The hospital in the millennium stadium is a sign of things to come .

The only positive I can think about it at the moment is a lot of us have had it and aren't aware.

Anyone disagree with my interpretation of the current situation ?

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This bloke thinks we should more or less just get on with it!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mer-judge.html

I went to Spain with 15 other lads if you include the lads we met up with from Scotland. 10 of us went on minibus to Gatwick
We got on a plane to benidorm for 4 days.
Returned home on the Wednesday. By the Friday it had hit me and I now know that 12 of the others all had the same symptoms with one of the boys who lives in Ely getting an ambulance out last week as he was really struggling to breath and pain in his lungs. The paramedics tested him and he definitely had Coronavirus they said. So what are the chances of the rest of us not having it? Very slim.
They wouldn't take him into hospital as they said more people were worse than him

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

What is the evidence you have seen that means you can categorically rule this scenario out? I've been looking, and I can't see anything. Therefore, what makes my scenario (based on the lack of knowledge on immunisation, the lack of a vaccine, the inability to test enough of the population of practically every country) more unhelpful than the scenario that life will be back to normal in time for Christmas. I have not said anywhere that this WILL happen.

The Spanish flu was with us for 2 years - this was exacerbated by people returning from war and malnourishment. It died a natural way, but at a time when people weren't travelling all 4 corners of the globe. How easy do you think it will be to contain a second wave that originates in America or Australia or India?

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Easy lock the borders immediately no one in no one out.

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

And so we get to the crux of the matter .

Firstly , cycling hasn't been banned , Unless of course I missed that memo.
My mistake was to cycle further than my local area. It has been brought up , I have been suitably criticised. I have seen the error of my ways and said I wouldn't repeat it . Yet you have brought it up at least three times on this thread .
We have asked you what your roll in life is , I am going to say you are not a leader , leaders do not chastise people time and time again for the same mistake , it makes them look small minded and unintelligent .

Its great you have shared your superior knowledge with us all . thank you.

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What's wrong with cycling?

As long as you are on your own and keep a distance better still into the countryside where there are no people?

how far did you go?

What if you have an accident and you need to go to A and E

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

Shouldn’t the whole country be locked down full stop then ?

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If we do that there's no healthcare, so more people will die. If we need healthcare, we need public transport to allow people to get there and so on.

I guess we could get the army and volunteers to make food boxes up and deliver them, but if people obey social distancing and keep washing hands etc then going to the supermarket becomes low risk.

Some people will pick this virus up. All of the measures, as I see it, are designed to reduce the spread of it, without the need for a full scale shut down. Any one of us could be spreading the virus unknowingly. Because of that, anyone flouting the rules about staying home and not keeping their distance is a retarded w@nkspangle.

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Originally Posted by uncle bob

What if you have an accident and you need to go to A and E

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Cycle carefully and don't have one, what if you fall down the stairs and go to A & E?

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

If we do that there's no healthcare, so more people will die. If we need healthcare, we need public transport to allow people to get there and so on.

I guess we could get the army and volunteers to make food boxes up and deliver them, but if people obey social distancing and keep washing hands etc then going to the supermarket becomes low risk.

Some people will pick this virus up. All of the measures, as I see it, are designed to reduce the spread of it, without the need for a full scale shut down. Any one of us could be spreading the virus unknowingly. Because of that, anyone flouting the rules about staying home and not keeping their distance is a retarded w@nkspangle.

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I think supermarkets and petrol stations are the main spreaders now, we probably need tighter measures and improvements there!

I'd feel safer on a walk or bike ride than a trip to the supermarket!

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Originally Posted by uncle bob

I went to Spain with 15 other lads if you include the lads we met up with from Scotland. 10 of us went on minibus to Gatwick
We got on a plane to benidorm for 4 days.
Returned home on the Wednesday. By the Friday it had hit me and I now know that 12 of the others all had the same symptoms with one of the boys who lives in Ely getting an ambulance out last week as he was really struggling to breath and pain in his lungs. The paramedics tested him and he definitely had Coronavirus they said. So what are the chances of the rest of us not having it? Very slim.
They wouldn't take him into hospital as they said more people were worse than him

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So you cannot say with 100 percent certainty that you had Covid-19, but you claim you now feel invincible?

Was your friend tested?

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Originally Posted by Jimmy the Jock

Lawnmower had a dry cough, a fever and lost his sense of taste.

Until the tests are available to all we will stumble around in the darkness.

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I've just finished a 7day isolation, went down with a cold, not as nasty as some I've had in the past, but from the pattern of the cold from my own previous history I had it down as a bog std. cold from day one, rightly or wrongly, the two symptoms that turned me away from possible Covid was that, I have not had a temp/fever, my sense of taste & smell did not change, tomato sauce, (the acid test!!) still smells the foulest substance this earth has ever produced, if i would have been able to stomach tomato sauce smell i would have started to get a little worried.

LM symptoms fall into Covid territory when considering experiences from those who have had it.

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

So you cannot say with 100 percent certainty that you had Covid-19, but you claim you now feel invincible?

Was your friend tested?

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He says in the post that the paramedics said his mate definitely had Coronavirus. I'm not a medical worker or scientist so that's good enough for me. Understandably it's not for you, what is it you do for a living again?

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Originally Posted by delmbox

He says in the post that the paramedics said his mate definitely had Coronavirus. I'm not a medical worker or scientist so that's good enough for me. Understandably it's not for you, what is it you do for a living again?

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Well, you plainly are not a scientist because that would not be good enough for a scientist nor a doctor. How do you think science works - "there's a good chance that is correct, so let's just say it's correct and head off to the pub"?

Has it been proven you can't get it twice yet?

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Well, you plainly are not a scientist because that would not be good enough for a scientist nor a doctor. How do you think science works - "there's a good chance that is correct, so let's just say it's correct and head off to the pub"?

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Pubs are shut mate. And I'm not saying he should crack on as normal, I'm just saying I trust the judgement of a trained paramedic dealing with Coronavirus cases all day over an overconfident random on a messageboard who keeps avoiding the question about if he does anything remotely to do with any of this for a living

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Look, I have put the reasons for my arguments here in black and white. Where I have been most forceful is in challenging other people's opinions. That doesn't mean I think I am right, and I've never said I am right. I appreciate my scenario is unpalatable. But, I have to say, I won't be led up a pretty garden path on this. The thought and expectation that flattening the curve is all we have to do is incredibly optimistic. I am fearful that people are not being prepared for a reoccurrence of this - and I am incredibly concerned at how the public would respond if there were a second wave that they weren't expecting.

Personally, I think the UK is one of the few countries to have gotten the handling of this correct - albeit late. That doesn't preclude the likelihood of another wave and another lockdown . I don't quite understand why me ruling this out is so upsetting. I am preparing for it - I will be downsizing as soon as this is over and making myself mortgage free. If my job survives this wave, it won't survive if there is a subsequent wave.

Where I have less confidence is that, once contained, it is over. Where I have less confidence is that, once you have it, you're immune for years. And, I have little confidence that a vaccine is the complete answer. That will take years (I still think 18 months is optimistic) - and you have the anti-vax movement to contend with. Measles was all but eradicated until recently thanks to those bastards.

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I agree about the possibility of a second outbreak and I'm pretty sure the people who really count in this, the people with the specialist knowledge, are currently assuming that there will be one and, when there is, how can the damage it causes be minimised. However, for me, there are two things going on here, one involving those specialists and another involving the general public who are, for now, just longing for a time when they can return to something like normality. I happen to think that, even if there is a second wave, there will be a period where the restrictions will be eased somewhat and we can get that normality back for a while - this will leave us better prepared if we have do have to go through more lockdowns.

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Originally Posted by delmbox

Pubs are shut mate. And I'm not saying he should crack on as normal, I'm just saying I trust the judgement of a trained paramedic dealing with Coronavirus cases all day over an overconfident random on a messageboard who keeps avoiding the question about if he does anything remotely to do with any of this for a living

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I see you are going to turn this into an ad hominem debate. So, apologies for not playing ball.

When someone pipes up about an awful Peltier performance, I look forward to them qualifying the statement on here by listing number of international caps, club appearances and so on.

Further, I have not disputed the paramedics claim that Uncle Bob's mate had covid-19. I am asking how he came to that assessment (what is so difficult to understand that?), especially in light of some countries having to make minor adjustments (up and down) on their case numbers based on actual proof. Merkel was counted in the stats for Germany, before being removed after she turned out to be a false positive.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I agree about the possibility of a second outbreak and I'm pretty sure the people who really count in this, the people with the specialist knowledge, are currently assuming that there will be one and, when there is, how can the damage it causes be minimised. However, for me, there are two things going on here, one involving those specialists and another involving the general public who are, for now, just longing for a time when they can return to something like normality. I happen to think that, even if there is a second wave, there will be a period where the restrictions will be eased somewhat and we can get that normality back for a while - this will leave us better prepared if we have do have to go through more lockdowns.

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I agree, although I think many things will be tentative. As in your example on you considering going to watch football, I will have to make a decision on whether or not my kids can go to see their grandkids. I stopped this about 10 days before the schools closed, based on evidence that Italy's problems were exacerbated by kids going to stay with grandparents. I also told my work that I would be working from home or taking annual leave a week before they made the decision. So, I think it is important to be pro-active.

I hope subsequent waves will not be as severe as this one but, I think with every wave there will be a psychological impact on the general public - almost like an after shock after an earthquake. But, and I know this causes problems for some, we do not know so many things.
Immunity period.
Asymptomatic cases.
Infection rates of asymptomatic cases.
Infection rates among children.
Immunity against other strains of the same virus.
The ability of the virus to mutate.
The possibilities of new strains of the virus in years to come.
The effectiveness of a vaccine against these strains.

Based on all the above, my opinion is that this cannot be treated as a one wave pandemic. I also don't think it is beyond the realms of possibility that we will be faced with periods of lockdown over the next few years (I am basing that on my lack of confidence on a vaccination). I do think subsequent lockdowns will not be as severe because we will have better coping mechanisms. Ideally we need to follow the example of Singapore and South Korea in tracking people but, again, we have people who are suspicious of the Government's intentions. I don't think enough is being made of the fact that we are, essentially, in a situation that would only be repeated during a war and during a war, certain freedoms have to be removed.

For some reason, people are taking the above opinion as an affront to something that is known but, correct me if I am wrong, but no scientific experts have suggested anything other than a period of instability when we get back to normal.

I'm hoping that people respect why I have formed the opinion I have done - it's based on the unknowns.

Similarly, I am equally concerned that people are assuming they have had it and are invincible. Essentially, people need to walk around as if they have the virus - that mindset will help restrict spread. If we suddenly have people walking around as if they are invincible (and they may be, but they can't know this) then we have a new cause of transmission.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Has it been proven you can't get it twice yet?

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It hasn't. I think I pointed out that 263 people were re-tested in China, and 38 people had the virus having previously recovered. One caveat against that is that the theory is those 38 were falsely identified as having it. But, clearly, this is still an unknown and assumptions are based on other coronaviruses like colds. But, for some of these, immunity lasts a few months at best.

Worse case scenario - we can get it twice. I struggle to see how this first wave will not be continuously repeated until there is a vaccine. I think that is a fair opinion to make. I also see no problem in thinking of worse case scenarios - I'm fairly confident this has been discussed by Governments around the world.

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Originally Posted by delmbox

He says in the post that the paramedics said his mate definitely had Coronavirus. I'm not a medical worker or scientist so that's good enough for me. Understandably it's not for you, what is it you do for a living again?

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Apologies, I see in another thread that Uncle Bob's friend was tested. So that removes any element of doubt for his friend, and it seems likely that Uncle Bob had it too - but I would still say he needs some sort of test to confirm that.

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Apologies, I see in another thread that Uncle Bob's friend was tested. So that removes any element of doubt for his friend, and it seems likely that Uncle Bob had it too - but I would still say he needs some sort of test to confirm that.

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I accept your apology. Also FYI, Lee Peltier doesn't play for Cardiff City anymore. He signed for WBA in the last transfer window

I know loads of people convinced theyve had it. They probably havent. The NHS worker I know had all the symptoms and had the testers up the house. She was really ill. Negative result.

Bob coming back from Spain with all the symptoms and his friend testing positive the likelihood is it probably was. Still without the test you cant be 100%.

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Originally Posted by delmbox

I accept your apology. Also FYI, Lee Peltier doesn't play for Cardiff City anymore. He signed for WBA in the last transfer window

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Jirga doesn't support Cardiff City anymore. How was he supposed to know that?

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Originally Posted by Hilts

I know loads of people convinced theyve had it. They probably havent. The NHS worker I know had all the symptoms and had the testers up the house. She was really ill. Negative result.

Bob coming back from Spain with all the symptoms and his friend testing positive the likelihood is it probably was. Still without the test you cant be 100%.

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Yep! They are testing about 8000 sick people a day, and many results come back negative despite people showing symptoms. Those people have the flu. Which is what I was alluding to earlier in the thread.

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

Jirga doesn't support Cardiff City anymore. How was he supposed to know that?

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Where do you get that impression? I haven't been watching much football lately because of a family issue so I apologise for naming Peltier in a rush to make a point.

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Where do you get that impression? I haven't been watching much football lately because of a family issue so I apologise for naming Peltier in a rush to make a point.

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I accept your apology

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Where do you get that impression? I haven't been watching much football lately because of a family issue so I apologise for naming Peltier in a rush to make a point.

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He probably looked at your previous posts, saw that whenever Cardiff City was mentioned it was negatively and leapt to conclusions.

The better answer of course would have been Who's Jirga?

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

Where do you get that impression? I haven't been watching much football lately because of a family issue so I apologise for naming Peltier in a rush to make a point.

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You've stated it probably a hundred times that you gave up supporting the club during the rebrand and I don't remember you saying that you had started supporting them again. Apologies if I missed it... Not sure what other usernames you're using at the moment. Maybe you could 'Do Me A Faerber' and clarify which other ones you go by?

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Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays

He probably looked at your previous posts, saw that whenever Cardiff City was mentioned it was negatively and leapt to conclusions.

The better answer of course would have been Who's Jirga?

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Actually I think the correct response is "What's a Jirga?"

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Originally Posted by lardy

Actually I think the correct response is "What's a Jirga?"

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:hehe:

I still remember one of Croesy's aliases replying to someone "why do you keep saying Croeso to me? What does it mean?" :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg

You've stated it probably a hundred times that you gave up supporting the club during the rebrand and I don't remember you saying that you had started supporting them again. Apologies if I missed it... Not sure what other usernames you're using at the moment. Maybe you could 'Do Me A Faerber' and clarify which other ones you go by?

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You obviously have me confused with someone else.

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Originally Posted by lardy

Actually I think the correct response is "What's a Jirga?"

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A Jirga? As in a Loya Jirga? That is something in Afghanistan if my memory serves me correctly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loya_jirga

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Originally Posted by CCFCC3PO

A Jirga? As in a Loya Jirga? That is something in Afghanistan if my memory serves me correctly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loya_jirga

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Kris in a Badly Ironed Shirt.........you might be right!

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Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays

Kris in a Badly Ironed Shirt.........you might be right!

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Wrong thread I think :hehe: