Harry Arter

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Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927

No one has said he's the answer to all our problems, what I think he is, is better than Vaulks, Pack and Bacuna.

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based on his performances this season?

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Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927

No one has said he's the answer to all our problems, what I think he is, is better than Vaulks, Pack and Bacuna.

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Nobody is saying he will be a Jason Koumas type player.

The midfield is also calling out for a player who can pick a through ball and beat a man in midfield but I think he would improve us.

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Originally Posted by blue lewj

I'm mentioning our midfield as our central midfielders are the players he is being directly compared with.

Would it not be odd to debate whether a player is better than your current players without mentioning or thinking about them?

Your car analogy might work if I thought Arter was the same standard of car. If you swapped your really crap car for a slightly less crap one with no other alternative then that would be closer to my thinking. I think it would be an improvement. Our current midfield does not function. I think Arter would improve it.

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You’re promoting the type of policy that has got the club into a playing/financial mess time and time again, bring in older, no resale players on big wages, then realise that their day is done, pay them off or keep them on the staff until their lucrative contract runs out. We’ve got to get away from this train of thought.

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Originally Posted by splott parker

You’re promoting the type of policy that has got the club into a playing/financial mess time and time again, bring in older, no resale players on big wages, then realise that their day is done, pay them off or keep them on the staff until their lucrative contract runs out. We’ve got to get away from this train of thought.

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I'm not promoting anything but putting better players in our team that are more effective than we have now. Nothing more.
Surely that is rule 1 of improving the team.

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Originally Posted by splott parker

You’re promoting the type of policy that has got the club into a playing/financial mess time and time again, bring in older, no resale players on big wages, then realise that their day is done, pay them off or keep them on the staff until their lucrative contract runs out. We’ve got to get away from this train of thought.

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Exactly. He’s talking nonsense as usual. In the past he’s criticised the club for making this type of signing.

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Originally Posted by blue lewj

I'm not promoting anything but putting better players in our team that are more effective than we have now. Nothing more.
Surely that is rule 1 of improving the team.

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If you think that Arter is better than any of the midfielders that we already have, then you clearly haven't seen him play this season.

The question shouldn’t be wether Arter would get in our midfield or not. If we have play off ambitions next season the question should be would Arter get into any of the current top 6 teams in this division and the answer is most certainly NO.

JR following me round like a stray dog again.

No doubt adding great input to the threads subject matter in his own little style.

I find it quite funny that Mehmet has talked of the clubs new transfer policy like they have stumbled on some new age way of approaching it. Were we not checking the age of a player we were signing and considering their sell on potential previously?

This threads unbelievable. Theres people on this thread who have not only moaned at results but the style of play and want to 31 year old Harry Arter.

😂😂😂😂

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Originally Posted by Hilts

This threads unbelievable. Theres people on this thread who have not only moaned at results but the style of play and want to 31 year old Harry Arter.

😂😂😂😂

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They’ve lost the plot

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Originally Posted by Hilts

This threads unbelievable. Theres people on this thread who have not only moaned at results but the style of play and want to 31 year old Harry Arter.

��������

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Yup, unbelievable.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Yup, unbelievable.

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It is slightly less unbelievable if you've seen our central midfielders trying to play.

The thread is nearly 100 posts long.
That's unbelievable! :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Yup, unbelievable.

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What's unbelievable is that drama queens in the thread are making it out like Lewj and I are saying Arter can take us to the Premier League 🤣

All we've said is that in our opinion he's better than that we've got but there's some argumentative people on this forum who'd start an argument in an empty Coronavirus affected stadium🤣

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Originally Posted by UNDERHILL1927

What's unbelievable is that drama queens in the thread are making it out like Lewj and I are saying Arter can take us to the Premier League ��

All we've said is that in our opinion he's better than that we've got but there's some argumentative people on this forum who'd start an argument in an empty Coronavirus affected stadium��

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I'd say that he probably isn't better than what we already have, and if he is it'll be marginal. I'd rather us look out for a young, hungry midfield player from league 1 or 2, or from a foreign league, rather than a player who is finished.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

I'd say that he probably isn't better than what we already have, and if he is it'll be marginal. I'd rather us look out for a young, hungry midfield player from league 1 or 2, or from a foreign league, rather than a player who is finished.

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Me too mate 100%, whether that will happen I doubt very much sadly 🤣

https://www.nottinghamforest.news/20...ew-forest-low/

Forest are apparently paying him £38k per week to play for their Under-23s.

oof

He should be a good player at this level, I'm surprised he can't get in their team.
But that wage is a hell of a lot to be getting no value from.

And the person criticising the club giving a contract to Tomlin wanted Arter.😂😂😂

38 k a week.

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Originally Posted by Hilts

And the person criticising the club giving a contract to Tomlin wanted Arter.😂😂😂

38 k a week.

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Warnock had a 7 year deal at 48.5k lined up for him

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Originally Posted by dembethewarrior

Warnock had a 7 year deal at 48.5k lined up for him

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Thing is, we can't blame Warnock for that kind of think. Managers generally last less than 2 years in a job. Many of them aren't going to care if they're saddling the club with years of using up their whole wage bill for players who won't play - if they can get the best players for the season they are in. If they have one good year they'll get a job elsewhere and the mess will be someone else's problem.
The fault lies with the people who allow them to behave like that.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I’d say Arter is the sort of player who doesn’t have much to offer once his legs start to go and he’s at that stage now. Some of the comments earlier were a bit harsh I thought because I thought though, he was excellent in the season Bournemouth won the league. I also thought he did a decent job when he was here, but, despite us having a footballer in midfield in Camarasa the balance, in true Cardiff style, wasn’t right.

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Absolutely this

Just to cast him aside with a label as 'shit footballer' does him a massive disservice.

But I wouldn't like us to sign him

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Originally Posted by Rjk

Thing is, we can't blame Warnock for that kind of think. Managers generally last less than 2 years in a job. Many of them aren't going to care if they're saddling the club with years of using up their whole wage bill for players who won't play - if they can get the best players for the season they are in. If they have one good year they'll get a job elsewhere and the mess will be someone else's problem.
The fault lies with the people who allow them to behave like that.

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Again another top post

With so much money at stake these days I wonder how long the traditional manager will be in place and more along the lines of coaches and committees as some of the amercian sports do

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

Again another top post

With so much money at stake these days I wonder how long the traditional manager will be in place and more along the lines of coaches and committees as some of the amercian sports do

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Yeah well you can see how stoic MM is about the possibility that they’ll sell his best player off without telling him.
Most previous managers would have been going mental at the very suggestion.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

I'd say that he probably isn't better than what we already have, and if he is it'll be marginal. I'd rather us look out for a young, hungry midfield player from league 1 or 2, or from a foreign league, rather than a player who is finished.

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If only. I think our scouts are afraid of flying or get seasick. I wish we'd actually go and look at other European league players. And I mean, actually, go and look at them. We're so unimaginative at City.

I watched Moder last night from row A so really close and the guy's tall at 6'2" and can play midfield or wing-back. He's also really quick and looks like an athlete. I liked the way he communicated on the park. He's exactly the type of player we should be signing. The problem is, we think £6M is too expensive and we're skint when in fact if Tan wants to own a football club then bloody well take it seriously (and yes, this is relevant because we wouldn't need to be talking about the like's of Arter if we had a plan).

I think Tan owns a spreadsheet, not a football club. Cardiff City has a weak board with a poor track record and we're just a portfolio asset, not a living, breathing, football club right now. It all feels stale.

It seems we look at loanees (which I don't like) or 30+ signees (which I don't like). Yes, there have been some good signings from L1 & L2 but IMO there'll be more misses than hits which we need to factor in. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Young and hungry - now I do like the sound of that.

You're right, If Tomlin is regarded as finished (sadly) then what are we talking about Arter for?

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Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew

If only. I think our scouts are afraid of flying or get seasick. I wish we'd actually go and look at other European league players. And I mean, actually, go and look at them. We're so unimaginative at City.

I watched Moder last night from row A so really close and the guy's tall at 6'2" and can play midfield or wing-back. He's also really quick and looks like an athlete. I liked the way he communicated on the park. He's exactly the type of player we should be signing. The problem is, we think £6M is too expensive and we're skint when in fact if Tan wants to own a football club then bloody well take it seriously (and yes, this is relevant because we wouldn't need to be talking about the like's of Arter if we had a plan).

I think Tan owns a spreadsheet, not a football club. Cardiff City has a weak board with a poor track record and we're just a portfolio asset, not a living, breathing, football club right now. It all feels stale.

It seems we look at loanees (which I don't like) or 30+ signees (which I don't like). Yes, there have been some good signings from L1 & L2 but IMO there'll be more misses than hits which we need to factor in. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Young and hungry - now I do like the sound of that.

You're right, If Tomlin is regarded as finished (sadly) then what are we talking about Arter for?

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I just read back my opening paragraph and wanted to clarify that in no way was the flying reference made as a joke or in bad taste bearing in mind our recent history at CCFC. I wrote it without thinking.

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Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew

If only. I think our scouts are afraid of flying or get seasick. I wish we'd actually go and look at other European league players. And I mean, actually, go and look at them. We're so unimaginative at City.

....

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Should be noted that Brexit has reduced number of leagues we can realistically look at and so there will be fewer bargains from Europe now.

Look at them more and look at them better! Likes of Lex Immers, Glatzel, Zohore, Juan Cala, Magnus Wolf Eikrem all came from abroad in one way or another.

Our scouting at moment limited to players known through ties to Arsenal, Republic of Ireland and Wolves or Crewe. How many scouts do we actually have and what are they doing?

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Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew

If only. I think our scouts are afraid of flying or get seasick. I wish we'd actually go and look at other European league players. And I mean, actually, go and look at them. We're so unimaginative at City.

I watched Moder last night from row A so really close and the guy's tall at 6'2" and can play midfield or wing-back. He's also really quick and looks like an athlete. I liked the way he communicated on the park. He's exactly the type of player we should be signing. The problem is, we think £6M is too expensive and we're skint when in fact if Tan wants to own a football club then bloody well take it seriously (and yes, this is relevant because we wouldn't need to be talking about the like's of Arter if we had a plan).

I think Tan owns a spreadsheet, not a football club. Cardiff City has a weak board with a poor track record and we're just a portfolio asset, not a living, breathing, football club right now. It all feels stale.

It seems we look at loanees (which I don't like) or 30+ signees (which I don't like). Yes, there have been some good signings from L1 & L2 but IMO there'll be more misses than hits which we need to factor in. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Young and hungry - now I do like the sound of that.

You're right, If Tomlin is regarded as finished (sadly) then what are we talking about Arter for?

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Careful, fella. You’ll have the “How very dare you criticise the club, therefore you must support Swansea” brigade on to you!

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Originally Posted by dembethewarrior

Warnock had a 7 year deal at 48.5k lined up for him

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It’d be interesting to know what and who determines a player’s contract length.

See - not bashing the club, DML! 😉

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Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew

If only. I think our scouts are afraid of flying or get seasick. I wish we'd actually go and look at other European league players. And I mean, actually, go and look at them. We're so unimaginative at City.

I watched Moder last night from row A so really close and the guy's tall at 6'2" and can play midfield or wing-back. He's also really quick and looks like an athlete. I liked the way he communicated on the park. He's exactly the type of player we should be signing. The problem is, we think £6M is too expensive and we're skint when in fact if Tan wants to own a football club then bloody well take it seriously (and yes, this is relevant because we wouldn't need to be talking about the like's of Arter if we had a plan).

I think Tan owns a spreadsheet, not a football club. Cardiff City has a weak board with a poor track record and we're just a portfolio asset, not a living, breathing, football club right now. It all feels stale.

It seems we look at loanees (which I don't like) or 30+ signees (which I don't like). Yes, there have been some good signings from L1 & L2 but IMO there'll be more misses than hits which we need to factor in. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Young and hungry - now I do like the sound of that.

You're right, If Tomlin is regarded as finished (sadly) then what are we talking about Arter for?

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£6m is expensive for a Championship club not in receipt of parachute payments!

Take a look at the transfer fees paid by Championship clubs this summer:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/cham...wettbewerb/GB2

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Originally Posted by surge

Should be noted that Brexit has reduced number of leagues we can realistically look at and so there will be fewer bargains from Europe now.

Look at them more and look at them better! Likes of Lex Immers, Glatzel, Zohore, Juan Cala, Magnus Wolf Eikrem all came from abroad in one way or another.

Our scouting at moment limited to players known through ties to Arsenal, Republic of Ireland and Wolves or Crewe. How many scouts do we actually have and what are they doing?

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You're right to highlight the Brexit issue and the complications. Our player base is predominantly English/Welsh (but mainly English) and as far as I am aware only Bacuna and D'Almeida are the only exceptions at present (I may be wrong). We have no European players. From what I can tell we have only 2 employed scouts and I do not know what they are doing. MMs RoI influence was a worry for me.

I don't think there are any bargains anywhere anymore. That's why I think if we're going to consider £6M too expensive (compared to the spaffed millions of just a couple of seasons ago) then what are the board's plans for the club?

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Originally Posted by LeningradCowboy

£6m is expensive for a Championship club not in receipt of parachute payments!

Take a look at the transfer fees paid by Championship clubs this summer:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/cham...wettbewerb/GB2

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Vincent Tan's net worth is circa $1.6 Billion. I think we're a spreadsheet and should stop making excuses. The Transfer market only tells a part of the story. We have a very wealthy owner and we're scrounging around in the bargain basement? Doesn't add up. Literally. And anyway, we were in receipt of parachute payments. Isn't that a point worth remembering. What did we do with that money and how wisely did we spend it? Isn't that what this discussion is all about really and why we're even discussing someone like Harry Arter?

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Originally Posted by The Hooded Claw

Careful, fella. You’ll have the “How very dare you criticise the club, therefore you must support Swansea” brigade on to you!

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It's OK, I kind of hear the reply in my head as I'm posting but I know what you mean.

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Originally Posted by surge

Should be noted that Brexit has reduced number of leagues we can realistically look at and so there will be fewer bargains from Europe now.

Look at them more and look at them better! Likes of Lex Immers, Glatzel, Zohore, Juan Cala, Magnus Wolf Eikrem all came from abroad in one way or another.

Our scouting at moment limited to players known through ties to Arsenal, Republic of Ireland and Wolves or Crewe. How many scouts do we actually have and what are they doing?

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Majority of them above were known by the managers at the time. They weren’t scouted as such

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Originally Posted by Rjk

Thing is, we can't blame Warnock for that kind of think. Managers generally last less than 2 years in a job. Many of them aren't going to care if they're saddling the club with years of using up their whole wage bill for players who won't play - if they can get the best players for the season they are in. If they have one good year they'll get a job elsewhere and the mess will be someone else's problem.
The fault lies with the people who allow them to behave like that.

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My post was just carrying on from the theme of knocking him for expensive contracts. I agree with the rest of what you said

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Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew

Vincent Tan's net worth is circa $1.6 Billion. I think we're a spreadsheet and should stop making excuses. The Transfer market only tells a part of the story. We have a very wealthy owner and we're scrounging around in the bargain basement? Doesn't add up. Literally. And anyway, we were in receipt of parachute payments. Isn't that a point worth remembering. What did we do with that money and how wisely did we spend it? Isn't that what this discussion is all about really and why we're even discussing someone like Harry Arter?

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The thing is, we have to comply with FFP rules. Tan can’t throw tens of millions at us even if he wanted to.

Luckily and sensibly the throwing sums like 6m at players at this level is over.

No parachute payments we cant do it even if we could.

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Originally Posted by Punxsutawney Phil

The thing is, we have to comply with FFP rules. Tan can’t throw tens of millions at us even if he wanted to.

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I agree and am aware that there are FFP rules. I guess my frustration at the moment is I feel we're stale. More to the point, the board is stale. Choo and Dalman have overseen two promotions and two immediate relegations. Their sanctioning of transfer fees, salaries, and appointments of managers have all cost the club dearly.

If Tan saw us as a living breathing football club and was genuinely interested, then new board appointments should surely have had to follow after allowing the squad to become as financially bloated with average players as they did (there's been one but he is another non-football guy and as I've questioned before, nobody seems to know what his actual role is) The bucks stop with the board and Tan. They are directly responsible (that's what they are paid for and is their job) for the two relegations. You can't claim the successes and forget about the failures. Going up once and coming down straight away was bad enough. To do it twice is unforgivable. The thing is, with our current set-up, we're likely to do it a third time too.

We've been caught napping since the lifting of lockdown. I see very little to no marketing of our club. The shop is badly managed. The ticket office is badly managed. For me, there's a kind of feeling of no hands-on senior management. It's just a feeling. That's why I'm frustrated that Harry Arter is even a discussion on here when I feel there are bigger issues at the club.

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Originally Posted by Hilts

Luckily and sensibly the throwing sums like 6m at players at this level is over.

No parachute payments we cant do it even if we could.

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I don't understand why you say 'luckily' but I agree with 'sensibly', But it wasn't that long ago that £6M was thrown at Gary Madine. I don't disagree with what you're saying under the current circumstances, I'd just prefix the whole post with 'we f*cked it up".

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/card...rde/verein/603

8th most expensive, Manga, was worth the fee paid as was 12th most expensive (Smithies), 14th most expensive (Morrison), 19th most (Kimbo), 24th most (Thorne) and 25th (Vaulks) but we could have swerved on every other one on that first page and spent the money better elsewhere.

Not sure how it fits to this thread other than to say high transfer fees isn't all that and it being another post saying Brentford investing into talent ID with lower transfer fees paid is to be admired.