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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Oh I am more than happy to get stuck in if necessary
Especially with you and your little warriors
Go and hide in Mothercare you wet blanket.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
J R Hartley
Go and hide in Mothercare you wet blanket.
Those were the days
Long before your time
It was all dancing behind invisible walls by the time you stopped sucking your thumb
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Those were the days
Long before your time
It was all dancing behind invisible walls by the time you stopped sucking your thumb
If you say so Linus.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
J R Hartley
If you say so Linus.
Well you would know about days we nearly came unstuck like Exeter and Lincoln if you were there
X
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Well you would know about days we nearly came unstuck like Exeter and Lincoln if you were there
X
You used to carry clecks to the police ive been told.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
J R Hartley
You used to carry clecks to the police ive been told.
https://www.ccmb.co.uk/showthread.ph...ay-games/page3
Northampton
Were you watching from the hot dog fan ?
That got turned over
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Been to Northampton twice. Once to the old cricket ground, a Friday night game in our promotion season under Eddie May. We won 2-1 I think and Rogger Gibbins come over to ask fans to calm down after invading the pitch.
The 2nd time a very eventful evening 1997 second leg play off. Fair to say Cardiff did not have it their own way on or off the pitch that night.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
J R Hartley
Been to Northampton twice. Once to the old cricket ground, a Friday night game in our promotion season under Eddie May. We won 2-1 I think and Rogger Gibbins come over to ask fans to calm down after invading the pitch.
The 2nd time a very eventful evening 1997 second leg play off. Fair to say Cardiff did not have it their own way on or off the pitch that night.
I couldn't agree more
It was like zulu on that slope
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Don't get lost or anything
8 miles. Dog loved it. Saw a fella on the way back, near the car who was doing 27 miles. Fair play to the old fella that's a cracking effort. My dog is already snoring her little head off. ****ed.
Word is you get lost in the aisles at mothercare :tongue:
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dembe
8 miles. Dog loved it. Saw a fella on the way back, near the car who was doing 27 miles. Fair play to the old fella that's a cracking effort. My dog is already snoring her little head off. ****ed.
Word is you get lost in the aisles at mothercare :tongue:
If you are working so hard as you always tell us then how come on a Tuesday afternoon you can naff off around a lake up the valleys for four hours ?
It's the dog I feel sorry for but at least it can have a doze and a rest from you for a few hours
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
If you are working so hard as you always tell us then how come on a Tuesday afternoon you can naff off around a lake up the valleys for four hours ?
It's the dog I feel sorry for but at least it can have a doze and a rest from you for a few hours
Excellent time management skills.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Do you use that arguement for every football game played under every manager ?
Because unless you do then even man City etc have seasons when they win ....or lose something by a referee mistake or a decision made by the manager
You can't have the penny and the bun
We didn't lose because of a decision by a referee. We got relegated because the manager was completely out of his depth. And he didn't lose 1 or 2 games he lost 24.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
We didn't lose because of a decision by a referee. We got relegated because the manager was completely out of his depth. And he didn't lose 1 or 2 games he lost 24.
So every time a managers team gets relegated from the Premier league .....even if its just by a few points .....the manager is completely out of his depth ?
What's your criteria?
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
So every time a managers team gets relegated from the Premier league .....even if its just by a few points .....the manager is completely out of his depth ?
What's your criteria?
No. But Warnock certainly was. Do I really have to list criteria? Just look at his record. It speaks for itself.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
No. But Warnock certainly was. Do I really have to list criteria? Just look at his record. It speaks for itself.
How many points were we adrift of safety ?
Completely out of his depth would be Nathan Jones or the current sheff United boss ?
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCBlue
We didn't lose because of a decision by a referee. We got relegated because the manager was completely out of his depth. And he didn't lose 1 or 2 games he lost 24.
I feel that after we deservedly won at Brighton, most people supporting other clubs would have backed us to stay up. However, Warnock has admitted himself he got his selection and tactics wrong in the very winnable match at doomed Fulham with those who believe such things alleging his substitutions were more down to who a player’s agent was.
Trying to be even handed about this, I would argue that Warnock’s “plucky little Cardiff” line was partly responsible for a disastrous first three months of the season (admittedly we did have several very testing fixtures during this time). Then we had a spell of about five months where we won enough matches to almost claw back the gap with Brighton and you can’t just say that Warnock played no part in that improvement, but we then got that Fulham game all wrong and we lost what was a winnable home game against a Palace team with nothing to play for and so all of that good work was undone.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
I think there are plenty of other managers who have been more out of their depth than warnock in the top flight
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
I feel that after we deservedly won at Brighton, most people supporting other clubs would have backed us to stay up. However, Warnock has admitted himself he got his selection and tactics wrong in the very winnable match at doomed Fulham with those who believe such things alleging his substitutions were more down to who a player’s agent was.
Trying to be even handed about this, I would argue that Warnock’s “plucky little Cardiff” line was partly responsible for a disastrous first three months of the season (admittedly we did have several very testing fixtures during this time). Then we had a spell of about five months where we won enough matches to almost claw back the gap with Brighton and you can’t just say that Warnock played no part in that improvement, but we then got that Fulham game all wrong and we lost what was a winnable home game against a Palace team with nothing to play for and so all of that good work was undone.
I think that's why it's remembered the way it is.
We didn't even have any heartbreak. Not like we had tight or exciting games v fulham or Palace. Had they been nail biting games with late goals etc it may have been seen as heartbreak or disappointment. Instead it wasn't. Just non events of games where it felt we were done and didn't turn up. Strange.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
I think there are plenty of other managers who have been more out of their depth than warnock in the top flight
Has he ever kept a side in the top flight, let alone established them in the division?
Hes a second division manager. Always has been.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
I feel that after we deservedly won at Brighton, most people supporting other clubs would have backed us to stay up. However, Warnock has admitted himself he got his selection and tactics wrong in the very winnable match at doomed Fulham with those who believe such things alleging his substitutions were more down to who a player’s agent was.
Trying to be even handed about this, I would argue that Warnock’s “plucky little Cardiff” line was partly responsible for a disastrous first three months of the season (admittedly we did have several very testing fixtures during this time). Then we had a spell of about five months where we won enough matches to almost claw back the gap with Brighton and you can’t just say that Warnock played no part in that improvement, but we then got that Fulham game all wrong and we lost what was a winnable home game against a Palace team with nothing to play for and so all of that good work was undone.
He lost his top signing and felt some guilt no doubt, that flight ended our season in two ways we lost the 2nd best french goal scoring striker (for the first half of that season) and it affected Warnock and derailed our season.
If he had taken a regular flight and missed a few hours of training we would have stayed up and done miles better than Luton.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
I think that's why it's remembered the way it is.
We didn't even have any heartbreak. Not like we had tight or exciting games v fulham or Palace. Had they been nail biting games with late goals etc it may have been seen as heartbreak or disappointment. Instead it wasn't. Just non events of games where it felt we were done and didn't turn up. Strange.
Yes.
Some believe we were 1 win away from staying up that season, in the same way they believe only a Reading points deduction saved us last season. Both have a ring of truth from the end of season table but, in reality, neither panned out like that.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
These points tallies fluctuate. The average points for a team finishing in 18th since the PL became a 20-team division is 35.2. Only 7 teams have won fewer than 34 points and only once has that happened since we were relegated from the PL (Fulham in 2020/21 finished in 18th with 28 points). In fact, since the 20-team PL in 1995/96, the points of the team finishing in 18th has been varied and there's no suggestion that more recent sides finishing in 18th have had worse points tallies than those 20 years before.
By a strange coincidence neil has 104 points in 112 games.
That would mean an average of 35.2 points a season. Exactly the average of teams finishing 18th.
Considering the only teams he has managed are shef u cardiff and qpr- 3 unfancied teams he took up and Palace who were struggling it's not a bad return at all.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
By a strange coincidence neil has 104 points in 112 games.
That would mean an average of 35.2 points a season. Exactly the average of teams finishing 18th.
Considering the only teams he has managed are shef u cardiff and qpr- 3 unfancied teams he took up and Palace who were struggling it's not a bad return at all.
Good stats. I think that sums Warnock up. Has kept up some poor sides and won promotion with teams that probably wouldn't have been close. He's not always got it right in the second tier, but his record is good (he's past it now).
His approach hasn't been quite right for the PL, though. I think if he could have kept us up in his first full season in the division, that would have been among his biggest triumphs.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
By a strange coincidence neil has 104 points in 112 games.
That would mean an average of 35.2 points a season. Exactly the average of teams finishing 18th.
Considering the only teams he has managed are shef u cardiff and qpr- 3 unfancied teams he took up and Palace who were struggling it's not a bad return at all.
Warnock's never managed a "fancied" team in his life, he's supposed to have turned down Chelsea once, but they were nothing like the club they are now at the time. Warnock's all about managing underdogs and you can't deny his record in the second tier is very good - for example, what he did with Rotherham just before he joined us was remarkable. He's prospered with unfashionable Championship sides on a consistent basis, but whatever the magic is, it doesn't work when those unfashionable sides get to the top flight - if I had to guess, I'd say that the better a player is, the harder they find it to buy into his methods.
It would have been interesting to see what would have happened to Whitts under Warnock if he was two or three years younger. When he left for Blackburn, it couldn't really be said that it was down to Warnock forcing Whitts out because in 2017 he wasn't the player that he once had been. My suspicion is that, even if Whitts had been in his late twenties when Warnock arrived, he would've been someone who Warnock was looking to replace.
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Warnock's never managed a "fancied" team in his life, he's supposed to have turned down Chelsea once, but they were nothing like the club they are now at the time. Warnock's all about managing underdogs and you can't deny his record in the second tier is very good - for example, what he did with Rotherham just before he joined us was remarkable. He's prospered with unfashionable Championship sides on a consistent basis, but whatever the magic is, it doesn't work when those unfashionable sides get to the top flight - if I had to guess, I'd say that the better a player is, the harder they find it to buy into his methods.
It would have been interesting to see what would have happened to Whitts under Warnock if he was two or three years younger. When he left for Blackburn, it couldn't really be said that it was down to Warnock forcing Whitts out because in 2017 he wasn't the player that he once had been. My suspicion is that, even if Whitts had been in his late twenties when Warnock arrived, he would've been someone who Warnock was looking to replace.
Not so sure about that , Whittingham was the outstanding Championship player of that decade and Warnock would have been shrewd enough to have found a way to include him, same as he did with Adel Taraabt at QPR
What he did at Rotherham was indeed remarkable, as was turning us from a relegation shambles of a team to a promotion winning side in a season and a half
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Re: Looking at Burnley shef United and Luton did we actually do quite well in the Premier under warnock
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Don Corleone
Not so sure about that , Whittingham was the outstanding Championship player of that decade and Warnock would have been shrewd enough to have found a way to include him, same as he did with Adel Taraabt at QPR
What he did at Rotherham was indeed remarkable, as was turning us from a relegation shambles of a team to a promotion winning side in a season and a half
It was a shambles of a team but that was mainly down to Trollope. That's not saying that what Warnock did wasn't superb, because it was, but the side should never have been down the bottom as they were.
