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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wash DC Blue
Very cool.
Enjoy the rest of your trip!
I hope he stays away from the Capital building if Harris loses!
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
I hope he stays away from the Capital building if Harris loses!
Your confusion is complete. :hehe:
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Such fascinating analysis! It's a wonder the election is so close!
Playing the man rather than the ball I see James. Seems you and the critical thinkers are unable to answer my question - can’t say I’m shocked.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I asked Dorcus this the other day (and he didn't reply) but what about the last Trump presidency was so disastrous? Actual things now, not hurty words.
I get the arguments about what an obnoxious and weird prick he is, but the world was better, no?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
az city
Do you mean apart from gutting the EPA, raising the national debt by the biblical amount of $8.2T (effectively fueling asset price inflation and adding to inequality), the shameful response to Covid, stacking SCOTUS with venal chancers (leading to presidential immunity and the ending of a woman's right to choose), fawning over Un and Putin (who knows how that affected Putin's Ukraine decision to invade), rampant racist bigotry (Trump quite openly supported white supremacists and still uses KKK hand signs), and, of course, attempting to subvert democracy with an armed insurrection which led to 7 deaths?
You're an idiot.
So from that list, all you had was "He didn't end a woman's right to choose. He passed it to the states. The fact you can't even get that right undermines everything you say. "
Although az clearly says that it was the stacking of SCOTUS that led to that.
Anyway, let's see how we get on with:
Withdrew the USA from the Paris Agreement
Called for a violent far-right group to stand by during a Presidential Debate
Got impeached twice
Repeatedly threatened to leave NATO in order to bully us and our allies, and leaving the West weaker
Relaxed gun control laws leading to the biggest single year jump in murders (30% increase in 2020)
Didn't build the wall and Mexico didn't pay for it
Surely somewhere in this lot is the reason why a huge list of Republicans from his own Vice President and over half of his cabinet downwards have publicly opposed his candidacy. Take a look at the list; it's a lot longer than even I thought it would be.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ntial_campaign
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Playing the man rather than the ball I see James. Seems you and the critical thinkers are unable to answer my question - can’t say I’m shocked.
Do you expect no (far milder) response when someone calls someone an idiot then? Is that not "playing the man"? If you want to play judge, you should be more consistent. Now what was your question, sorry?
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
lardy
So from that list, all you had was "He didn't end a woman's right to choose. He passed it to the states. The fact you can't even get that right undermines everything you say. "
Although az clearly says that it was the stacking of SCOTUS that led to that.
Anyway, let's see how we get on with:
Withdrew the USA from the Paris Agreement
Called for a violent far-right group to stand by during a Presidential Debate
Got impeached twice
Repeatedly threatened to leave NATO in order to bully us and our allies, and leaving the West weaker
Relaxed gun control laws leading to the biggest single year jump in murders (30% increase in 2020)
Didn't build the wall and Mexico didn't pay for it
Surely somewhere in this lot is the reason why a huge list of Republicans from his own Vice President and over half of his cabinet downwards have publicly opposed his candidacy. Take a look at the list; it's a lot longer than even I thought it would be.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ntial_campaign
In fairness when the question was put to Dorcus it was in response to the threat to the global community "world war three" and the like, which I don't think the evidence stacks up on.
I dont doubt there's a list of criticisms of his time in power - most people wouldn't dispute them. First and foremost for me was the shocking response to the 2020 election result, which whilst tight was plainly an attempt at keeping in power.
But criticisms can be levelled at all governments. It doesn't explain why the 2025 election is so tight. Because if it was all bad then plainly it wouldn't be. One basic law of politics is that someone's reasons to vote for someone is not usually the same reason for someone else to not vote for them.
On the international stage, you do mention NATO. But one mans bullying is another man's trying to get memberships to pay the fee they are committed to instead of disproportionately relying upon others.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
I found this quite an interesting article as a starting point in understanding why people vote for Trump.
https://theconversation.com/why-do-p...hinking-239031
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Do you expect no (far milder) response when someone calls someone an idiot then? Is that not "playing the man"? If you want to play judge, you should be more consistent. Now what was your question, sorry?
Well, when you set yourself up as the, self appointed, guardian of standards and balanced thinking on politics on here, I rather did expect better, yes.
What has Trump done to help humanity at large which did not involve a benefit to himself and his like?
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Just read it, an exercise in the bleeding obvious. I could understand why people voted for Trump in 2016 perhaps, but to just dismiss what’s happened since then and still favour him today means objective judgment does not apply here, it’s just a cult.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Well, when you set yourself up as the, self appointed, guardian of standards and balanced thinking on politics on here, I rather did expect better, yes.
What has Trump done to help humanity at large which did not involve a benefit to himself and his like?
I don't. But if I called someone out for the gentlest of mocking and ignored people being called idiots I would expect to have that pointed out to me.
Probably the stand out example would be meeting the leader of North Korea and showing that peaceful outcomes are possible. That said the alternative view is that it validates the leader of literally the world's most opressed people. I think he is also right to want to tighten borders to the south. I think he is also right to push for NATO members that underpay to up their spending. Again, a few posts up this is what I assume was being pointed to as a negative.
What have other leaders done particularly?
I don't like him. He's probably not a nice person, but the discourse on here and elsewhere is just so binary, so black and white and I'm sorry I just don't think that's realistic.
It's exactly the same tone that many deployed in the run up to our election and lo and behold, new government, same problems.
I think the inability to see the other side to a big problem in itself
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I don't. But if I called someone out for the gentlest of mocking and ignored people being called idiots I would expect to have that pointed out to me.
Probably the stand out example would be meeting the leader of North Korea and showing that peaceful outcomes are possible. That said the alternative view is that it validates the leader of literally the world's most opressed people. I think he is also right to want to tighten borders to the south. I think he is also right to push for NATO members that underpay to up their spending. Again, a few posts up this is what I assume was being pointed to as a negative.
What have other leaders done particularly?
I don't like him. He's probably not a nice person, but the discourse on here and elsewhere is just so binary, so black and white and I'm sorry I just don't think that's realistic.
It's exactly the same tone that many deployed in the run up to our election and lo and behold, new government, same problems.
I think the inability to see the other side to a big problem in itself
I gave Trump credit at the time for visiting North Korea, but, just like with Putin, Trump seemed in awe of Kim Jong Un - Neville Chamberlain is despised by many because he’s seen as an appeaser, Trump came across as one during his time as President and, any way, we were hardly on the brink of war with Russia or North Korea when he met those countries leaders, so I’m not sure how he benefited humanity there.
With Trump at least, the reason political discussion on here is so binary is that he’s just about the most binary politician I’ve ever know - the polls in America with their tiny percentage of don’t know voters tell you that.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I don't. But if I called someone out for the gentlest of mocking and ignored people being called idiots I would expect to have that pointed out to me.
Probably the stand out example would be meeting the leader of North Korea and showing that peaceful outcomes are possible. That said the alternative view is that it validates the leader of literally the world's most opressed people. I think he is also right to want to tighten borders to the south. I think he is also right to push for NATO members that underpay to up their spending. Again, a few posts up this is what I assume was being pointed to as a negative.
What have other leaders done particularly?
I don't like him. He's probably not a nice person, but the discourse on here and elsewhere is just so binary, so black and white and I'm sorry I just don't think that's realistic.
It's exactly the same tone that many deployed in the run up to our election and lo and behold, new government, same problems.
I think the inability to see the other side to a big problem in itself
If he wants to tighten the borders in the south, why did he instruct republicans to block the bipartisan immigration bill earlier this year?
Trump comments on NATO spending facts: https://edition.cnn.com/2024/02/13/p...ato/index.html
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
lardy
Probably views it as not going far enough, but largely playing politics as he knows it's an area the Democrats are weak on. Also something something Ukraine.
I'm not sure the link is that helpful. Many NATO countries do spend far less on their militaries than the US (and others) and should spend more as per NATO agreements. It doesn't strike me as unreasonable to push on this and certainly doesn't weaken the west to do it.
There are loads of reasons to criticise Trump, I don't see this as a strong one though
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
I gave Trump credit at the time for visiting North Korea, but, just like with Putin, Trump seemed in awe of Kim Jong Un - Neville Chamberlain is despised by many because he’s seen as an appeaser, Trump came across as one during his time as President and, any way, we were hardly on the brink of war with Russia or North Korea when he met those countries leaders, so I’m not sure how he benefited humanity there.
With Trump at least, the reason political discussion on here is so binary is that he’s just about the most binary politician I’ve ever know - the polls in America with their tiny percentage of don’t know voters tell you that.
I agree, he is himself extremely binary and divisive. A product of something he has partly made himself. But this goes far deeper and you did casually refer to his voters, which are very diverse in number and background as being in a cult, so I think recognising the contribution all of us make to that culture and trying to row back from it is useful.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Probably views it as not going far enough, but largely playing politics as he knows it's an area the Democrats are weak on. Also something something Ukraine.
I'm not sure the link is that helpful. Many NATO countries do spend far less on their militaries than the US (and others) and should spend more as per NATO agreements. It doesn't strike me as unreasonable to push on this and certainly doesn't weaken the west to do it.
There are loads of reasons to criticise Trump, I don't see this as a strong one though
He doesn't want the border to improve (and it has) as it is an election year and he's not currently the president. That's why, not because he thinks the bill doesn't go far enough. As said earlier in this thread, Trump is concerned with himself and absolutely no one else.
Just today, Trump said he would use the military on American citizens, that he called "radical left loonies", during elections. It is about time to stop giving him the benefit of the doubt and seeing him as just a regular candidate.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
jon1959
In West Dover, Vermont today (for 3 days). Started in Washington, then train to Philadelphia, then train to New York, then train to Boston to pick up a hire car. Been to Kennebunkport (shrines to Bush senior!), Bar Harbour and Jackson. Back to Boston early next week and fly home on Friday. Never been to the USA before (apart from transiting through airports). An experience - and more so because of the election campaign.
On my first US road trips and before the interweb was around I landed in Washington DC on an RAF plane and paid a mere £35 to sit on an uncomfortable seat in the cargo hold and I was served cordial by a sweaty flight sergeant in-between visits to the only conventional male urinals I have ever come across in the air.
After hiring a car and wending my way up to Maine I was persuaded by a brochure advertising Quegee Gorge as Vermont's answer to the Grand Canyon. I did quite a detour to find a trickle of water at the foot of a tiny and insignificant decline akin to a railway cutting!
Don't be duped, Jon!
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Yeah its a flip of a coin now, basically all polls are within error margins of either result.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Just read it, an exercise in the bleeding obvious. I could understand why people voted for Trump in 2016 perhaps, but to just dismiss what’s happened since then and still favour him today means objective judgment does not apply here, it’s just a cult.
Looking in from the outside its hard to understand, but certain sections of the US media are spending every waking minute convincing their viewership that Harris is even more extreme than Trump.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Rjk
Looking in from the outside its hard to understand, but certain sections of the US media are spending every waking minute convincing their viewership that Harris is even more extreme than Trump.
While you convince yourself that she isn't?
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
While you convince yourself that she isn't?
Wibble, do tell us why you think she is extreme.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
az city
Wibble, do tell us why you think she is extreme.
I think that is a question for the US electorate to answer, not an extreme leftist from Cardiff.
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
I think that is a question for the US electorate to answer, not an extreme leftist from Cardiff.
Have you EVER given a straight answer to a question asked ?
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Packerman
Have you EVER given a straight answer to a question asked ?
Which one would you choose, Make America Great Again or Make America Trash Again? :sherlock:
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
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Originally Posted by
Wales-Bales
Which one would you choose, Make America Great Again or Make America Trash Again? :sherlock:
MATA for me!
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Re: U.S. government is manipulating the weather - hurricane Milton was engineered
When was America ever trash before eh eh eh?
USA USA USA! 🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲
