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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...tana-new-party
Zack Polanski, the Green party leadership candidate, has said he may be willing to cooperate with a new leftwing party led by Jeremy Corbyn and Zarah Sultana, after calls for the two groups to form an alliance.
Polanski emphasised that any decision would be for Green members, and would depend on the eventual form of the as yet unnamed party, which currently does not officially exist.
His comments to the Guardian open up a divide with his competitors for the leadership, Adrian Ramsay and Ellie Chowns, who have warned against the Greens becoming “a Jeremy Corbyn support act”.
A day after Corbyn and Sultana jointly launched a website for people to register interest, with the interim title of Your Party, a leftwing campaign group called for it to seek a formal alliance with the Greens in England and Wales.
We Deserve Better, which argues for electoral pacts on the left, said a united ticket for the Greens and the new party had the potential to unseat dozens of Labour MPs, whereas both running could split the vote.
Polanski, the Greens’ deputy leader, has built his push for the leadership around the idea of making the party a mass-membership “eco-populism” organisation that could take on not only Labour but also Reform UK.
where is the benefit of taking seats off Labour? surely the aim should be to take seats of the Tories and/or Reform...otherwise the left wing vote is being split...
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HiVis
where is the benefit of taking seats off Labour? surely the aim should be to take seats of the Tories and/or Reform...otherwise the left wing vote is being split...
If this new party looks like it could beat reform by acting as a magnet for the left then I vote for them in a heartbeat . I think Labour is possibly finished .
But if it just splutters along it will just hand reform the election by splitting the vote
As it stands its a dogs dinner
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
If this new party looks like it could beat reform by acting as a magnet for the left then I vote for them in a heartbeat . I think Labour is possibly finished .
But if it just splutters along it will just hand reform the election by splitting the vote
As it stands its a dogs dinner
Factor in the upcoming 16+ vote and things could get very exciting! 🍿
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
Factor in the upcoming 16+ vote and things could get very exciting! 🍿
I think given how utterly hopeless Labour is at the moment I think that the next election will have to be the leader .....and I sincerely hope its not starmer ....please get rid of him .....saying to the left and centre left .......if you dont vote for us you are going to get a reform government
And hopefully enough people will hold their nose and press stick
That being said if things are as bad as I think they will be the polls will show absolutely no chance of defeating reform anyway so may as well vote for corbyn 😉
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
Factor in the upcoming 16+ vote and things could get very exciting! ��
Lowering the voting age to 16 will add 1.5m possible voters to the electoral roll.
More significant is the plan to introduce Automatic Voter Registration before the next election which will add 8 million (currently missing) possible voters to the electoral roll.
Most electoral number crunchers say that both these measures will benefit the left more than the right (although working out the impact on Reform is difficult) and will eventually lead to redrawn constituency boundaries (which are based on registered voters not population) that will increase inner city seats and reduce more affluent rural and London-commuter seats.
The Corbyn-Sultana Party had over 450,000 sign ups by late Friday!
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Re: New Party on the Left
Do you regard sign ups as membership then jon?.
They have a separate section for donations which perhaps is more akin to membership, but they haven't told us those figures.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
Lowering the voting age to 16 will add 1.5m possible voters to the electoral roll.
More significant is the plan to introduce Automatic Voter Registration before the next election which will add 8 million (currently missing) possible voters to the electoral roll.
Most electoral number crunchers say that both these measures will benefit the left more than the right (although working out the impact on Reform is difficult) and will eventually lead to redrawn constituency boundaries (which are based on registered voters not population) that will increase inner city seats and reduce more affluent rural and London-commuter seats.
The Corbyn-Sultana Party had over 450,000 sign ups by late Friday!
Reform are sneaky gits with regard to social media and have that side of things stitched up at the moment
Lots of young people will be swayed by his nonsense unfortunately
I went to a focus group on trying to stop reform the other day and they thought leafletting and knocking on doorbells was a good idea
I think some of them were completely clueless
I would say 20 percent of the country is now reform voting so its a waste of time trying to convince them otherwise
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
Lowering the voting age to 16 will add 1.5m possible voters to the electoral roll.
More significant is the plan to introduce Automatic Voter Registration before the next election which will add 8 million (currently missing) possible voters to the electoral roll.
Most electoral number crunchers say that both these measures will benefit the left more than the right (although working out the impact on Reform is difficult) and will eventually lead to redrawn constituency boundaries (which are based on registered voters not population) that will increase inner city seats and reduce more affluent rural and London-commuter seats.
The Corbyn-Sultana Party had over 450,000 sign ups by late Friday!
I think The Labour Party are finished unless they turn things round very quickly
Completely incompetent
But in the short term , before the next election , I will be amazed that there isn't a serious push to get Starmer out as leader
The cabinet is completely crap .....Reeves, Rayner , Cooper , Streeting , Lammy , Powell ....shes appalling
But Starmer is the leader of anti labour toxicity .....especially within the local parties
Hes got to go to give labour any chance of defeating reform , its abysmal from him and his troops
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Elwood Blues
Do you regard sign ups as membership then jon?.
They have a separate section for donations which perhaps is more akin to membership, but they haven't told us those figures.
No I don't see sign ups as the same as membership - but I would expect the majority of people who signed up to have also made donations (one off or monthly) in addition to giving all their contact details. The new party hasn't been set up and launched yet - so supporter sign ups is all that can be done. The left are often late for the revolution and fail to organise piss ups in breweries, but if this time the people behind this party can get their organisational act together and build a ground operation (which is already in place in parts of the MW, NE and London) it could be a major political force. An actual membership of 400-500,000 would not surprise me.
There are also advanced moves to put together an electoral pact between the Greens, Independents and the new party. Some of the independents are socially conservative - so that may not work for all of them - but some are already in agreement. The model is the New Popular Front in France (an alliance of left parties and individuals) that won the 2024 parliamentary election.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
I think The Labour Party are finished unless they turn things round very quickly
Completely incompetent
But in the short term , before the next election , I will be amazed that there isn't a serious push to get Starmer out as leader
The cabinet is completely crap .....Reeves, Rayner , Cooper , Streeting , Lammy , Powell ....shes appalling
But Starmer is the leader of anti labour toxicity .....especially within the local parties
Hes got to go to give labour any chance of defeating reform , its abysmal from him and his troops
I would be surprised if Labour ditch Starmer before the next election. Labour don't have the 'men in grey suits' system of culling party leaders who repel the voters, like the Tories do (or did). To remove Starmer there would have to be a major revolt in the PLP/cabinet backed by figures like Mandelson and the main donors. The big lobbyists and donors love Starmer - he is doing what they want to see!
If he was dumped, his successor is likely to be Wes Streeting (no other Cabinet member has 'shown') and he is at serious risk of losing his seat next time around. He scrapped in by a whisker last year against a pro-Palestine independent.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
I would be surprised if Labour ditch Starmer before the next election. Labour don't have the 'men in grey suits' system of culling party leaders who repel the voters, like the Tories do (or did). To remove Starmer there would have to be a major revolt in the PLP/cabinet backed by figures like Mandelson and the main donors. The big lobbyists and donors love Starmer - he is doing what they want to see!
If he was dumped, his successor is likely to be Wes Streeting (no other Cabinet member has 'shown') and he is at serious risk of losing his seat next time around. He scrapped in by a whisker last year against a pro-Palestine independent.
Think we might see something of a chicken run for Streeting and one or two others in danger of losing their seats as safer seats (not that there’s likely to be many of them based on what we’ve seen up to now) are found for them.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
I would be surprised if Labour ditch Starmer before the next election. Labour don't have the 'men in grey suits' system of culling party leaders who repel the voters, like the Tories do (or did). To remove Starmer there would have to be a major revolt in the PLP/cabinet backed by figures like Mandelson and the main donors. The big lobbyists and donors love Starmer - he is doing what they want to see!
If he was dumped, his successor is likely to be Wes Streeting (no other Cabinet member has 'shown') and he is at serious risk of losing his seat next time around. He scrapped in by a whisker last year against a pro-Palestine independent.
Streeting is going to have a real test over the next few months.
On the donations point in your previous post, i would be absolutely shocked if over half of the signups voluntarily gave money.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Think we might see something of a chicken run for Streeting and one or two others in danger of losing their seats as safer seats (not that thereÂ’s likely to be many of them based on what weÂ’ve seen up to now) are found for them.
The issue with doing that is it is so transparently sleezy. They will try and avoid that at all costs.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
I would be surprised if Labour ditch Starmer before the next election. Labour don't have the 'men in grey suits' system of culling party leaders who repel the voters, like the Tories do (or did). To remove Starmer there would have to be a major revolt in the PLP/cabinet backed by figures like Mandelson and the main donors. The big lobbyists and donors love Starmer - he is doing what they want to see!
If he was dumped, his successor is likely to be Wes Streeting (no other Cabinet member has 'shown') and he is at serious risk of losing his seat next time around. He scrapped in by a whisker last year against a pro-Palestine independent.
Well if Starmer remains in place thats going to hand the keys of power to Farage
I dont know anyone who thinks hes anything other than completely toxic .....and thats among Labour voters
So if he stays then feck em I will either give this new party a go or if its clearly going to be a farage victory then I will go green
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taunton Blue Genie
You may have to join us there then, old fruit.
No I will leave you to it you silly old plum
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
No I don't see sign ups as the same as membership - but I would expect the majority of people who signed up to have also made donations (one off or monthly) in addition to giving all their contact details. The new party hasn't been set up and launched yet - so supporter sign ups is all that can be done. The left are often late for the revolution and fail to organise piss ups in breweries, but if this time the people behind this party can get their organisational act together and build a ground operation (which is already in place in parts of the MW, NE and London) it could be a major political force. An actual membership of 400-500,000 would not surprise me.
There are also advanced moves to put together an electoral pact between the Greens, Independents and the new party. Some of the independents are socially conservative - so that may not work for all of them - but some are already in agreement. The model is the New Popular Front in France (an alliance of left parties and individuals) that won the 2024 parliamentary election.
An electoral pact between this new party would work if it was between other parties that had seats
Labour and The Liberal Democrats are the main players there so the former is unlikely
The Greens are not big enough and will surely only be relevant in 3 or 4 seats ��
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Well if Starmer remains in place thats going to hand the keys of power to Farage
I dont know anyone who thinks hes anything other than completely toxic .....and thats among Labour voters
So if he stays then feck em I will either give this new party a go or if its clearly going to be a farage victory then I will go green
Arise, Sir Farage, stop the boats and stop the shirkers :hehe:
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: New Party on the Left
The count from the weekend:
Attachment 6628
The latest figures this morning are closing on 600,000 sign ups. :thumbup:
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
The count from the weekend:
Attachment 6628
The latest figures this morning are closing on 600,000 sign ups. :thumbup:
I would love it to take off but my view is its going to be torn to bits by the nazi press and social media
And of course unless it flattens labour completely , no bad thing , it will just completely split the vote and resign left of centre politics to the dustbin of history whilst the new right just keeps bobbing along
Just sack the idiot starmer , it would be a lot easier
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Still, if three hundred thousand people signed up for something without a name or policies in an area of politics not to your liking you would definitely be making references to koolaid!
You've done exactly that.......... **** me........
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
You've done exactly that.......... **** me........
I don't deny it! It's proper weird!
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
I don't deny it! It's proper weird!
It really isn't. It's not like Corbyn and Sultana haven't got a back story. It's not like we have never heard of them. The people who have expressed an interest or who have donated (Me) will have a fair idea of what they will want to achieve, Add to that a right wing Labour party and the rise of far right scare politics, this feels like a natural reaction. It's certainly pleased me, which is no mean feat.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
It really isn't. It's not like Corbyn and Sultana haven't got a back story. It's not like we have never heard of them. The people who have expressed an interest or who have donated (Me) will have a fair idea of what they will want to achieve, Add to that a right wing Labour party and the rise of far right scare politics, this feels like a natural reaction. It's certainly pleased me, which is no mean feat.
It had to come eventually. Enough people are getting fed up of right wing delusion and a so called "Labour" party selling it's soul to the Devil.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
It really isn't. It's not like Corbyn and Sultana haven't got a back story. It's not like we have never heard of them. The people who have expressed an interest or who have donated (Me) will have a fair idea of what they will want to achieve, Add to that a right wing Labour party and the rise of far right scare politics, this feels like a natural reaction. It's certainly pleased me, which is no mean feat.
Fair enough. You definitely would argue very differently in another circumstance.
And what's the far-right you speak of? The BNP had an MEP a couple of decades or so back.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
It had to come eventually. Enough people are getting fed up of right wing delusion and a so called "Labour" party selling it's soul to the Devil.
But how will they make anything work? That's what I want to know. Otherwise it's just populist platitudes. And yes, that same accusation can (and is) thrown at other parties and at any new party but I never see any solutions from the people involved, just pointing to problems
Whats their solutions?
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jon1959
No I don't see sign ups as the same as membership - but I would expect the majority of people who signed up to have also made donations (one off or monthly) in addition to giving all their contact details. The new party hasn't been set up and launched yet - so supporter sign ups is all that can be done. The left are often late for the revolution and fail to organise piss ups in breweries, but if this time the people behind this party can get their organisational act together and build a ground operation (which is already in place in parts of the MW, NE and London) it could be a major political force. An actual membership of 400-500,000 would not surprise me.
There are also advanced moves to put together an electoral pact between the Greens, Independents and the new party. Some of the independents are socially conservative - so that may not work for all of them - but some are already in agreement. The model is the New Popular Front in France (an alliance of left parties and individuals) that won the 2024 parliamentary election.
Perhaps to follow our French brethren they should also use the term 'Popular Front
They could have the 'Islington Popular Front'
Or how about annoying the Mayor of London and naming it after where he comes from.......
Tooting!
The Tooting Popular Front.....has a nice ring to it but it rings a bell somehow.
I have got a slogan for them though
'Power to the People'!!!!
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Elwood Blues
Perhaps to follow our French brethren they should also use the term 'Popular Front
They could have the 'Islington Popular Front'
Or how about annoying the Mayor of London and naming it after where he comes from.......
Tooting!
The Tooting Popular Front.....has a nice ring to it but it rings a bell somehow.
I have got a slogan for them though
'Power to the People'!!!!
Power to the people! (Except in referendums the working classes voted for!) ✊
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
But how will they make anything work? That's what I want to know. Otherwise it's just populist platitudes. And yes, that same accusation can (and is) thrown at other parties and at any new party but I never see any solutions from the people involved, just pointing to problems
Whats their solutions?
How will Reform make anything work ?
What are their solutions ?
How long can they claim to be a new party and " working " on their policies ?
If thats going to apply to Corbyns lot then it certainly applies to your pin ups
Let's have it
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
But how will they make anything work? That's what I want to know. Otherwise it's just populist platitudes. And yes, that same accusation can (and is) thrown at other parties and at any new party but I never see any solutions from the people involved, just pointing to problems
Whats their solutions?
Just relax and wait and see. You might not be able to sabotage things this time.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
Just relax and wait and see. You might not be able to sabotage things this time.
In fairness to Jim, he's just concerned about Democracy on a larger scale and how it can affect us all. He's really hoping for some strong policies from this new political party whether he agrees with it or not, because as we know, he's balanced and fair. What a guy......
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
In fairness to Jim, he's just concerned about Democracy on a larger scale and how it can affect us all. He's really hoping for some strong policies from this new political party whether he agrees with it or not, because as we know, he's balanced and fair. What a guy......
Absolutely!
I've always said the country should have a democratic left-wing party to represent views held by some within the country 👍
Sultana has now put forward a proposed name; "The Left". Modelled on Germany's "Die Linke" presumably. I do not think it's a good name actually although I suppose it's easy to remember.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b2797982.html
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Absolutely!
I've always said the country should have a democratic left-wing party to represent views held by some within the country 👍
Sultana has now put forward a proposed name; "The Left". Modelled on Germany's "Die Linke" presumably. I do not think it's a good name actually although I suppose it's easy to remember.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b2797982.html
For once I agree with you: "The Left" is a poor choice of name. It will likely alienate at least as many as it will inspire. For what it's worth I think it's about time we had "The Progressive Party". A lot could be built upon it.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
For once I agree with you: "The Left" is a poor choice of name. It will likely alienate at least as many as it will inspire. For what it's worth I think it's about time we had "The Progressive Party". A lot could be built upon it.
I agree too. I would rather see something that was a break from the past and reflected the idea of a party 'for the many, not the few'. Something like The People's Party is a bit anodyne, and has been used in some form or other by the populist right as well as the left in other parts of Europe. But it needs to be 'new' and inclusive. It could even drop the word 'party' and use 'movement' or similar - to focus on collective action not just an organisational structure. That would also give a message that the new organisation was not all about elections and officeholding, but also about communal activity, self-help, campaigning, ideas and solutions to local and global problems.
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Re: New Party on the Left
If they are a socialist party, why not call themselves that? I appreciate that the better examples of that have already been taken mind, such as the Socialist Party, Socialist Labour Party (which is a good name).
I don't think progressive is a good term. It's arrogant and it carries with it easy to make accusations when (inevitably) they aren't progressive about something or other. "Progress" however, isn't a bad word for part of a name.
"People's Party" can be a decent name but it's easy to mock too if you are a smaller party and not supported by that many people.
It does make you realize how important a name is.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dorcus
For once I agree with you: "The Left" is a poor choice of name. It will likely alienate at least as many as it will inspire. For what it's worth I think it's about time we had "The Progressive Party". A lot could be built upon it.
I agree with Jim as well, it has to be softer than 'The Left' I'd call it 'The Break dance Party'
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
If they are a socialist party, why not call themselves that? I appreciate that the better examples of that have already been taken mind, such as the Socialist Party, Socialist Labour Party (which is a good name).
I don't think progressive is a good term. It's arrogant and it carries with it easy to make accusations when (inevitably) they aren't progressive about something or other. "Progress" however, isn't a bad word for part of a name.
"People's Party" can be a decent name but it's easy to mock too if you are a smaller party and not supported by that many people.
It does make you realize how important a name is.
Socialist and Left have been dirtied for many years, even those who don't fully understand the concept could be threatened by those words, that's what we've been fed for a long tme, sadly.
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
Socialist and Left have been dirtied for many years, even those who don't fully understand the concept could be threatened by those words, that's what we've been fed for a long tme, sadly.
Reform sounds quite non-threatening and cuddly!
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
I agree with Jim as well, it has to be softer than 'The Left' I'd call it 'The Break dance Party'
The dinner party? 🤷
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cyril evans awaydays
Reform sounds quite non-threatening and cuddly!
It's a good name as in one word it says what appeals to many: change.
Its not a good long term name though. What happens if/when they are in power for any time?! Or once things have been reformed?!
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Re: New Party on the Left
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
I agree with Jim as well, it has to be softer than 'The Left' I'd call it 'The Break dance Party'
The Party Party?
