This explains it well with references at the bottom if you'd like to study it in more depth.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
ISRAEL - THE PROMISE FROM GOD
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This explains it well with references at the bottom if you'd like to study it in more depth.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
ISRAEL - THE PROMISE FROM GOD
Thanks for that. So, that all comes from the Old Testament. But the Jews then went on to reject Jesus as the son of God, which leads us to the New Testament, so why do you appear to care so much for Jews over Muslims?
How can you be promised any thing by someone who is not real?Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
Is it like easter eggs from the bunny,gifts from santa.
That's a very pertinent and quality question. The short answer is that every genuine Christian serves and worships a Man who was born a Jew and will return as the 'Lion of the Tribe of Judah'.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
I promise you I will give you a proper and full answer to such a good question, but as I am taking my daughter to catch a plane at 5am tomorrow then I'd better sign off now and get back to you across this Easter weekend.
Have a good one :thumbup:
Not a lie at all. You made exactly the claim I said in a post last year. (Your response avoids the point).Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
It left me wondering about your Taliban-style Christianity and your fundamentalist (another thread, I know) Christian Zionism that puts you in lockstep with Israeli fascists and the racist far right of MAGA Republicans.
It was the chicken and egg question. Is your belief system a product of your politics, or do your political positions come from your belief system?
Either way it is indefensible.
It doesn't matter if all you do with what is in your head is shout at traffic lights. But you claim to be very active across a lot of social media peddling these views. Whilst some may be grateful for being battered over the head with biblical quotes, it is the real life consequences of what you preach that counts. At this time the consequences are mass murder (over 70% of the 40,000+ deaths are women and children), displacement, pain, starvation and terror.
Yeah, but it’s all Hamas’ fault, apparently :ohwell:
Jon, another excellent post with considered argument and demonstrating remarkable patience. I'm beginning to ask a few questions here though. I'd be interested in yours and others take on this. I'm not sure I possess the f*cking resolve patience or will to continue.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon1959
In the complex tapestry of global religious and political discussion, the challenge of engaging with individuals holding extreme, fundamentalist views, particularly those who justify violence through religious prophecies, is a futile one. Surely?
For me, this question becomes especially pertinent when discussing extremists who cite prophecies as justifications for genocide, ethnic cleansing, starvation, and other atrocities in the 21st century. It is essential to acknowledge that these positions starkly contrast with the fundamental teachings of Jesus, who preached love, compassion, and peace. Jesus, a Jew, taught principles that are diametrically opposed to any form of violence or hatred. Additionally, the ideology of Zionism, with its political and territorial ambitions, often rejects the New Testament, creating a further disconnect from the Christian messages of love and reconciliation.
But in the same way, there are, in some people's eyes, real and true Cardiff City supporters. It seems that in truthpaste's world, this applies to Christians too.
The dialogue with individuals holding such extremist beliefs presents a considerable challenge (under-f*cking-statement). On one hand, it is tempting to argue that reason and evidence-based dialogue can bridge divides and soften hardline stances. On the other hand, when beliefs are deeply entrenched and supported by a conviction in divine sanction, the scope for productive dialogue narrows significantly.
Referencing religious prophecy to justify severe human rights violations raises the question: are we witnessing not just a refusal to engage in meaningful discussion but potentially a form of trolling or even geopolitical destabilisation?
The use of such conflicts by extremists to further their narratives, irrespective of the human cost, points to a deep-seated fanaticism.
When engaging in discussions, surely it is crucial to distinguish between faith and the misuse of religious texts to support inhumane agendas. The endgame of dialogues with individuals who adopt fanatical religious beliefs to justify violence poses a significant challenge.
Doesn't this force us to consider whether certain forms of engagement, rather than fostering understanding, might inadvertently legitimise or embolden extremist viewpoints?
In summary. Are we wasting our f*cking time?
Sadly, yes. I think we are.
Nobody in this discussion has said that, so if you are going to weigh in then stick to the facts.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
The main disconnection is you can (Jon-like) spout the bile re the texts, but you are not willing to examine any evidence for their validity or otherwise, so all we are left with is a drive-thru look at an issue and jumping to a quickest convenient and popular majority viewpoint whilst trashing anyone who thinks differently.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew
If you can't ask *questions to understand (which some actually now have) where other people are coming from, then you are not really engaging the discussion.
* For example I asked Jon to support his world-view and he's typed loads of words since I asked but is unable to address why he believes what he believes; so all he is left with is bile.
I'll try and keep this as concise as possible as there are many aspects to this, and I will attempt to keep it jargon free too:-Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
Before Abraham (who became the first Jew) met with Almighty God his family faith involved praying to a moon god a number of times per day; after he had met the God of the Bible he was promised that his seed would become a nation that would bless the entire world; the key way this would happen would be because one of his offspring (some 2000 years later) would be born (on His mother's side, Mary) in Bethlehem; the Lord Jesus Christ of course. Jesus later explained that only via His death and resurrection were individuals (by trusting in Him) able to get right with God and have an eternal home in Heaven, free from death, sorrow and pain.
Now Abraham like many of us was an impatient guy and decided he'd waited long enough for Sarah his wife to produce this son of promise, so he slept with his maidservent and produced a son, Ishmael. Later on God showed that He could be trusted and Sarah gave birth to Isaac who later had a son Jacob. God changed Jacob's name to Israel and he produced 12 sons who individually seeded each tribe of Israel right down to the present day. In other words, Jacob's son Judah, produced the Tribe of Judah and Mary was one of Judah's descendants therefore Christ was born into that Tribe (which was his human heritage); his Father being God, hence the miracle of the virgin birth.
Jesus, as you will know is the One all Christian's believe in and the One they know will return to rule on Earth in a coming day; you may remember saying a section of the Lord's prayer - "....thy kingdom come, they will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven...".
So as you can see, the 'King of the Jews' is essentially and eternally connected to Christians for ever.
But that does leave one big question, what about that other son, Ishmael? Well Ishmael didn't follow the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, he followed the family religion, and worshipped the moon god, praying a number of times a day to that same god.
Therefore it is no mystery that every Mosque has a moon visible on the outside of the building. I've included an image of the one in Cardiff Bay, see what is placed at the highest point....!
There's a lot more to add to this including why the Jews will be key in the God's Plans in the near future (having been set aside to allow the Church to be God's 'mouthpiece' since 30AD); so if you have more questions then I'd be happy to add the details in the areas that you'd like more information on. But also bear this in mind, I haven't just picked a religious book off the shelf, I've examined thousands of claims in the Bible over the last 45 years and realised that ultimately it's content couldn't have possibly only come from the 40 human authors, it must have originated OUTSIDE our time and space.
Attachment 6126
Bile?! Only in your head. Thanks for confirming just how fanatical and extremist dangerous troll you are. This will be the last time I feed you.Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
I don't eat fast food. So nothing lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew
Well done on setting up the God thread and being honest enough look for answers.
Most people start by spitting blood so no worries.
Back with the Crisis:
This REPORT is from early this morning by CNN
Devastation in Gaza as Israel wages war on Hamas
President Joe Biden said Saudi Arabia and other Arab countries are “prepared to fully recognize Israel” during remarks at an off-camera fundraiser Thursday night, according to reporters in the room.
Biden repeated calls for a “post-Gaza plan” for Israel, including “a train to a two-state solution.”
The remarks reflect Biden’s increased willingness to publicly call for Israel to increase efforts to protect Palestinian civilians in Gaza.
"I won't go into detail now. But look, I've been working with the Saudis and with all the other Arab countries, including Egypt and Jordan and Qatar. They're prepared to fully recognize Israel, fully recognize Israel for the first time,” Biden said, according to reports from journalists in the room.
“But there has to be a post-Gaza plan, and there has to be a train to a two-state solution, it doesn't have to occur today, but there has to be a progression, and I think we can do that,” Biden said.
Arab states offered to recognize Israel in 2002 in exchange for a Palestinian state in the Israeli-occupied West Bank and Gaza, with East Jerusalem as its capital. Israel rejected the proposal then.
The fundraiser, which featured Biden in conversation with former presidents Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, was interrupted at least four times by protesters, with at least three calling for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza.
“That's alright. Let them go. There's a lot of people who are very, very — there are too many innocent victims, Israeli and Palestinian. We've got to get more food and medicine, supplies in to the Palestinians,” Biden said, according to reports.
“But we can't forget, Israel is in a position where its very existence is at stake. You have to have all those people. They weren't killed. They were massacred. They were massacred.”
You have confused 'bile' with disgust - again.Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
As to 'supporting' my world view, I have no intention of getting involved in your circular arguments and general trolling. My world view - my view of the physical world, and the social and political systems and ideas that have emerged from human consciousness against that natural backdrop - have formed over a lifetime of observation, study and argument. I assume that is true for most of us.
What i have noticed with him,he does try to belittle or put any one down who does not beleive his faith.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon1959
[QUOTE=jon1959;5500388]You have confused 'bile' with disgust - again.
As to 'supporting' my world view, I have no intention of getting involved in your circular arguments and general trolling. My world view - my view of the physical world, and the social and political systems and ideas that have emerged from human consciousness against that natural backdrop - have formed over a lifetime of observation, study and argument. I assume that is true for most of us.[/QUOTE
I guess it would be more appropriate to discuss what a world view is on the new 'God' thread.
We both obviously have a very different view of life, death and purpose, however that doesn't mean we have to constantly communicate in acidic tones and there's no reason why we can't learn things from each other even when on many things we will be polar opposites.
So apart from me having tried and tested views (as you do) that I hold very firmly, what do you find to be digusting re what I have said on this or any other subject?
What I do ask are questions of those who hold different views. After all they pepper me with questions as you would expect.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster
If those people don't know why they beieve what they believe then they may feel belittled, but that has nothing to do with me?
Does not make sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
How can you believe in something but dont know why.
Al Jazerra banned from broadcasting from Israel
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68708984
Thank you for that. Very interesting. But it doesn’t explain why you have more respect for Jews over Muslims even though it was the Jews who rejected Jesus as the son of God (and continue to do so) and crucified him.Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
I refer you to your previous post:Quote:
Originally Posted by truthpaste
https://www.ccmb.co.uk/showthread.ph...=1#post5499826
"The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) said it was conducting a "thorough review" into the incident." ....that reassuring :ohwell:Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...idf-israel-war
Children account for more than one in three of the more than 32,000 people killed in Israel’s months-long assault on Gaza, according to the Palestinian health ministry. Tens of thousands more young people have suffered severe injuries, including amputations.
Nine doctors gave the Guardian accounts of working in Gaza hospitals this year, all but one of them foreign volunteers. Their common assessment was that most of the dead and wounded children they treated were hit by shrapnel or burned during Israel’s extensive bombardment of residential neighbourhoods, in some cases wiping out entire families. Others were killed or injured by collapsing buildings with still more missing under the rubble.
But doctors also reported treating a steady stream of children, elderly people and others who were clearly not combatants with single bullet wounds to the head or chest.
Some of the physicians said that the types and locations of the wounds, and accounts of Palestinians who brought children to the hospital, led them to believe the victims were directly targeted by Israeli troops.
-
Israeli and foreign human rights groups have documented a long history of snipers firing on unarmed Palestinians, including children, in Gaza and the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza also report a terrifying new development in the latest Gaza war – armed drones able to hover over streets and pick off individuals. Called quadcopters, some of these drones are used as remote-control snipers that Palestinians say have been used to shoot civilians.
For a short while after 7 October, Israel could be said to be occupying the moral high ground, that time has long since passed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAT9...JazeeraEnglish
Why isn’t the BBC reporting on that?
I wrote to my MP several weeks ago now about the U.K. supplying arms to Israel. I’m still waiting for a response.
Yep. Hence my ceasing to contribute regarding this subject matter on here. Trying to communicate with a dogmatic extremist that misrepresents one's statements and who comes over as nasty and patronising* is a complete waste of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citizen's Nephew
*I don't think this zealot's attempts at being patronising actually have an effect as he is far less less intelligent, less worldly and far more indocrinated than several of his major detractors on here.
Just give up. You'll feel better for it, old fruit.
Same as me,just gave up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie
UK Lawyers For Israel
Spokesperson just been on the news
Absolutely belting mad bunch that lot
Have you heard of 'herd mentality'?Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster
People claim that they hold an opinion but have only selected it because it keeps them in the majority and/ or they didn't want to do the research to form an opinion of their own. Either way they fail to understand how that opinion was formed and how it stands up to being honestly tested.
Point 1: There is nobody here that has NO faith, not even the atheists. (if you doubt that then raise it on the 'God' discussion).Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster
Point 2: I don't expect the majority of british people in the 21st Century to have a faith that's based the key teachings of the Bible.
Point 3: People come into this discussion (and all others worldwide) with a view (hopefuily their own) and so I have just as much right to question their faith position as they do my own.
Generally speaking, the person who implodes/ explodes or walks away, is the person who has never really thought about why they actually hold the position they do on life, death, morality and purpose. So they choose to keep their blindfold on and move to a safe distance or occasionally throw insults without getting into a discusion that may expose the thin ice they have chosen to stand on.
Wednesday 10.05 BST
Israel threatens to strike Iran directly if Iran launches attack from its territory.
Israel’s foreign minister threatened on Wednesday that its country’s forces would strike Iran directly if the Islamic Republic launched an attack from its territory against Israel, as tensions between the two countries flare after the killings of Iranian generals in a blast at the Iranian consulate in Syria, reports the Associated Press (AP).
“If Iran attacks from its territory, Israel will respond and attack in Iran,” Israel Katz said in a post on X in both Farsi and Hebrew.
'Never again' after the Rwanda genocide? If only.....
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ns-gaza-israel
It still narks me that it took the death of 7 aid workers (as opposed to twenty thousands Palestinian women and children) for the US to start changing its position on the conflict.
Meanwhile, out Government's position seems unchanged. Utterly bizarre.
The 20,000 Palestinian women and children killed by the IDF/IOF doesn't include a probable 10,000 more who are buried under the rubble.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo
Even if the focus is just aid workers, over 200 had been killed by the IDF/IOF before the murder of the WCK volunteers.
A casual glance at the TV news items or newspaper front pages gives a very clear idea of the relative value of Palestinian, Israeli and 'western' lives.
Sickening.
This is so true and spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon1959
What a woman.