How many do we usually have this time of year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
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How many do we usually have this time of year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
Can be as high a 20,000 in a peak 'flu season. One point. Deaths are announced - on the BBC for example as "...having been identified as contracting CV. They're careful not to say 'died of CV'. Sadly a lot of those 18,000 would have died soon anyway. However I reckon in about 6 months' time when the figures for deaths from un-treated/diagnosed cancer, heart, etc. conditions are calculated, they'll more than match the total CV -related deaths..Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
High as 20,000 annually for flu, and this is 18,000 in less than six weeks.Quote:
Originally Posted by A Quiet Monkfish
If it's the case that most of these people would die soon anyway, and I'm not saying it isn't, then that would also be the case with most seasonal flu victims. So why do we bother giving annual flu jabs to the older generation and NHS staff?
18,000 with a lockdown in place. How many would it be without it?Quote:
Originally Posted by lardy
I don't get the "these people would have died soon anyway", what is that based on?
I think it's based on most deaths being old. We'll all become a death statistic some day, so I'm not getting into an imaginary prediction debate of how and when it might happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
My point is that the "they'll die soon anyway" argument doesn't hold water when we try hard to vaccinate the same people who'll die soon against flu. So it obviously is a consideration to keep people alive.
Also how old is old enough to die? Aren't a lot of these people in their 70s?
Imagine working all your life just getting to retirement and then dying of this virus. Then being discounted in the numbers as they were old anyway. Madness.
Nobody is old enough to die, there are 70 year olds who are younger than 40 year olds, if you get my drift. Some old ‘uns would jump over the head of people years younger.Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
I agree, that's why it seems such a mad attitude to meQuote:
Originally Posted by splott parker
I don't think that Cause of death is ever a virus, it's the symptoms of a virus or disease, same with an accident. If a person fell down a lift shaft his or her cause of death wouldn't be falling down a lift shaft, it'd be multiple head injuries or brain damage etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by A Quiet Monkfish
Yeah this is true. I'm sure there are many deaths from flu that only occur because of underlying illness but nevertheless appear in the stats.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuerto
You either accept both flu and coronavirus in this way, or neither. Using the flu figures because they look good but refuting the coronavirus ones because there's other illness there is cherrypicking.
I thought we flew in some foreigners to do that for us?Quote:
Originally Posted by lardy
Bad Heisenbeg!!! LMAO :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Heisenberg
Wales could ease some restrictions at the end of the current three week period;-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-52396683
Couple of weeks ago posted about a NHS worker who had all the symptoms had the testers up the house and told me she had never been so ill in her life. She tested negative. Looked awful.
Just been told she went back to work didnt still feel right went home ill again. Re tested positive.!!!!!!
How did she get ‘the testers up the house’ - they haven't been doing this to date have they ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
Im not sure. This was the first test. I was told when she was ill shed had the test at home. When I saw her a week or so later I didnt ask if it had been a home test. She just told me it had been negative and in a way she wished it had shown positive.Quote:
Originally Posted by dml1954
I thought early on they were home testing but I may be wrong.
Government were warned of risks of a pandemic last year.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...virus-pandemic
Bird flu pandemic could kill 200 million people, says Neil Ferguson from Imperial College.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...u.jamessturcke
Where is Dominic Cummings?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
how the hell can a welsh NHS trust area under report deaths for a month or more and not notice that the numbers on the TV every evening were wrong?
it begger beleif.
If they hadn't coughed to it now and carried on doing it, it could have caused disaster if the lockdown was eased too early. Betwen people like that and the health Minister they are making the government look very amateur, which despite his appearance, is I think ancunfair reflaction of drakeford.
Did they have any other symptoms?Quote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
no pun idended but well spotted. :hehe: :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by tell it like it is
Have not yet chance to see whether correction has been made since (either greater action being taken or clarity over facts presented) but this tweet suggests that Wales left out of Westminster thinking again.
Quote:
"The Government has secured an agreement along with French and Irish governments" to keep freight routes open throughout the coronavirus crisis, Grant Shapps announces...
But not the Holyhead to Dublin ferry route according to the Welsh government which says ‘it is unacceptable, inexplicable and irresponsible that the Port of Holyhead has not been included’
https://twitter.com/adrianmasters84/...19613575233536
no longer required but was nice to see UK engineering firms stepping up to the plate when asked . The moral of the story UK has some briliant design and manufacturing firms . Hope to see the UK expand there manufacturing operations in the coming years . Not sure how but would love to knock china back a peg or two . they just copy most things anyway
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52409359
What a depressing graph that is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
The media really need to be sorted at the moment, we all know it’s a big deal etc but come on, not sure if it’s the government leading them to try and make people scared to go out etc but making a lot of particularly elderly folk I know so depressed they can’t watch it anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Following on from my last past I haven’t seen too much of the news this week either, this weather doesn’t lend itself to having the Tv on!
As deaths in Wales seem to be low and falling, I’m hearing from my dr and nurse next door neighbours that the Heath is quiet and MS not even being used yet, so are we over the peak? Can we start to relax things a bit, small shops open etc? Get track and tracing full on to catch any new infections straight away. I hear they want to recruit 1000’ of people to do this, how will they do this and can anyone do it?
Some people trust Boris Johnson?:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
**** me silly:hehe:
Kier Starmer getting a bit of a raw deal there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
There were over 100 deaths announced for Wales yesterday, albeit all but twenty six of them were down to procedural delays which meant they could not be recorded at the time of death.Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
I found that graph depressing because the, justified, high rating of the NHS and the relatively high ratings of Conservative party politicians seems incompatible to me given ten years of austerity and almost as long pay freezes against staff employed in the health service. While this article shows it's wrong to say all but one Tory directly voted down a pay rise for NHS staff, apart from four who abstained, every Conservative vote against a means by which the pay cap could be ended and it is true to say that some of them cheered when the result was announced;-
https://fullfact.org/health/queens-s...ic-sector-pay/
Also, like Splott Parker, I find myself wondering what Kier Starmer has done to deserve such a low rating.
We need to know more about how SAGE is set up and how it presents its information.Quote:
We understand that while the chief scientific advisers from Scotland, Wales and N Ireland have been allowed to listen in on Sage meetings, they have been doing so as observers. Unlike Cummings and Warner, they were not allowed to ask questions, unless submitted in writing.
https://twitter.com/PaulLewis/status...52259395813377
New exercise rules for those living in Wales: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52416541
And don't forget Brexit is still steaming ahead with UK government saying absolutely no extension:
Quote:
"That means that we need genuine progress by June if, at the end of this year, we want to strike an agreement which is commensurate to the level of our economic interdependence and geographical proximity."
But he said there were four areas where progress was "disappointing", including the level playing field (what kind of access the UK could have to the European single market after Brexit), justice and fisheries.
And he warned that the "clock was ticking". - Mr Barnier
In a statement, the UK government said it had been a "full and constructive negotiating round".
"However, limited progress was made in bridging the gaps between us and the EU," it said.
The UK government also highlighted "significant differences of principle" in areas including the level playing field and fisheries.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52414155
I think KS's low rating is not for him personally but as Leader of the Labour Party. This means he had to start from JC's very low rating at the time he left and build on it. That, the leaking of the internal report, the current crisis where they mayb e supporting the governemnt more openly than thye may usually, coupled with Parliament not sitting and giving him air time means the public haven't seen enough of him to judge.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
give him time
Starmer needs to look at Piers Morgan(cant believe im saying this) and start holding this government to account for their shambolic handling of this crisis.
Wasn’t it 76 or something from delays over a month in north wales? Thought we were down to 20 odd death yesterday itself?Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
It was 84 out of 88 reported yesterday by them.
This is a trust that has been in "specially measures" for years and has just be reported again recently for a complete failure to improve. what amazes me is not that the error occurred (Though that is bad enough) but that on the news every evening they tell us the numbers by area and no one up there noticed. Incredible. someone must have known.
the actual deaths yesterday was 26 I think.
Guaranteed way of turning people against him immediately. Still lots of people in "this is like WW2, we must not criticise anything" modeQuote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
Yes, I think there's something to what you say, but I reckon it's about 90 per cent certain that we are going to pass the 20,000 deaths mark later today and I think it's fair to say that it's now generally accepted that, in truth, we passed it days ago. That was the figure singled out as a "good outcome" about a month ago and this week we saw an article in the Financial Times suggesting that the real figure could be as high as 41,000.Quote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
Granted, we are around the same size population wise as the likes of Spain, France and Italy who all have similar figures to ours, but we had the advantage of having longer to prepare for what was coming than they did and it will be absolutely shocking in my view if we end up as the country with the most deaths in Europe as has been suggested by some studies recently.