Maybe it was autocorrected from something else? Cretin maybeQuote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
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Maybe it was autocorrected from something else? Cretin maybeQuote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
The EU are just bullies,glad we are out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by dml1954
Good news all round really. Means the vaccine has now passed through a few regulators and means the EU can start vaccinating people and keeping them safe.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
No, but nice try lol. It was in response to a post saying that in certain circumstacnes the media always try to find fault and that the responsible person in the Welsh goverment was unfairly in a no-win situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
The actual comment Was 'Mr Gethin'
Basically the only people that don't see this as a win for Brexit Britain are the british?
Hardly a win for anybody really, it's all a bit like the best looking competition in the burns unit.....Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
Lets be fair its in everyone's interest that the globe gets vaccinated so we all benefit .
Europe has let itself down in my opinion this week, we need to now share if we can to the third world and vulnerable and get away from vaccine political nationalism that was played out this week.
A few facts have emerged today about the contract between Astra Zeneca and the EU which regards Britain as part of the EU. That might have been the case prior to the 1 January but isn't true now. The terms of any contract are within the walls of the agreed document. Were the UK consulted before the contract was signed? I doubt it.
Surely if the UK, as a theoretical Party to the contract, didn't agree to the terms then we should have been excluded from it meaning the EU's claims that they have a right to control vaccine manufactured in the UK can't be correct. Additionally the EU/AZ contract requires AZ to make their reasonable best efforts to deliver X number of doses but without specificity that total is meaningless. In short the EU are looking for ways to divert attention away from a foul up of their own making.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55844268
Some interesting points in here.
I noted the comment about the EU trying to force them to provide vaccine on the strength of the large donation they gave to development, when in fact the biggest part of the promised money had not been handed over.
This getting very messy. I’ve read the Eu/AZ contract and the best efforts clause of course, there is an initial allocation clause as well and the current issue is around this allocation. There is provision included re manufacturing issues at AZ European plants, but unfortunately for this section of the contract, with specific attention drawn to it, AZ has included the UK plant as an Eu plant....and of course we have no production issues.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
The Eu has also stopped exports of Eu manufactured Covid jabs, which includes Pfizer. And in very confrontational act has stopped shipments of vaccines through Northern Ireland, effectively reintroducing a hard border
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-no...mpression=trueQuote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
Mr Biden will not like this happening in his beloved IrelandQuote:
Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue
I think that The EU has cocked up massively with such pettiness.Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
Their true colours are never very far from the surface but this decision is disappointing to even the most dogmatic of FBPE’ers.
I agree. Just a couple pf months ago they were warning us that our approval process was too quick and not robust. Best to take time with a comprehensive evaluation process even if to takes more time they said.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue
Their attitude now changed with time of the essence and they won't tolerate any sort of delay in supply.
It appears that they never even spoke to The Irish Government before acting.Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
😳
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-no...mpression=true
Sky News are reporting that the EU are about to announce they have backed down from using Article 16 of the Northern Ireland Protocol. What this means in practice remains a mystery.
This thread seems to be a little quieter this evening.
Strange that, considering the monumental bombshell dropped earlier and the subsequent backpedaling.
Has to be worthy of a comment or three in a thread that was popping last night.
What the EU was quoted as saying in the news item as to their reason for overiding the Irish Protocol by taking the powers to stop Vaccines poing th Northern Ireland
"This is justified as a safeguard measure pursuant to Article 16 of that Protocol in order to avert serious societal difficulties due to a lack of supply threatening to disturb the orderly implementation of the vaccination campaigns in the Member States."
What they actually meant was
"We messed up our vaccine supply and we are now trying to blame anyone else we can particularly the UK"
Succinctly put.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elwood Blues
Any counters to this?
Bueller...Bueller...
Clocks must have gone forward.
No doubt there will be plenty of bright, eager “FBPE” warriors happy to slay “The Gammon” in the morning.
Europe has retreated on article 16 after a massive backlash .
God they really have embarrassed themselves.
Sadly Macron the ( poor loser ) is still dissing our vaccine , he's starting to sound like a European Trump anti-vaxxer .
Sorry for being pedantic, but it is important to distinct between Europe and The EU.Quote:
Originally Posted by life on mars
What a load of bollox. It was, and still is, a corrupt organisation. They are already showing their true colours over this vaccine situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
Take of your “we are doomed sandwich board” and give it a rest.
well we have left Europe now , people got what they wanted
So whinge all you want about how nasty they are , too late now , nothing to do with me , I voted to stay
If Britain was in Europe and strong then .....
But there you go
We wouldn’t have the vaccines we have now.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
It sounds selfish but Europe was supposed to be purely a self preservation body.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
The benefits have ebbed away and is now more about giving than taking for certain members.
The argument all along was .....its better to be in this huge market , right on our doorstep and saying we are a major economy , this is the score , than outside letting the fat cats rule
Well you voted out
Too late now
well the flaws with the EU were obvious and things needed to changeQuote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
But we have left now
Hand on heart do you honestly believe that the UK had any clout when we were in the EU ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
If you remember Cameron sought to get concessions from the EU whilst we were in the organisation. It was widely reported that his efforts failed miserably and he was then surprised that the referendum result didn't go the way he was expecting.
In or out we were never strong enough to influence the way the EU was being run.
i see I didn't misjudge you at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue
The EU have got this wrong, I think almost everyone agrees on it, but it's interesting to see Leave voters and/or supporters descending on this one thread like hungry pigs around a trough - it rather tends to support the notion that there's been little or nothing before now to get their teeth into.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moodybluebird
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/...an-recognised/
Well that was part of the preoblem Sudge. Cameron tried hard to change them and failed.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
Largely due to France as usual.
Did Cameron fail? I thought we managed to make quite a difference during that stage?
Have you actually read that ? It's littered with references to the 1970's and 80's. The authors really are clutching at straws in trying to emphasise the UK's influence in Europe. It has been been waning for many, many years.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon1959
Indeed. We were members of the club (with all the benefits it bestowed) but had every opportunity to walk away from the things we didn't like. It was almost like having the cake and eating it. Or to articulate it better, from your article,Quote:
Originally Posted by jon1959
"And on those occasions where the UK really was uncomfortable with the direction of travel taken by its partners, it proved highly successful in negotiating effective opt-outs. These can arguably traced back to its 1978-9 decision to refrain from participating fully in the European Monetary System and proliferated during the 1990s and the first years of the 21st century, eventually covering Euro membership, participation in Schengen, and important aspects of justice and home affairs provisions".
Having said that, the actions of the EU (which they backed away from after all of 2 hours) were quite shocking and politically motivated. They have acted too slowly and too cautiously regarding vaccines and backed the wrong ones.
Don't forget that our government did not pick a winner. They pretty much bought any vaccine going... it was like betting on all the horses in the race and then saying you won. Will we be paying for this for years to come?.
I don't think for a minute that is correct as there are over 50 vaccines in development.Quote:
Originally Posted by Swiss Peter
https://www.raps.org/news-and-articl...accine-tracker
I think the UK have ordered six.
https://www.cityam.com/which-covid-v...nment-ordered/
Yes I read it. Thanks for asking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moodybluebird
The UK was semi detached in the EU around a few issues but for most of the time of UK membership we were one of the big beasts in the union, a net contributor, and a major influence on evolving EU policy. I can't find the summary of EU policies that was posted and discussed on here a few years back - but it showed the UK voted for the vast majority of EU policies and laws. That didn't stop Brexiteers making out that the UK was constantly a victim of an alien organisation and 'they' were always doing things to 'us'. Wasn't true, but played very well to Little Englander sensibilities.
Anyway, we are out and will have to make the best of it. The Commission has cocked it up with vaccine procurement and the botched threat of Article 16, but that doesn't define the EU, the UK performance on Covid or the main costs or benefits of Brexit.
Yes he failed in so much as he did not achieve all that he hoped to achieve. That is what instigated the initial promise to hold a referendum. If the EU had been more flexcible or giving none of this would have happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
and of course there would be no vaccine fight because as part of the club Ukwould not have orderd their 100,0000,000 first so there would be no argument over the EU not getting enough, they'd have our allocation too.
The EU didn't only cock up in relation to Article 16; they also were mistaken in relation to contract law according to a Commercial lawyer. This is an extract from a very long article.
[I]While European ministers have publicly insisted that they are entitled to jabs under the terms of the AstraZeneca contract, Steven Barrett - a respected commercial lawyer with the Radcliffe Chambers - told MailOnline that it actually shows the opposite.
'The EU's public position is legally unsustainable, and they have made public comments that are demonstrably wrong,' he said.
Pulling apart the EU contract, Mr Barrett pointed to section 5.1 as the most damning, saying that it 'clearly shows' the company is only under a 'Best Reasonable Effort' clause to supply the EU - as boss Pascal Soriot has stated.
While section 5.4 does state that factories in the UK are considered to be part of the EU under the terms of the contract, he called this 'a distraction' that 'is not relevant to the EU's point'.
'This is actually a mildly embarrassing climbdown from the EU, who have a rule that all vaccines used in the EU have to be made in the EU.
'What they have done in that clause is say, for the purposes of this contract, the UK counts as the EU.' But, he added, it does not mean they are entitled to doses made in UK factories.] In addition, clause 6.2 of the contract states that 'competing agreements' signed by AstraZeneca might affect the supply of vaccines to the EU.
'They knew there would be competing agreements,' Mr Barrett said. 'Everyone in the world knew there would be competing agreements. They knew that might mean doses were delayed.
'I believe the EU is publicly asserting that it now has a right to jump the queue and take doses that belong to other people. That is expressly wrong,' he added.