Cancel culture

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

Oh and now we are back to cancel culture not existing! 🤣

I think to be honest it's back to my previous point; you don't think it exists because you don't experience it. But others do and others in the industry itself say it is an issue.

Maybe you should listen to them a bit. It's possible you aren't always right.

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Yet we haven’t seen one decent example posted to this thread of it actually happening.

Cancel culture doesn’t exist it’s just Twitter bollocks being blown out of proportion as usual.

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

You can't 'sack' a comedian.

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Why not they work on tv shows and stuff don’t they? I think you’re being needlessly pedantic now.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Yet we haven’t seen one decent example posted to this thread of it actually happening.

Cancel culture doesn’t exist it’s just Twitter bollocks being blown out of proportion as usual.

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Yes there have been. And I've explained how the term (which I have said is overblown imo) can mean someone being completely cancelled (very rare) but more often may mean a small number of events cancelled (more common) but can also mean someone having to amend their act for fear of offending the easily offended and intolerant minority (more common still though unknown how prevalent.

I don't know why you pretend there aren't people out there who don't try to get events cancelled because they don't like someone's perfectly legal views.

It clearly happens, its prevelence may be questioned but it happens an do it's bellends who do it and if you tolerate it it may be 'your comedy' that is next.

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

Agreed.

Like I said I'm not condoning any actions all I am saying that there IS a line and people are trying to manipulate the line.

My examples are on the extreme side but i'm just giving examples.

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But this idea of an all prevailing wave of cancel culture that kills careers is a complete fallacy. The only person I can think of in recent memory who's career has actually been killed is Harvey Weinstein, and that's with good, criminal, reason.

The others mentioned:

JK Rowiing - Her books sold were up 10.9% last year
Louis CK - Still touring
Roy Chubby Brown - Still touring
Jim Davidson - Still touring
John Cleese - Got a documentary out

"Cancel Culture" is just people telling you that they think you're an arsehole, usually when you've behaved like one. Students protesting against certain performers has always happened, I remember Dapper Laughs getting a tour cancelled about 10 years ago for saying some dodgy stuff about rape, no one complained about cancel culture then because certain elements of the media hadn't decided they wanted to construct a moral panic about it yet. Reminds me of that period in the 90's when the media decided that road rage was everywhere, and you felt like you couldn't get into a car without being in danger of someone going for you. Road rage hasn't gone away since then, it just never existed in the way they made it seem.

Twitter etc makes it seem like there's a huge groundswell of opinion and someone's getting "cancelled" but the reality is it's just a few thousand people making a noise for a short period of time, same as most protests. Truth is most of the people who talk about being cancelled just aren't relevant anymore, there's plenty of comedians doing edgy stuff but it works because it's funny.

As mentioned before, see South Park and It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia for two prime, modern examples of shows that say the most awful stuff but are loved and keep getting made.

Very succinct post Delm :thumbup:

I agree, that's a good post making some good points and puts it in context, especially in respect of it being nothing new, and that twitter and the media do amplify things.

I don't think we should pretend there is nothing happening - comedians are telling us that it exists and we do see some examples of universities etc seeking to cancel speakers, which I think should be pushed back against.

But, as I happily said when I made my first point, I do think its overblown and fundementally is nothing new.

I'm now off to get pissed, so I am cancelling you all and wish you all a very happy christmas eve eve

Speaking of cancel culture haven't right wingers got a long history of trying to ban books, music and video games?

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Originally Posted by delmbox

But this idea of an all prevailing wave of cancel culture that kills careers is a complete fallacy. The only person I can think of in recent memory who's career has actually been killed is Harvey Weinstein, and that's with good, criminal, reason.

The others mentioned:

JK Rowiing - Her books sold were up 10.9% last year
Louis CK - Still touring
Roy Chubby Brown - Still touring
Jim Davidson - Still touring
John Cleese - Got a documentary out

"Cancel Culture" is just people telling you that they think you're an arsehole, usually when you've behaved like one. Students protesting against certain performers has always happened, I remember Dapper Laughs getting a tour cancelled about 10 years ago for saying some dodgy stuff about rape, no one complained about cancel culture then because certain elements of the media hadn't decided they wanted to construct a moral panic about it yet. Reminds me of that period in the 90's when the media decided that road rage was everywhere, and you felt like you couldn't get into a car without being in danger of someone going for you. Road rage hasn't gone away since then, it just never existed in the way they made it seem.

Twitter etc makes it seem like there's a huge groundswell of opinion and someone's getting "cancelled" but the reality is it's just a few thousand people making a noise for a short period of time, same as most protests. Truth is most of the people who talk about being cancelled just aren't relevant anymore, there's plenty of comedians doing edgy stuff but it works because it's funny.

As mentioned before, see South Park and It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia for two prime, modern examples of shows that say the most awful stuff but are loved and keep getting made.

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Good post.

It happens on both ends of the spetrum and all in between.

Ben Shapiro has said numerous times where he had to have security due to people trying to stop his appearances. I wouldn't say Ben Shapiro is evil enough to be cancelled but people do try. I'm actually on the side of Crosey slightly. I dont want to see the wrong people succeed.

I think it just comes down to 'Just be nice to people'.

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Originally Posted by NYCBlue

Cancel culture is a right-wing myth. They didn't seem to have a problem with it when they were burning Beatles records.

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THis chap obviously has no idea what he is talking about then......

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/31/u...l-culture.html

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

THis chap obviously has no idea what he is talking about then......

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/31/u...l-culture.html

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Or this bloke either

https://paradoxpolitics.com/2021/02/...arpers-letter/

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

Good post.

It happens on both ends of the spetrum and all in between.

Ben Shapiro has said numerous times where he had to have security due to people trying to stop his appearances. I wouldn't say Ben Shapiro is evil enough to be cancelled but people do try. I'm actually on the side of Crosey slightly. I dont want to see the wrong people succeed.

I think it just comes down to 'Just be nice to people'.

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Please tell me you don’t listen to that **** Ben Shapiro.

It does come down to be nice to people and he’s the complete opposite of that.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Please tell me you don’t listen to that **** Ben Shapiro.

It does come down to be nice to people and he’s the complete opposite of that.

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I've listened to him a few times on the Joe Rogan show and he's a good listen whether you agree with him or not

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

I've listened to him a few times on the Joe Rogan show and he's a good listen whether you agree with him or not

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Oh dear, he's an idiot exhibit A - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRF3r3zUGqk

You lose all credibility when you bring him up.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Please tell me you don’t listen to that **** Ben Shapiro.

It does come down to be nice to people and he’s the complete opposite of that.

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I used to like Helen Shapiro

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Originally Posted by delmbox

But this idea of an all prevailing wave of cancel culture that kills careers is a complete fallacy. The only person I can think of in recent memory who's career has actually been killed is Harvey Weinstein, and that's with good, criminal, reason.

The others mentioned:

JK Rowiing - Her books sold were up 10.9% last year
Louis CK - Still touring
Roy Chubby Brown - Still touring
Jim Davidson - Still touring
John Cleese - Got a documentary out

"Cancel Culture" is just people telling you that they think you're an arsehole, usually when you've behaved like one. Students protesting against certain performers has always happened, I remember Dapper Laughs getting a tour cancelled about 10 years ago for saying some dodgy stuff about rape, no one complained about cancel culture then because certain elements of the media hadn't decided they wanted to construct a moral panic about it yet. Reminds me of that period in the 90's when the media decided that road rage was everywhere, and you felt like you couldn't get into a car without being in danger of someone going for you. Road rage hasn't gone away since then, it just never existed in the way they made it seem.

Twitter etc makes it seem like there's a huge groundswell of opinion and someone's getting "cancelled" but the reality is it's just a few thousand people making a noise for a short period of time, same as most protests. Truth is most of the people who talk about being cancelled just aren't relevant anymore, there's plenty of comedians doing edgy stuff but it works because it's funny.

As mentioned before, see South Park and It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia for two prime, modern examples of shows that say the most awful stuff but are loved and keep getting made.

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:xmasthumbup:

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

THis chap obviously has no idea what he is talking about then......

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/31/u...l-culture.html

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He's not really talking about cancel culture in the same context as we are in this thread though is he? He's calling out social justice warriors for whining on the internet instead of doing something active to effect change.

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

Or this bloke either

https://paradoxpolitics.com/2021/02/...arpers-letter/

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Same with Chomsky. He talking about the policing of academic discourse. The fact that he uses the term "cancel culture" is also irrelevant to what we are discussing here.

Interesting take on this subject from Bill Burr

https://youtu.be/1SGNeTDEHwo

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Originally Posted by NYCBlue

He's not really talking about cancel culture in the same context as we are in this thread though is he? He's calling out social justice warriors for whining on the internet instead of doing something active to effect change.

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Chomsky specifically says cancel culture in the article. Are you saying he is wrong? Or are there different types of cancel culture now.

Perhaps the truth is that it is a wider subject than this thread has covered.

As John Cleese says it is a complex subject.

Two jews and a muslims walk into a pub. The landlord asks how many Christians does it take to screw in a lamp bulb?
We don't drink alcohol, they replied but it's probably a thousand.

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

Chomsky specifically says cancel culture in the article. Are you saying he is wrong? Or are there different types of cancel culture now.

Perhaps the truth is that it is a wider subject than this thread has covered.

As John Cleese says it is a complex subject.

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Problem is we sometimes need cancel culture when it starts to boarder hate speech.

It’s when it becomes more nuanced that’s the issue

https://youtu.be/MH7jImGZOss

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

I think it is overblown as a phrase, but there are loads of examples, especially on universities and in the mainstream media which is pretty intolerant of things it deems not polite.

So yeah, it is overblown but the people on here saying cancel culture doesn't exist is a bit like a load of white guys saying racism doesn't exist.

It does go on and people are definitely fearful of voicing their opinions in front of many 'liberals' in much the same way that others are in front of some conservatives, especially in the past. I have a friend at BBC radio Wales who strongly stated this was the case there. You just have to toe the line to the prevailing elite.

None of this is good and pretending it doesn't exist at all is daft

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People get canceled. But we don't live in a culture of cancellation. That is a right-wing scare tactic.

Does anyone know any right wing conservative type stand up comedians ?

And are any of them funny ?

I can't imagine someone making jokes about how they support welfare cuts or privatising the health service or the shocking state of tory social care policy being funny

It would be a bit creepy

And I think that's why so called alternative comedy works

It's sort of taking it to the bad man

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Does anyone know any right wing conservative type stand up comedians ?

And are any of them funny ?

I can't imagine someone making jokes about how they support welfare cuts or privatising the health service or the shocking state of tory social care policy being funny

It would be a bit creepy

And I think that's why so called alternative comedy works

It's sort of taking it to the bad man

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There's a guy who does the News Quiz on R4, Jeff something. He's a right winger and he's good.

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Yet we haven’t seen one decent example posted to this thread of it actually happening.

Cancel culture doesn’t exist it’s just Twitter bollocks being blown out of proportion as usual.

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If you are struggling for an example, there is always that fella that got binned from GB news for taking the knee

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Originally Posted by lardy

There's a guy who does the News Quiz on R4, Jeff something. He's a right winger and he's good.

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Does he do impressions ?

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Does he do impressions ?

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Al Murray, pub landlord does a great routine of an inadequate little Englander who harps back to the days of Empire. Incredibly funny and intelligent. The best thing about is that half of his audience seem to think that he's being serious and not parodying them.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Al Murray, pub landlord does a great routine of an inadequate little Englander who harps back to the days of Empire. Incredibly funny and intelligent. The best thing about is that half of his audience seem to think that he's being serious and not parodying them.

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Spot on; Al Murray is very funny but it's a piss take. The more comedians ridiculing the right the better.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Al Murray, pub landlord does a great routine of an inadequate little Englander who harps back to the days of Empire. Incredibly funny and intelligent. The best thing about is that half of his audience seem to think that he's being serious and not parodying them.

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I like him

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Does anyone know any right wing conservative type stand up comedians ?

And are any of them funny ?

I can't imagine someone making jokes about how they support welfare cuts or privatising the health service or the shocking state of tory social care policy being funny

It would be a bit creepy

And I think that's why so called alternative comedy works

It's sort of taking it to the bad man

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Funny you ask as the BBC have just announced this pilot https://www.chortle.co.uk/news/2021/...omedy_show?rss

Tony Law is usually good value but the involvement of Andrew Doyle is a bit of a red flag that this may end up being as funny as standing on a plug with socks on.

All that said though, other than the odd Rachel Parris bit there wasn't a huge amount about the Mash Report to write home about either.

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Originally Posted by caerkid

Funny you ask as the BBC have just announced this pilot https://www.chortle.co.uk/news/2021/...omedy_show?rss

Tony Law is usually good value but the involvement of Andrew Doyle is a bit of a red flag that this may end up being as funny as standing on a plug with socks on.

All that said though, other than the odd Rachel Parris bit there wasn't a huge amount about the Mash Report to write home about either.

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I find most tory comedians are like the Alan Partridge character

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Originally Posted by lardy

There's a guy who does the News Quiz on R4, Jeff something. He's a right winger and he's good.

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can he play left back?

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Originally Posted by lardy

There's a guy who does the News Quiz on R4, Jeff something. He's a right winger and he's good.

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Geoff Norcott? He's quite good.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Geoff Norcott? He's quite good.

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That's him. He does a good job on that, but haven't heard anything else he's done.

He's a right wing libertarian ?

I will give that a miss

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Originally Posted by lardy

That's him. He does a good job on that, but haven't heard anything else he's done.

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He has been on Mock the Week and The Mash Report amongst other things

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Originally Posted by Croesy Blue

Yet we haven’t seen one decent example posted to this thread of it actually happening.

Cancel culture doesn’t exist it’s just Twitter bollocks being blown out of proportion as usual.

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Jimmy Carr: Pressure grows over comedy routine - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-60292675

Joe Rogan: Podcast is staying on Spotify says boss - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-60286699

It's certainly gaining traction. Maybe for the best, but who gets to decide?

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Originally Posted by WJ99mobile

Jimmy Carr: Pressure grows over comedy routine - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-60292675

Joe Rogan: Podcast is staying on Spotify says boss - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-60286699

It's certainly gaining traction. Maybe for the best, but who gets to decide?

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I might have missed the point you're trying to make but I'm not sure if a podcast staying on Spotify is a great example of cancel culture.

I do like Andrew Schulz.

https://youtu.be/CRhalFgg6hU