Club respond to open letter

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Originally Posted by jon1959

That's a lot of paperweights!

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You haven’t seen the price of them …

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Originally Posted by TheBirchgrovePub

Blue Twat Matt sums up everything wrong with this fanbase

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Really , Matt is giving a point of view . One I agree with .
Do you remember the day Cardiff rioted against the owners when we played Brighton . Red scarfs all round . Che Guevara eat your heart out .
The club have a process for bringing up grievances, the trust ( who Iam a long time member )went against it for whatever reason, the supporters club ( big time red supporters ) have gone rogue ….
Please feel free to abuse me as well .

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Originally Posted by blue matt

for the record, just incase this is aimed at me, ive never shot at or ridiculed anyone if they want to protest / moan on here / demand to know what is happening with the manager and the hiring process

im just not sure of the point of it, ive come to the conclusion after all these years, the modern elite game doesnt really care about the fans, we are just a customer, I feel the further you drop down the leagues and into non-league, the club has to care more as you really are the group who keep the club going with the money we spend, the Issue is that many clubs in the top few leagues are dependant on the owners money, so if I stop going to watch Cardiff for a season, VT doesnt care, yet I could go and spend that money going to watch Bath city ( for example as that is the closest team to me ) and the Bath ( a community ran club ) appreciate it ( not too much that I can demand to know who is going to be the new manager and what the hiring process is, like some appear to think they can at Cardiff :shrug:) Bath are managerless at the mo

I still get to Cardiff games, but dont trouble myself with the way the clubs being run and what the next crisis will be ( I guess that means some may think that means I am not as big a fan ) this club has always gone from one crisis to the next for along as I have supported them ( in the late 80's ), thats the way it is, I cant do much about it ( I did buy some shares to help sign Kurt Nogan and that didnt exactly pan out as we had hoped ) so I just roll with it, but if it got to a point that I wasnt enjoying it ( as it appears some here aren't ) then as I said, walk away, take a break, who knows the good times might be around the corner and it'll be fun again, life is too short to be that bothered by the latest crisis at CCFC

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Spot on .

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Originally Posted by TheBirchgrovePub

Blue Twat Matt sums up everything wrong with this fanbase

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I don't know Matt, but he has been a long time suoporter of this club and has every right to express his opinion whether you or I agree with it or not

You, on the other hand,have by your nasty comment revealed yourself to be something of an ignoramus

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Originally Posted by Vic Flange

Of course it is. Or at very least exaggerating. And who in their right mind buys things like beach towels, scarves and hats annually? It’s not even as if the designs change each year like they do with kit.

:hehe:

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In our summer who wouldn’t buy a beach towel, hat and scarf? You need them all on the same day.

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

I don't know Matt, but he has been a long time suoporter of this club and has every right to express his opinion whether you or I agree with it or not

You, on the other hand,have by your nasty comment revealed yourself to be something of an ignoramus

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However, Matt lost all right to be treated with respect in this thread when he said right at the start of his contribution that any one who backed what was said in the open letter should either buy the club or walk away from it - comparing someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use wasn’t the cleverest either.

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

I don't know Matt, but he has been a long time supporter of this club and has every right to express his opinion whether you or I agree with it or not

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I thought he was just a customer?

Your comment is kind of ironic given Matt’s stance on fans expressing opinions.

What has this FAB actually done?

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Originally Posted by blue matt

for the record, just incase this is aimed at me, ive never shot at or ridiculed anyone if they want to protest / moan on here / demand to know what is happening with the manager and the hiring process

im just not sure of the point of it, ive come to the conclusion after all these years, the modern elite game doesnt really care about the fans, we are just a customer, I feel the further you drop down the leagues and into non-league, the club has to care more as you really are the group who keep the club going with the money we spend, the Issue is that many clubs in the top few leagues are dependant on the owners money, so if I stop going to watch Cardiff for a season, VT doesnt care, yet I could go and spend that money going to watch Bath city ( for example as that is the closest team to me ) and the Bath ( a community ran club ) appreciate it ( not too much that I can demand to know who is going to be the new manager and what the hiring process is, like some appear to think they can at Cardiff :shrug:) Bath are managerless at the mo

I still get to Cardiff games, but dont trouble myself with the way the clubs being run and what the next crisis will be ( I guess that means some may think that means I am not as big a fan ) this club has always gone from one crisis to the next for along as I have supported them ( in the late 80's ), thats the way it is, I cant do much about it ( I did buy some shares to help sign Kurt Nogan and that didnt exactly pan out as we had hoped ) so I just roll with it, but if it got to a point that I wasnt enjoying it ( as it appears some here aren't ) then as I said, walk away, take a break, who knows the good times might be around the corner and it'll be fun again, life is too short to be that bothered by the latest crisis at CCFC

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Decent post Matt.

I agree with a lot of that. The red debacle bringing it home for myself.

Tan isn't arsed about who comes through the door, he just needs numbers through it. He's made that plain over the years.

I get why some are still emotionally attached to 'City' and have a vested interest in how the club is run but that ship sailed for me a long time ago.

If I'm brutally honest, I use City as a tool to do something in common with my youngest lad who wants to watch them. If it wasn't for him, I'd probably wouldn't bother?

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Originally Posted by blue matt

if you want more of a say on how the club is run, find yourself £60 Mill and make VT a offer

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

However, Matt lost all right to be treated with respect in this thread when he said right at the start of his contribution that any one who backed what was said in the open letter should either buy the club or walk away from it - comparing someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use wasn't the cleverest either.

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people can still have a difference of opinion and be shown respect, well they can in my world , maybe thats the difference between us

for the record though I said " if you want more of a say on how the club is run, find yourself £60 Mill and make VT a offer " which is right, as a fan, I ( and others, including the club it seems ) dont believe we have any right demanding to know who is going to be manager and what the hiring process is and what the long term plans are, despite all this discussion on here I still dont, as ive pointed out aswell, it doesn't bother me that much either

Oh and I never "compared someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use " either, I said we are just customers to the owners, you see yourself as something more, fair enough

in fact I agreed with Don Corleone when he said

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Originally Posted by Don Corleone

There is not much point with the company / customer analogies as supporting a football club is a very different experience with a strong emotional tie in.

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Originally Posted by blue matt

agreed, its completely different, but imho we are just customers in todays modern game, its a shame, but thats the way I feel it is

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Originally Posted by Jordi Culé

I get why some are still emotionally attached to 'City' and have a vested interest in how the club

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Which is why it's important to be able to voice opinions.

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Originally Posted by blue matt

people can still have a difference of opinion and be shown respect, well they can in my world , maybe thats the difference between us

for the record though I said " if you want more of a say on how the club is run, find yourself £60 Mill and make VT a offer " which I still think is right, as a fan, I ( and others, including the club it seems ) dont believe we have any right demanding to know who is going to be manager and what the hiring process is and what the long term plans are, despite all this discussion on here I still dont, as ive pointed out aswell, it doesn't bother me that much either

Oh and I never "compared someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use " either, I said we are just customers to the owners, you see yourself as something more, fair enough

in fact I agreed with Don Corleone when he said

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Perhaps the bit where you lost respect for some was you giving advice to those pondering your second option of walking away and what future contribution they should make to this board if they did,

if you are not happy walk away ( Silently is better or even a slightly mumble if you must, as we dont want the drama on here, the big grand boycott speech, its embarrassing )

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Originally Posted by blue matt

I still get to Cardiff games, but dont trouble myself with the way the clubs being run and what the next crisis will be... this club has always gone from one crisis to the next for along as I have supported them, thats the way it is, I cant do much about it.... so I just roll with it.... life is too short to be that bothered by the latest crisis at CCFC

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The shoulder-shrugging apathy regarding 'the way it is' displayed by a large majority of football fans is precisely why it is the way it is.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

The shoulder-shrugging apathy regarding 'the way it is' displayed by a large majority of football fans is precisely why it is the way it is.

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The way it is is absolutely fine for the majority of fans who don’t really care about the background stuff.

I cant believe I’m saying this but I’m not particularly bothered if we go down as there would be some decent away grounds to visit and who knows we may come back refreshed, just like Southampton Sunderland and the like.

If there was serous concerns within the fan base I’m sure the trust membership would increase by more than 3% :xmashehe:

Oh does anyone want to buy some hardly worn merchandise?

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

The way it is is absolutely fine for the majority of fans who don’t really care about the background stuff.

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Indeed. Never was this more apparent than during the rebrand saga.

Problem is, the 'majority' is getting gradually smaller as the apathy spreads.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

Indeed. Never was this more apparent than during the rebrand saga.

Problem is, the 'majority' is getting gradually smaller as the apathy spreads.

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I don’t think so. There appears to be significantly more apathy with T.V companies dictating kick off times than anything else affecting attendances. ( our league position doesn’t help).

Since VT has been in charge our overall attendance figures have been the highest I’ve ever known and are still very good considering we are in the bottom half of the table.

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Since VT has been in charge our overall attendance figures have been the highest I’ve ever known

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Not sure this is accurate.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

Not sure this is accurate.

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I've been going since mid 80s and they definitely are.

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Originally Posted by blue matt

people can still have a difference of opinion and be shown respect, well they can in my world , maybe thats the difference between us

for the record though I said " if you want more of a say on how the club is run, find yourself £60 Mill and make VT a offer " which is right, as a fan, I ( and others, including the club it seems ) dont believe we have any right demanding to know who is going to be manager and what the hiring process is and what the long term plans are, despite all this discussion on here I still dont, as ive pointed out aswell, it doesn't bother me that much either

Oh and I never "compared someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use " either, I said we are just customers to the owners, you see yourself as something more, fair enough

in fact I agreed with Don Corleone when he said

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I said I found your opinion absurd a few days back and I still do - not much else I can say really.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

Not sure this is accurate.

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It is

http://european-football-statistics....eague/carc.htm

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Originally Posted by Hilts

I've been going since mid 80s and they definitely are.

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City averaged an impressive 31,408 for home league games in 18/19. I've not checked it, but I'd be surprised if that's not in the club's top 5 average attendances for a season throughout its history. So, to say crowds under Vicent Tan have risen would not be wrong (I know for a fact that the 18/19 average attendance figure is higher than in any season since I saw my first home game in 63/64). However, a few thingsa need to be pointed out I feel.

For example, the crowd for the Millwall game was less than half of what we avaraged in 18/19 and I'd guess there's every chance it will be the same again tomorrow - the QPR crowd was just over 50 per cent of the 18/19 average. Our average league attendance this season is 18,876 which is very slightly below 60 per cent of the 18/19 figure.

In the last season before Vinvent Tan took over the ownership of the clun (09/10), City's average home league attendance was 19,413. Therefore, we now find ourselves in a position where the current team is much worse than the one Vincent Tan inherited and crowds are slightly smaller than they were when he took over, so Baloo is not wrong in saying that it's not as simple as a blanket statement saying crowds are up under vincent Tan even if it is accurate to say that crowds have, at times, been as high under this ownership as they've been since, at least, the 1950s.

[QUOTE=the other bob wilson;5558187]City averaged an impressive 31,408 for home league games in 18/19. I've not checked it, but I'd be surprised if that's not in the club's top 5 average attendances for a season throughout its history. So, to say crowds under Vicent Tan have risen would not be wrong (I know for a fact that the 18/19 average attendance figure is higher than in any season since I saw my first home game in 63/64). However, a few thingsa need to be pointed out I feel.

For example, the crowd for the Millwall game was less than half of what we avaraged in 18/19 and I'd guess there's every chance it will be the same again tomorrow - the QPR crowd was just over 50 per cent of the 18/19 average. Our average league attendance this season is 18,876 which is very slightly below 60 per cent of the 18/19 figure.

In the last season before Vinvent Tan took over the ownership of the clun (09/10), City's average home league attendance was 19,413. Therefore, we now find ourselves in a position where the current team is much worse than the one Vincent Tan inherited and crowds are slightly smaller than they were when he took over, so Baloo is not wrong in saying that it's not as simple as a blanket statement saying crowds are up under vincent Tan even if it is accurate to say that crowds have, at times, been as high under this ownership as they've been since, at least, the 1950s.[/QUOTE

I’ve just posted the historical attendance numbers- it’s as clear as ever

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

I don’t think so.

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The recent attendance for the Millwall game (15,687) was the lowest for a league match at the CCS since March 2017. But in reality, we know that far fewer people are actually turning up than the declared attendance figures. You only have to look around you in the ground to realise that.

The smallest crowd last season was 17,131 for a midweek game against Blackburn. We've had midweek crowds on 16,205 and 15,687 already this season, while the attendance for the Blackburn home game on a Saturday was just 17,188.

Apathy is spreading. Crowds are getting smaller. No doubt about it.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

City averaged an impressive 31,408 for home league games in 18/19. I've not checked it, but I'd be surprised if that's not in the club's top 5 average attendances for a season throughout its history.

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Just missed it Bob. It was 6th behind: 1954, 1953, 1949, 1948 & 1922.

StT.
<><

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

The recent attendance for the Millwall game (15,687) was the lowest for a league match at the CCS since March 2017. But in reality, we know that far fewer people are actually turning up than the declared attendance figures. You only have to look around you in the ground to realise that.

The smallest crowd last season was 17,131 for a midweek game against Blackburn. We've had midweek crowds on 16,205 and 15,687 already this season, while the attendance for the Blackburn home game on a Saturday was just 17,188.

Apathy is spreading. Crowds are getting smaller. No doubt about it.

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Very true, Dave. Didn't Tan say that when he left the Club we'd be in a healthier position?

StT.
<><

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Originally Posted by Henry Hill

3 programmes :hehe:

I smell bullshit.

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:hehe: They are free in the Premier Lounge.

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Originally Posted by Steve the Tea

Just missed it Bob. It was 6th behind: 1954, 1953, 1949, 1948 & 1922.

StT.
<><

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Thanks Steve :xmasthumbup:

[QUOTE=TWGL1;5558191]

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

City averaged an impressive 31,408 for home league games in 18/19. I've not checked it, but I'd be surprised if that's not in the club's top 5 average attendances for a season throughout its history. So, to say crowds under Vicent Tan have risen would not be wrong (I know for a fact that the 18/19 average attendance figure is higher than in any season since I saw my first home game in 63/64). However, a few thingsa need to be pointed out I feel.

For example, the crowd for the Millwall game was less than half of what we avaraged in 18/19 and I'd guess there's every chance it will be the same again tomorrow - the QPR crowd was just over 50 per cent of the 18/19 average. Our average league attendance this season is 18,876 which is very slightly below 60 per cent of the 18/19 figure.

In the last season before Vinvent Tan took over the ownership of the clun (09/10), City's average home league attendance was 19,413. Therefore, we now find ourselves in a position where the current team is much worse than the one Vincent Tan inherited and crowds are slightly smaller than they were when he took over, so Baloo is not wrong in saying that it's not as simple as a blanket statement saying crowds are up under vincent Tan even if it is accurate to say that crowds have, at times, been as high under this ownership as they've been since, at least, the 1950s.[/QUOTE

I’ve just posted the historical attendance numbers- it’s as clear as ever

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But I’m not wrong when I say we have a worse team and, for now, are getting lower crowds under Tan than we were getting just before he took over. That probably will change with a couple of games during the holiday period coming up and then a visit from the jacks early in the New Year as well as a game with the wurzels to come, so I think the 24/25 average home gate could well end up slightly bigger than the 18/19 one.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

The recent attendance for the Millwall game (15,687) was the lowest for a league match at the CCS since March 2017. But in reality, we know that far fewer people are actually turning up than the declared attendance figures. You only have to look around you in the ground to realise that.

The smallest crowd last season was 17,131 for a midweek game against Blackburn. We've had midweek crowds on 16,205 and 15,687 already this season, while the attendance for the Blackburn home game on a Saturday was just 17,188.

Apathy is spreading. Crowds are getting smaller. No doubt about it.

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I think tomorrow’s crowd for Preston could be smaller than the one for Millwall

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Originally Posted by Don Corleone

I think tomorrow’s crowd for Preston could be smaller than the one for Millwall

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Yes, it will be low, there is an apathy that will be very hard to shift now.

Personally I'd rather not be so concerned about the running of the club, but the continued failures at board level directly cause the continued failures on the pitch and need to be sorted before the club can move forward.
There are of course no guarantees of success in football, but the way our club has been run in recent years has clearly not been working so a different approach is needed.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

However, Matt lost all right to be treated with respect in this thread when he said right at the start of his contribution that any one who backed what was said in the open letter should either buy the club or walk away from it - comparing someone’s support of their football club to their “support” of the super market they use wasn’t the cleverest either.

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So you are happy another user called him a twat are you Bob?

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

So you are happy another user called him a twat are you Bob?

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Nothing to do with me, im talking about nothing else than what I felt when I read that comment.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I said I found your opinion absurd a few days back and I still do - not much else I can say really.

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as I said, maybe that the difference between us :shrug:

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Nothing to do with me, im talking about nothing else than what I felt when I read that comment.

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I know the orginal comment was not yours Bob, but you seem to suggesting that Blue Matt has in a sense asked for it

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Originally Posted by blue matt

as I said, maybe that the difference between us :shrug:

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Probably, I’ve never ever thought that anyone would have to buy the club they support if they wanted to criticise the way it was being run and I don’t think I ever will do.

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

Oh does anyone want to buy some hardly worn merchandise?

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I'll take all 30 beach towels, £25 cash

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Originally Posted by Elwood Blues

So you are happy another user called him a twat are you Bob?

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Good grief...

[QUOTE=the other bob wilson;5558197]

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

But I’m not wrong when I say we have a worse team and, for now, are getting lower crowds under Tan than we were getting just before he took over. That probably will change with a couple of games during the holiday period coming up and then a visit from the jacks early in the New Year as well as a game with the wurzels to come, so I think the 24/25 average home gate could well end up slightly bigger than the 18/19 one.

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Yes but the sky Tv kick off times , the transport network back to the valleys and performance are all relative in respect of this seasons attendance figures

Still impressive considering the perceived “apathy” and the apparent need for the trust to go through unofficial channels

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Originally Posted by TWGL1

Still impressive considering the perceived “apathy” and the apparent need for the trust to go through unofficial channels

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You can dress it any way you like, but the truth is there's been absolutely nothing impressive about City's attendances so far this season, and everyone who has attended games with any regularity knows that - even you.