Deomocracy at last.

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Originally Posted by CardiffIrish2

Ah yes the old traitor for for giving into Europe line espoused by the Daily Heil and UKIP.

Not that it's relevant but as you question my character with a veiled cowardice line I spent 12 years In a dangerous occupation for the benefit of my local community but thanks for the snipe.

My point is what was the plan to leave? What's the point in risking economic security without a definite idea of what to do next?

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There was no formal plan. What kind of imbecile would opt to take 'short term pain' with no idea what they will receive at the end of it?

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Originally Posted by David Vincent

If that post doesn't make sense then it is because I left out the fact that one of Israel's goals is to be in the EU. If the UK was still a member then that task would be easier.

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Not really as all nations have a veto, so it wouldn't matter how the uk view Israel, they would still have to persuade all of the others.

Also Israel as a "Jewish only" state is fundamentally (!) At odds with some of the core principles of the EU, I cannot see them wanting to join I be honest.

Buy hey, let's not let any of that stop you, any links to Israel no matter how dubious play out well on certain dodgy websites, so it's inevitable that people would try to link Israel with keeping Britain in the eu. There's probably someone linking it with Britain leaving the eu too if you look hard enough.

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Originally Posted by tommy31

There won't be a soft brexit. The vote was won because of FoM. No FoM means no single market.

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I don't believe MPs will vote to leave the single market and plunge Britain into a financial crisis.

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Originally Posted by Eric Cartman

There was no formal plan. What kind of imbecile would opt to take 'short term pain' with no idea what they will receive at the end of it?

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Attachment 1014

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Originally Posted by CardiffIrish2

Ah yes the old traitor for for giving into Europe line espoused by the Daily Heil and UKIP.

Not that it's relevant but as you question my character with a veiled cowardice line I spent 12 years In a dangerous occupation for the benefit of my local community but thanks for the snipe.

My point is what was the plan to leave? What's the point in risking economic security without a definite idea of what to do next?

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I too worked on the door of the Dusty Forge pub mate :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by ian gibson

I too worked on the door of the Dusty Forge pub mate :thumbup:

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😂😂😂👍👍👍

Attachment 1015

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Originally Posted by Eric Cartman

There was no formal plan. What kind of imbecile would opt to take 'short term pain' with no idea what they will receive at the end of it?

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Originally Posted by TH63

Attachment 1014

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:hehe: :hehe: :hehe: :hehe: :hehe: :hehe: :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Rjk

Not really as all nations have a veto, so it wouldn't matter how the uk view Israel, they would still have to persuade all of the others.

Also Israel as a "Jewish only" state is fundamentally (!) At odds with some of the core principles of the EU, I cannot see them wanting to join I be honest.

Buy hey, let's not let any of that stop you, any links to Israel no matter how dubious play out well on certain dodgy websites, so it's inevitable that people would try to link Israel with keeping Britain in the eu. There's probably someone linking it with Britain leaving the eu too if you look hard enough.

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Israel wants the UK to remain in the EU. The reason given in the following article is pro-Israel influence by the UK. I see that Denis MacShane the disgraced Labour MP is a co-author of the article.

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.712587

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Originally Posted by CardiffIrish2

Ah yes the old traitor for for giving into Europe line espoused by the Daily Heil and UKIP.

Not that it's relevant but as you question my character with a veiled cowardice line I spent 12 years In a dangerous occupation for the benefit of my local community but thanks for the snipe.

My point is what was the plan to leave? What's the point in risking economic security without a definite idea of what to do next?

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No, your point was "I will ask those who voted leave is it really worth it ".

The Leave camp couldn't really come up with a detailed plan on what exactly should be done next could they? They were not in power. Now the government, that's a different matter. They could have and should have spent time producing a plan for Brexit. But they didn't and after the vote they ran away. The same accusation could be levelled at the Treasury, whose sole contribution to the referendum debate was scare-mongering on a massive about Brexit.

And you have no economic security in the EU. The UK rebate looks more precarious each passing year, the secretive TTIP trade agreement with the US is in trouble and you have no idea which countries will join the EU in future - except that they will certainly be net recipients of EU funding unlike the UK and will cost us more more in membership.

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Originally Posted by Eric Cartman

There was no formal plan. What kind of imbecile would opt to take 'short term pain' with no idea what they will receive at the end of it?

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How could the Leave campaign come up with a formal plan for Brexit? They weren't in power and, according to Cameron who vowed to stay on and see Brexit through, had no prospect of being in power.

So long as the vote supports the will of the people I don't see any problem with this ruling.

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Originally Posted by goslow

So long as the vote supports the will of the people I don't see any problem with this ruling.

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And what is the current will of the people? From what I can gather, there are far more leavers who would now vote remain than the other way around, now that we're getting more of a picture of what leaving the EU will actually mean, not the cobbled together bollocks spouted for months before the referendum.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

And what is the current will of the people? From what I can gather, there are far more leavers who would now vote remain than the other way around, now that we're getting more of a picture of what leaving the EU will actually mean, not the cobbled together bollocks spouted for months before the referendum.

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not in my neck of the woods

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Originally Posted by Packerman

not in my neck of the woods

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Which, of course, is representative of the rest of the UK :hehe:

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

And what is the current will of the people? From what I can gather, there are far more leavers who would now vote remain than the other way around, now that we're getting more of a picture of what leaving the EU will actually mean, not the cobbled together bollocks spouted for months before the referendum.

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The will of the people is Brexit or did you miss the referendum result.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Which, of course, is representative of the rest of the UK :hehe:

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"and from what you can gather" isn't either is it :hehe:

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Originally Posted by goslow

The will of the people is Brexit or did you miss the referendum result.

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That's why I asked what is the current will of the people, now that more facts and realities regarding the situation are being unearthed. How long should the referendum result be relevant as people change their minds? Forever, if you listen to a die-hard, bonehead Brexiter.

Out of interest, what did people vote for when they narrowly voted to leave the European Union? Given that there are a number of different eventualities to the same question, what right does this government have to decide on this?

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Originally Posted by Packerman

"and from what you can gather" isn't either is it :hehe:

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Do some research and get back to me.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Do some research and get back to me.

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no thanks, pre vote research showed we were staying in, the people on the other hand :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Packerman

no thanks, pre vote research showed we were staying in, the people on the other hand :thumbup:

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Keep going with your ostrich impressions then.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Keep going with your ostrich impressions then.

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keep being condescending then :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Packerman

keep being condescending then :thumbup:

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I will be until I get decent answers.

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Originally Posted by Robin Friday's Ghost

Yes. Your logic seems to be that if anything requires any sort of effort and causes any short-term hardship it isn't worth it. Just as well you weren't running the show in 1939.

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Oh gawd. Brexit is not the first time we've retreated from Europe bruv - we got chased out of France and Norway. Then we waited for Russia and America to save our arses. Hope Theresa Mayhem has a better plan for Brexit than that.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

I will be until I get decent answers.

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I've no idea what you want, other than to stay in the EU. We had a vote barely 4 months ago. The government has declared its intention, if allowed, to begin to act on that decision within a year of the vote. That doesn't seem to be an unreasonable delay bearing in mind the people now in power had to start pretty much from scratch in putting together a plan for exit. Which, you'll recall, is because the people in power, who promised us they'd act on the outcome and stick around to see it through, turned out to have lied to the electorate.

The vote to leave was yes or no. I don't recall anyone of note demanding a range of options. Did you? It was a vote to exit or remain. And we voted to leave. The terms of the exit are now being worked upon by a government who had it dumped on them by the Remain camp.