FT: SHEFFIELD UNITED 2 - 0 CARDIFF CITY. Match thread

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Originally Posted by Rjk

tanner was poor and our crossing in general was bad especially first half. I was surprised to see Alves go off but it wasn't completely unexplained

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Tanner is a league 2 player.

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Originally Posted by Bald Barry Bastad

Plays two big guys up front and then doesn't instruct them to get crosses in. The guy is clueless.

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There were a number of crosses, along with the usual aimless ‘pass’ to a defender, but they lacked any pace or threat whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Plenty of taking an extra touch, looking up, then looking up again, poor control, slow passes, no zip in our play, it's clunky and slow, predictable and almost always grinds to a halt. The manager isn't even close to championship level, he should be suffering with imposter syndrome, it's embarrassing, but add in this group of weak individuals (Players) they fold every time, there's a core of them who won't change, can't change, and if people think that a simple bit of coaching can sort out the majority of our players then they're watching the wrong game. Just look at them, you wouldn't be able to count on most of them to show some fight. No anger out there, no frustration, nothing.

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Think their fans will say they were miles off their best and even then the difference in quality of touch and the speed of passing and forward movement was night and day. Everything about us outside of the purple patch Riza hit early in his tenure screams mid-table League 1 side.

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Originally Posted by LA Bluebird

Think their fans will say they were miles off their best and even then the difference in quality of touch and the speed of passing and forward movement was night and day. Everything about us outside of the purple patch Riza hit early in his tenure screams mid-table League 1 side.

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nearly every team i watch against us are more fluid in possession. We look like we're reading from a manual, it's so unnatural.

The second goal sums us up. Colwill,
who is in the Sheff Utd half and has been brought on presumably to show some attacking creativity, turns backwards and fizzes a pass back to Rino who is the last defender. Rino has no-one to pass to, so all he can do is go back to the keeper. Instead he panics, tries to beat his marker, loses it and it's a goal to Sheff Utd.

No forward movement or vision, wrong decisions, poor quality and errors= League 1.

I was thinking something similar while watching this and previous games: why is everything that we do going forwards so blatantly obvious? Why are we incapable of creating anything that is not obvious.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Plenty of taking an extra touch, looking up, then looking up again, poor control, slow passes, no zip in our play, it's clunky and slow, predictable and almost always grinds to a halt. The manager isn't even close to championship level, he should be suffering with imposter syndrome, it's embarrassing, but add in this group of weak individuals (Players) they fold every time, there's a core of them who won't change, can't change, and if people think that a simple bit of coaching can sort out the majority of our players then they're watching the wrong game. Just look at them, you wouldn't be able to count on most of them to show some fight. No anger out there, no frustration, nothing.

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Obviously the manager will go but the next manager will have to work with these players, Shirley no other manager will want to buy any of them, you know far more about the technical aspect of the game than me, so I'm hoping that your optimism is spot on that a better manager can get something out of this squad next season. 👍

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Plenty of taking an extra touch, looking up, then looking up again, poor control, slow passes, no zip in our play, it's clunky and slow, predictable and almost always grinds to a halt. The manager isn't even close to championship level, he should be suffering with imposter syndrome, it's embarrassing, but add in this group of weak individuals (Players) they fold every time, there's a core of them who won't change, can't change, and if people think that a simple bit of coaching can sort out the majority of our players then they're watching the wrong game. Just look at them, you wouldn't be able to count on most of them to show some fight. No anger out there, no frustration, nothing.

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Plenty of folk on here saying how poor the Derby v Luton game was earlier but by comparison to both those sides we look like an under 11's on a Saturday morning. Forget tactics, formations, team selections, we just lack the strength, pace, physicality and quickness of mind that are fundamentals to being competitive at this - or even league 1 level. The club has accumulated an awful mishmash of footballers totally unsuitable for the rigours of Championship football, and it's eventually reaching the end result.

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Originally Posted by Heathblue

Obviously the manager will go but the next manager will have to work with these players, Shirley no other manager will want to buy any of them, you know far more about the technical aspect of the game than me, so I'm hoping that your optimism is spot on that a better manager can get something out of this squad next season. ��

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I don't actually know that much tactically, but i back myself to see what a player is about. I wont include Alves or Ashford, but i don't fancy any of our lot, not one of them.

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Originally Posted by A Quiet Monkfish

Plenty of folk on here saying how poor the Derby v Luton game was earlier but by comparison to both those sides we look like an under 11's on a Saturday morning. Forget tactics, formations, team selections, we just lack the strength, pace, physicality and quickness of mind that are fundamentals to being competitive at this - or even league 1 level. The club has accumulated an awful mishmash of footballers totally unsuitable for the rigours of Championship football, and it's eventually reaching the end result.

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Totally agree, when and not if we get relegated. These players are not good enough for League One. They have shown this in their lack of desire to fight to stay in the championship. As stated above the league below is much more physical than the championship. Will be interesting to see who we have in charge and the players we get in to see how we can compete at that level.
I feel we will be lucky to stay in League one next season. I am already accepting that is what the club will accept. It is not going to be a quick return to the championship any time soon. (I know it is not yet certain we are gone but I am going by what I am seeing in front of me)

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Originally Posted by city1927

These players are not good enough for League One.

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If that’s the case, how do you explain the fact that most of them have spent the majority of their careers at Championship level or the level above?

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Tanner is a league 2 player.

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Well even though I disagree unless the club address the way we are run that's where he may be soon.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

If that’s the case, how do you explain the fact that most of them have spent the majority of their careers at Championship level or the level above?

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Perhaps they were the worst player in that particular team and didn’t find themselves in a squad where they were expected to do the heavy lifting.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

If that’s the case, how do you explain the fact that most of them have spent the majority of their careers at Championship level or the level above?

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please don't get in the way of a good overreaction

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

If that’s the case, how do you explain the fact that most of them have spent the majority of their careers at Championship level or the level above?

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You are correct but look at the clubs around us who are also in the relegation battle. Their players are stepping up to the mark and proving their worth. Our players are not doing that, they are just picking up a nice pay cheque every week, resulting in our side loosing. By the team losing the players are not good enough, the table does not lie. Cardiff City are 2nd from bottom, the players have achieved this themselves they are the ones who go out and play the game. Simply facts they are not good enough.

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Originally Posted by Dave Blue

Perhaps they were the worst player in that particular team and didn’t find themselves in a squad where they were expected to do the heavy lifting.

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You know that’s not true. For instance, Willock was player of the year at QPR not so long ago.

I’m not back in the UK until after the season finishes, I haven’t seen us win a live game all season (on TV I have). I think this is the first time since I started in 1968/69 not to physically see us win a game, in 56 seasons!

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Originally Posted by city1927

You are correct but look at the clubs around us who are also in the relegation battle. Their players are stepping up to the mark and proving their worth. Our players are not doing that, they are just picking up a nice pay cheque every week, resulting in our side loosing. By the team losing the players are not good enough, the table does not lie. Cardiff City are 2nd from bottom, the players have achieved this themselves they are the ones who go out and play the game. Simply facts they are not good enough.

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The squad lacks leaders. Recruitment has been poor. The team lacks balance. Some of the so-called youngsters are greatly overrated. The management and coaching set-up is National League level at best. The team is disorganised and demoralised. But it’s way too simplistic to say the players simply aren’t good enough, just as it’s nonsense to claim they are all League One players.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

You know that’s not true. For instance, Willock was player of the year at QPR not so long ago.

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Yet he's barely impressed in the slightest since he joined us. Another where it'll be interesting to see how they do when they leave us, whether they continue to misfire or find their old form again.

Rino in particular and O Dowda havent been championship or above full backs. Fish hasn't been at the level. Chambers of course has but how I dont know. That's today's back 4.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

The squad lacks leaders. Recruitment has been poor. The team lacks balance. Some of the so-called youngsters are greatly overrated. The management and coaching set-up is National League level at best. The team is disorganised and demoralised. But it’s way too simplistic to say the players simply aren’t good enough, just as it’s nonsense to claim they are all League One players.

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I agree.

However there are not many players really putting their hands up to suggest they shouldn't be in league 1 mind. Not sure if any of them?

Take the point most of the squad could probably do ok at Preston or milwall etc and wouldn't be hugely out of their depth there.

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Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee

Yet he's barely impressed in the slightest since he joined us. Another where it'll be interesting to see how they do when they leave us, whether they continue to misfire or find their old form again.

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A lot of players who City fans believed were not good enough for us or were League One players at best are currently in teams that will survive in the Championship this season.

As regards the current squad, the notion that ‘they’re all shit’ is just ridiculous. Some are undoubtedly overrated, others are not very good by Championship standards, but we are where we are for a variety of reasons - not simply because the players aren’t good enough at this level, when a good percentage of them obviously are.

As poor as Riza and his back room staff have been and Tan and his board the transfer committee have let us down badly. There has seemingly been no thought in bringing in players to match a system and we have what we have. A mismatch of random players. The team is rotten from top to bottom.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

A lot of players who City fans believed were not good enough for us or were League One players at best are currently in teams that will survive in the Championship this season.

As regards the current squad, the notion that ‘they’re all shit’ is just ridiculous. Some are undoubtedly overrated, others are not very good by Championship standards, but we are where we are for a variety of reasons - not simply because the players aren’t good enough at this level, when a good percentage of them obviously are.

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Apart from Ashford, Alves (who isn't our player) and maybe Salech (not sure about him) none of thee players are on the up. Individually they could all do a job at championship level for a limited period of time, but most of them would be found out. A better manager may have us 17th, 18th in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Bald Barry Bastad

As poor as Riza and his back room staff have been and Tan and his board the transfer committee have let us down badly. There has seemingly been no thought in bringing in players to match a system and we have what we have. A mismatch of random players. The team is rotten from top to bottom.

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Agree, no thought, they're losers, and it's showing. As is the manager.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Apart from Ashford, Alves (who isn't our player) and maybe Salech (not sure about him) none of thee players are on the up. Individually they could all do a job at championship level for a limited period of time, but most of them would be found out. A better manager may have us 17th, 18th in my opinion.

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Fish will have a half decent career. Bookmark this.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

The squad lacks leaders. Recruitment has been poor. The team lacks balance. Some of the so-called youngsters are greatly overrated. The management and coaching set-up is National League level at best. The team is disorganised and demoralised. But it’s way too simplistic to say the players simply aren’t good enough, just as it’s nonsense to claim they are all League One players.

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It is a simplistic point to make as you have stated, but I am reflecting when I go to my work, and I take pride in what I do to achieve the best result that I can for my organisation. I am not afraid to challenge the management in a constructure way (you have highlighted this area in lacking leadership – I would like to find out at when this age happens in football compared to a normal working environment!). So why aren't the players doing this? If they believe in their own abilities, they can change this on the pitch. Once they cross that line it is over to them. I am frustrated in what I am seeing, and it is nothing against you at all, this is what a message board is for opinions and different points of view, and I appreciate your honest response

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Originally Posted by Father Dougal

Fish will have a half decent career. Bookmark this.

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Maybe, i can remember when people were slating him, but i couldn't really see why.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Maybe, i can remember when people were slating him, but i couldn't really see why.

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As long as his career doesn't flounder, he'll be fine.

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Originally Posted by Heathblue

Getting rid of Bulut a great decision !!!!
What an appalling team that has been assembled over the previous couple of years or so by an assembly of shit managers just shocking, our players incapable of receiving the ball and moving it on immediately, they all have stop and think about the next pass which is usually square or back if they aren't dispossessed of the ball in the meanwhile, the fans don't but these players and manager deserve relegation. Inc. the owner as well.

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Are the fans of any club ever to blame?

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Originally Posted by Father Dougal

Fish will have a half decent career. Bookmark this.

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Perhaps but we spent over 1m on him and he's been at fault for so many goals. He's still streets ahead of Daland. One of the all time bad signings.

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Originally Posted by city1927

It is a simplistic point to make as you have stated, but I am reflecting when I go to my work, and I take pride in what I do to achieve the best result that I can for my organisation. I am not afraid to challenge the management in a constructure way (you have highlighted this area in lacking leadership – I would like to find out at when this age happens in football compared to a normal working environment!). So why aren't the players doing this? If they believe in their own abilities, they can change this on the pitch. Once they cross that line it is over to them. I am frustrated in what I am seeing, and it is nothing against you at all, this is what a message board is for opinions and different points of view, and I appreciate your honest response

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What I would say is cast your mind back to 2016/17, when the team had completely lost its way under Trollope’s management. That squad included the likes of Peltier, Morrison, Whittingham, Ralls, Pilkington, Gunnarsson, Zohore and Manga, but they were looking hopeless. Disorganised, demoralised and destined for relegation.

Warnock took over, brought in a couple of new faces and everything changed pretty quickly. My point is we can’t just say all these players are not good enough. Some of them undoubtedly are. But a team needs leadership, coaching and proper management. This side has none of those things.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

Agree, no thought, they're losers, and it's showing. As is the manager.

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Remember Warnock saying he didn't like signing players from teams that had got relegated, as they were losers. We've got a team of them.

Works if you ignore Warnock's relegations :hehe:

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

What I would say is cast your mind back to 2016/17, when the team had completely lost its way under Trollope’s management. That squad included the likes of Peltier, Morrison, Whittingham, Ralls, Pilkington, Gunnarsson, Zohore and Manga, but they were looking hopeless. Disorganised, demoralised and destined for relegation.

Warnock took over, brought in a couple of new faces and everything changed pretty quickly. My point is we can’t just say all these players are not good enough. Some of them undoubtedly are. But a team needs leadership, coaching and proper management. This side has none of those things.

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Warnock signed Bamba and Hoilett, who were outstanding Championship players and added it to the spine of a side that had been promoted 4 seasons before.

We have three huge holes, our defenders can't defend, we've got no pace and apart from Salech and Robinson, nobody scores. Bamba and Hoilett make a hell of a difference.

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Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa

Warnock signed Bamba and Hoilett, who were outstanding Championship players and added it to the spine of a side that had been promoted 4 seasons before.

We have three huge holes, our defenders can't defend, we've got no pace and apart from Salech and Robinson, nobody scores. Bamba and Hoilett make a hell of a difference.

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And he got a tune out of Zohore. Which i suppose could add weight to what TLG is saying in terms of management.

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Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa

Warnock signed Bamba and Hoilett, who were outstanding Championship players and added it to the spine of a side that had been promoted 4 seasons before.

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I know. It’s almost as if all the players in a side struggling at the bottom of the table weren’t necessarily shit.

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Originally Posted by Tuerto

And he got a tune out of Zohore. Which i suppose could add weight to what TLG is saying in terms of management.

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Neil Warnocks don't grow on trees, however. Whatever you think of him, he was unbelievable at this level.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

I know. It’s almost as if all the players in a side struggling at the bottom of the table weren’t necessarily shit.

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Ours have been that shit for 4 seasons, though and there's no proof of them ever not being shit

Yeah there was a spine of a side there already.

Bennett and Noone were also there.

There were also a number of players who could battle and you'd want in a fight.

Ricky Lambert being written off helped as well.

This squad needs ripping apart and rebuilding completely.

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Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa

Ours have been that shit for 4 seasons, though and there's no proof of them ever not being shit

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Yup, they can't back it up. Most of this team are on the slide. I'm sure that there are people at professional football clubs who will see the potential in our players, it'll be interesting to see how many are poached during the summer to play at a higher level, even if that's a mid ranking championship club.