"I'm convinced that death is not the end for us whatever happens after that"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

1. I don't see you currently having a robust or logical alternative for the creator/ sustainer of time, matter & space. Your current model simply points to alien life, and of course angels (for example), as they are not human, fall into that category. The Bible records fallen angels seriously interfering with mankind on more than one occasion, and very dramatically, so how do you know that your chosen 'deities' are not simply fallen angels feeding you the 'doctrines of demons'?

---

Why does there have to be creator at all? And my model doesn't just point to alien life, far from it. I'm saying that the consciousness of all living things is eternal. There is no greater being, we are all just one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

2. The Holy Spirit does not enter humans at the point of Baptism. That was something taught to you by religious individuals who obviously didn't understand God's Word. I can understand why you parked religious 'christianity' or churchianity as some label it, because it makes zero sense!

---

So, enlighten us. When does the Holy Spirit enter a person, like it did with Peter? And please specify why I suspect you believe this is only happens for Evangelists like yourself and not other types of Christians?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

The Bible reveals to us that none of us are good people[/B], it doesn't matter if we are atheist, agnostic, theistic or born again believers; 'for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God' - the word sinner is used in sport, archery to be exact; it is called out when an arrow falls short of the target. We ALL FALL SHORT!

---

Well, I completely disagree with the Bible. I am a good person, whether the Bible thinks otherwise or not.

As a side note - are you aware of how condescending your posts can be at times, especially towards other types of Christians? I'm not offended by it, but it doesn't make you come across as a good person at all. But then, none of us are, right? Please take on board this little nugget before posting again :thumbup:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

Why does there have to be creator at all? And my model doesn't just point to alien life, far from it. I'm saying that the consciousness of all living things is eternal. There is no greater being, we are all just one.




So, enlighten us. When does the Holy Spirit enter a person, like it did with Peter? And please specify why I suspect you believe this is only happens for Evangelists like yourself and not other types of Christians?




Well, I completely disagree with the Bible. I am a good person, whether the Bible thinks otherwise or not.

As a side note - are you aware of how condescending your posts can be at times, especially towards other types of Christians? I'm not offended by it, but it doesn't make you come across as a good person at all. But then, none of us are, right? Please take on board this little nugget before posting again :thumbup:

---

You are born as a sinner, old fruit. That's the Christian schtick. You pop out of the womb and are partly responsible for what took place in the garden of Eden. Guilty from the off with the Great Jehovah, I'm afraid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

Why does there have to be creator at all? And my model doesn't just point to alien life, far from it. I'm saying that the consciousness of all living things is eternal. There is no greater being, we are all just one.




So, enlighten us. When does the Holy Spirit enter a person, like it did with Peter? And please specify why I suspect you believe this is only happens for Evangelists like yourself and not other types of Christians?


Well, I completely disagree with the Bible. I am a good person, whether the Bible thinks otherwise or not.

As a side note - are you aware of how condescending your posts can be at times, especially towards other types of Christians? I'm not offended by it, but it doesn't make you come across as a good person at all. But then, none of us are, right? Please take on board this little nugget before posting again :thumbup:

---

Other types of Christians?

I see, so as the word Christian by definition means 'follower of Christ', I have chosen that path, so who do these other Christians follow?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Other types of Christians?

I see, so as the word Christian by definition means 'follower of Christ', I have chosen that path, so who do these other Christians follow?

---

You tell me seeing as you’re so condescending towards them.

Stevo, all I have said is: The Bible reveals to us that none of us are good people, it doesn't matter if we are atheist, agnostic, theistic or born again believers; 'for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God' - the word sinner is used in sport, archery to be exact; it is called out when an arrow falls short of the target. We ALL FALL SHORT!

This is why we need a Saviour, we are not going to make it on our own, no matter how clued up, successful, powerful, wealthy or wise we may be; Jesus said, "I am the Way" - there is no plan B.

How is any of that being condescending towards anyone else who is following Christ?

As the great Charles H. Spurgeon said, “Every Christian is either a missionary or an imposter.”

I can only assume you are referring to the imposters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Stevo, all I have said is: The Bible reveals to us that none of us are good people, it doesn't matter if we are atheist, agnostic, theistic or born again believers; 'for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God' - the word sinner is used in sport, archery to be exact; it is called out when an arrow falls short of the target. We ALL FALL SHORT!

This is why we need a Saviour, we are not going to make it on our own, no matter how clued up, successful, powerful, wealthy or wise we may be; Jesus said, "I am the Way" - there is no plan B.

How is any of that being condescending towards anyone else who is following Christ?

As the great Charles H. Spurgeon said, “Every Christian is either a missionary or an imposter.”

I can only assume you are referring to the imposters.

---

It is imposible to talk to you every thing goes back to the book.
So entrenched you just do not listen to anyone very disturbing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

It is imposible to talk to you every thing goes back to the book.
So entrenched you just do not listen to anyone very disturbing.

---

To be fair to Truthpaste he has narrowed down his role to one of two options. He’s got all the wrong positions for a missionary (hard to think of someone less like Michael Palin) so he is obviously an imposter!

And a small minded, reactionary cult member!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

It is imposible to talk to you every thing goes back to the book.
So entrenched you just do not listen to anyone very disturbing.

---

Christian puts God's opinion above that of flawed individuals shocker!

And I don't only listen to opinions (including the insulting type) on here, but I address them too.
If only the agnostics could try that for one day.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Christian puts God's opinion above that of flawed individuals shocker!

And I don't only listen to opinions (including the insulting type) on here, but I address them too.
If only the agnostics could try that for one day.

---

This nail on head because i do not agree with you i am flawed.
Yet you keep pumping out unproven fables.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

This nail on head because i do not agree with you i am flawed.
Yet you keep pumping out unproven fables.

---

I get it, life and eternity would be a lot less complicated for you if God's Word (the Bible) turned out to be fiction.
Well consider this; you won't be the first person to prove it is, so the sooner you get with the program the better.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

Why does there have to be creator at all? And my model doesn't just point to alien life, far from it. I'm saying that the consciousness of all living things is eternal. There is no greater being, we are all just one.

---

Well not only the Bible, but SCIENCE (the god of the masses) doesn't agree with your thinking on this, the steady state theory was disproved in 1965 >> ".... using two observations: (1) counts of radio sources and (2) cosmic microwave background radiation. Observations show that the density of faint radio sources is higher than strong ones, implying that there were more cosmic radio sources billions of years ago than at present".

So science and theology require a beginning of time, space and matter. In your world view, how does this happen?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Well not only the Bible, but SCIENCE (the god of the masses) doesn't agree with your thinking on this, the steady state theory was disproved in 1965 >> ".... using two observations: (1) counts of radio sources and (2) cosmic microwave background radiation. Observations show that the density of faint radio sources is higher than strong ones, implying that there were more cosmic radio sources billions of years ago than at present".

So science and theology require a beginning of time, space and matter. In your world view, how does this happen?

---

The standard model and big bang theory are fundamentally flawed and a new way of thinking is needed to understand the very latest observations. But this does not prove the existence of God, does it?

What’s your understanding of the beginning of time?

And since when did I say I believed the steady state model?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

I get it, life and eternity would be a lot less complicated for you if God's Word (the Bible) turned out to be fiction.
Well consider this; you won't be the first person to prove it is, so the sooner you get with the program the better.

---

What to be brain washed to believe something i have no intention of ever doing.

https://youtu.be/dOncZGJjPQw?si=3mIF3DK67twtNeIj

https://youtu.be/yTLIiVA3t0Q?si=zTujYrTs_IGZ_e92

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

What to be brain washed to believe something i have no intention of ever doing.

---

Your god is more than happy for you to go down with him, so he is delighted for you to stay just as you are, condemned.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

The standard model and big bang theory are fundamentally flawed and a new way of thinking is needed to understand the very latest observations. But this does not prove the existence of God, does it?

What’s your understanding of the beginning of time?

And since when did I say I believed the steady state model?

---

Re the steady state model, you said earlier - "Why does there have to be creator at all?"
If there is no creator, then the universe we have today needs to have always been, science says NO' - think it through carefully.

Time began when this dimension that includes time, space & matter was created; it's interesting to note that the Bible explains that God naturally exists outside of time, ie in a dimension that requires no time at all, an eternal realm. It also claims that God has given everyone an eternal spirit & soul, which is why planning for that eternal realm should be our highest priority.
Unfortunately most people plan for thousands of things IN time including checking they have their passport a number of times before they arrive at the airport, but fail to make sure they have the right 'paperwork' for eternity, so they just leave it to chance!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Your god is more than happy for you to go down with him, so he is delighted for you to stay just as you are, condemned.

---

:thumbup:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Time began when this dimension that includes time, space & matter was created; it's interesting to note that the Bible explains that God naturally exists outside of time, ie in a dimension that requires no time at all, an eternal realm. It also claims that God has given everyone an eternal spirit & soul, which is why planning for that eternal realm should be our highest priority.

---

The things that surprises me about your endless contortions is that you will not just rely on faith in your supernatural fantasy, but insist on trying to tie an echo of science and rationality into the argument.

At which point the whole infantile belief system implodes! And your circular line of pseudo-thought returns to 'the bible says' or 'the bible claims'.

A metaphysical discussion about time and space might be interesting, but not when it is constantly debased like that.

You might get more traction on here (though I doubt it) if you stopped contradicting yourself. It is sad to watch.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

The things that surprises me about your endless contortions is that you will not just rely on faith in your supernatural fantasy, but insist on trying to tie an echo of science and rationality into the argument.

At which point the whole infantile belief system implodes! And your circular line of pseudo-thought returns to 'the bible says' or 'the bible claims'.

A metaphysical discussion about time and space might be interesting, but not when it is constantly debased like that.

You might get more traction on here (though I doubt it) if you stopped contradicting yourself. It is sad to watch.

---

I see you are still struggling to see that the truth in science and the Truth of God's Word will often collide, as they do in hundreds of places like Psalm 8:8 and 'the pathways of the sea' birthing oceanography as previously discussed.
So why should shuch observations be 'fantasy' when the reality of them can in many cases be tested by things you do understand and trust?

You as remain consistent as the female character in Hamlet who it was said of : "The lady doth protest too much, methinks".
And you will continue to do so until you have the grit to 'test all things' like those who really after the truth.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

I see you are still struggling to see that the truth in science and the Truth of God's Word will often collide, as they do in hundreds of places like Psalm 8:8 and 'the pathways of the sea' birthing oceanography as previously discussed.

---

There is no struggle. :hehe:

There is no 'truth' in opposition to 'Truth'.

You do love a capital letter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

There is no struggle. :hehe:

There is no 'truth' in opposition to 'Truth'.

You do love a capital letter.

---

Some truths are temporary, others are eternal, hence the emphasis.

And if you weren't struggling with this subject then you'd state your position with clarity and explain why you see it as the truth.

Attachment 6489

Or to put it another way - "Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God" - John 3:18

That model in a cowboy hat doesn't know whether she is supposed to be blathering about a 'gospel' or a 'Gospel'.

Have a word with her - you are the capital letter oracle.

Your blathering however is just more 'rinse and repeat'. Everyone on this board (across multiple threads) who disagrees with your fantasy fixation has stated their position clearly and at length. None of us have used the frame of reference you use (why would we?) so you are incapable of understanding or responding in a serious way. You just dollop more magical explanations and more quotes from a book that your critics have been exposed to for years and rejected as any source of 'truth'.

There may be some distorted and partial historical references, but those are just small details in a set of creation myths, fables and fantasy biographies - put together (the Old Testament) after centuries of evolving and expanding oral tradition and (New Testament) after several generations of time had passed when a small cult needed its central documents to unify its followers, and then went through further centuries of transcription and often mistranslation from Hebrew and Greek.

Or to put it another way - "you talk endless bollocks and live in a closed and reactionary echo chamber" - Jon 1:1

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

That model in a cowboy hat doesn't know whether she is supposed to be blathering about a 'gospel' or a 'Gospel'.

Have a word with her - you are the capital letter oracle.

Your blathering however is just more 'rinse and repeat'. Everyone on this board (across multiple threads) who disagrees with your fantasy fixation has stated their position clearly and at length. None of us have used the frame of reference you use (why would we?) so you are incapable of understanding or responding in a serious way. You just dollop more magical explanations and more quotes from a book that your critics have been exposed to for years and rejected as any source of 'truth'.

There may be some distorted and partial historical references, but those are just small details in a set of creation myths, fables and fantasy biographies - put together (the Old Testament) after centuries of evolving and expanding oral tradition and (New Testament) after several generations of time had passed when a small cult needed its central documents to unify its followers, and then went through further centuries of transcription and often mistranslation from Hebrew and Greek.

Or to put it another way - "you talk endless bollocks and live in a closed and reactionary echo chamber" - Jon 1:1

---

Your ability to generate new lies is impressive, albeit typical of the one who inspires you.
I look forward to addressing these latest inventions as soon as time allows.

NB: Not one person including yourself has presented a clear position, all they have done is suggested that those who serve Christ are misled and/ or deluded. That's called opposition, not presentation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Your ability to generate new lies is impressive....

---

In before the Genie:

Attachment 6490

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Your ability to generate new lies is impressive, albeit typical of the one who inspires you.
I look forward to addressing these latest inventions as soon as time allows.

NB: Not one person including yourself has presented a clear position, all they have done is suggested that those who serve Christ are misled and/ or deluded. That's called opposition, not presentation.

---

I thought I had?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

I thought I had?

---

You did.

I'm not on the same page as you, but you have been clear and thorough in explaining your position.

I think the problem is you didn't sign off with a random biblical quote.

Truthpaste loves a good quote. It seals the deal for him.

Thought so

Instead, I could quote thousands of current day testimonies of NDEs, UAPs, books on quantum physics and other sciences, declassified papers from the FBI and CIA, all of which backup my position. Much more reliable than a 2000+ year old book I’d say.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

Instead, I could quote thousands of current day testimonies of NDEs, UAPs, books on quantum physics and other sciences, declassified papers from the FBI and CIA, all of which backup my position. Much more reliable than a 2000+ year old book I’d say.

---

Just saying you have a library of evidence is not an argument re any subject.

Now grab the best examples from all the "testimonies of NDEs, UAPs, books on quantum physics and other sciences, declassified papers from the FBI and CIA" you claim have persuaded you and show us something even 10% as convincing as the history, teachings, works and only solution for mankind that is found alone in Jesus Christ.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jon1959

Or to put it another way - "you talk endless bollocks and live in a closed and reactionary echo chamber" - Jon 1:1

---

In another words, you produce a different style but in the end we get the same level of froth that oozes out of the 'Genie'.

All commentary on others and no substance yourself is a constant with you.

Please can someone rid me of this accursed priest

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

In another words, you produce a different style but in the end we get the same level of froth that oozes out of the 'Genie'.

All commentary on others and no substance yourself is a constant with you.

---

Everyone else spouts froth but you, who believes in talking animals and who has been repeatedly caught lying, are the voice of gravitas. Hilarious.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Just saying you have a library of evidence is not an argument re any subject.

Now grab the best examples from all the "testimonies of NDEs, UAPs, books on quantum physics and other sciences, declassified papers from the FBI and CIA" you claim have persuaded you and show us something even 10% as convincing as the history, teachings, works and only solution for mankind that is found alone in Jesus Christ.

---

Reading this proves you are brainwashed by a 2000yr old book of fairy stories.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by truthpaste

Just saying you have a library of evidence is not an argument re any subject.

Now grab the best examples from all the "testimonies of NDEs, UAPs, books on quantum physics and other sciences, declassified papers from the FBI and CIA" you claim have persuaded you and show us something even 10% as convincing as the history, teachings, works and only solution for mankind that is found alone in Jesus Christ.

---

How is a 2000+ year old book any more convincing than the testimonies I can point toward? This just comes down to your opinion vs mine. You have never provided evidence to back up your claims and you and I know that you never will because you can't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

Reading this proves you are brainwashed by a 2000yr old book of fairy stories.

---

Absolute nut cases

Archbishop whatever on the news yesterday saying he was sorry about the child abuser he failed to sack , was so sorry to his victims but "forgave " the abuser ....like all these God types do

No wonder the victims and families want to see the church in court over all this

If God created everything then he created Christian child abusing Priests

No getting away from that but they always wriggle out of it

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Absolute nut cases

Archbishop whatever on the news yesterday saying he was sorry about the child abuser he failed to sack , was so sorry to his victims but "forgave " the abuser ....like all these God types do

No wonder the victims and families want to see the church in court over all this

If God created everything then he created Christian child abusing Priests

No getting away from that but they always wriggle out of it

---

Truthpaste will say Welby is following the wrong god

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

Truthpaste will say Welby is following the wrong god

---

Or that God told him to forgive him. The same God that told him to ignore all those allegations years ago.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stevo

How is a 2000+ year old book any more convincing than the testimonies I can point toward? This just comes down to your opinion vs mine. You have never provided evidence to back up your claims and you and I know that you never will because you can't.

---

I have provided plenty of evidence, both scientific and historical when it comes to the Bible and the claims of Christ. So don't fool yourself on that score. So far, you've provided zero evidence for your space buddies, and we both know why... you've simply created a 'god' in your image, just as humans have been doing for thousands of years. A god who doesn't seek your time, devotion or any attention.
Unfortunately like all the other false gods, they are powerless to meet your deepest need.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeepster

Truthpaste will say Welby is following the wrong god

---

He refers to the God of the Bible, but shows no evidence that he has ever repented and so he is just another religious individual, as lost as any atheist or agnostic.