Oh now that you put it that way i now understand,thanx for the heads up :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
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Oh now that you put it that way i now understand,thanx for the heads up :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
Not really a fan of Trump per se, but I did find the internatinal plot to overthrow him quite interesting. However, I draw the line at chucking bricks at horses, as that is going outside the rules of engagement. That poor police woman could have easily been killed due to the stupidity of some idiots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
“International plot to overthrow him...” I missed that coup supported by Merkel and Trudeau to oust him, I thought it was a Putin plot that put him in?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
I agree throwing bricks at police horse is ***** trick. These antifa should be having a square go.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2SHuGha_bTo
Interesting clip I think we sadly support and a sport that has demonstrated acts of racism , hate , bigotry, greed, homophobia and misogynistic behaviours.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordi Culé
Of course we do and in the main all those issues have been tolerated.:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by life on mars
Let’s get the thread back on it’s subject
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...new-covid-wave
This is a really informative website from the University of Cambridge study. It is only for England but the summaries are really informative and the stats and graphs likewise. Things like the estimate that 16% of 5-14 year olds in England have been infected but just 0.001% of those infected (IFR) have died compared with only 3% of over 75 year old being infected but of those 23% have died. Nothing new in terms of what we have been told around the disproportionate impact on the young and old but stark when you see the supporting statistics.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Similarly there are some informative graphs tracking the R rate particularly around key points of changes in Government Policy in England. The massive falls in R just after the lockdown and the increases as policies were softened on May 12th with attendant increased likelihood that R is above 1 by English Region as we move towards the 1 June additional softening where there is no data yet.
https://www.mrc-bsu.cam.ac.uk/now-casting/
Don't fall for it. From what I have seen quoted, he was fine when white people (who were armed to the teeth) were out en masse, protesting about needing a haircut and threatening the lives of the liberal governers outside their office buildings. He's also fine with police brutality and will seek to dismiss what's happened or defend the officers.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster
The 'rule of law' for Wales Bales means "the rules that I want to be the law" :thumbup:
Things looking good in Germany and Italy now as things have opened, as did schools in France a month ago....Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
We are all, maybe, guilty of that to some extent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heisenberg
Whilst recognising that it is right that people should be allowed to demonstrate for the Black Lives Matter movement, it would be hypocritical to say that people shouldn't be allowed to demonstrate for getting a haircut.
But, that is ignoring the context. No-one will die from long hair, black people have been dying for hundreds of years simply for being black.
I support the cause, but perhaps not the protests. What I am saying is flawed (slippery slope fallacy) but in the case of a spike in new cases it will be all too easy for Governments around the world to point a finger of blame at the protests.
My Social Media pages have been flooded with photos of looters (always black) and words like "Look at their pain and grief for George Floyd". Simple Google images put these images from anywhere between 2010 and 2019. It's very easy to turn lies into fact with simple memes, I just hope that the cause isn't relegated to a debate about social irresponsibility from people protesting - with the movement being blamed for spikes in new cases (in a backdrop where countries are easing lockdowns)
Not sure what point you are making. Are you saying that the R rate and number of daily infections in Germany and Italy was the same as ours when they took comparable measures to ease the lockdown therefore we have strong evidence from elsewhere that we will see similar results?Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
He said I was "silly" for calling him a hypocrite yesterday - this is exactly the sort of thing I had in my mind when I said it. This time last year, he and others who are always banging on about global, neoliberal conspiracies were lauding those who they saw as freedom fighters taking part in the yellow vest protests, now, because it suits his trumps (pun intended) everything else obsession, he comes at things from a completely different direction - this is not me comparing the merits or otherwise of the different protests, it's me just pointing out Gluey's clear hypocrisy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heisenberg
If he is saying that, then he is wrong. The R rate in Germany was at 0.65 when the lockdown was announced.Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...st-in-six-days
https://public.flourish.studio/visua...sation/2720245
There's always a quote!Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
The dude was a bad geezer and they took him out because he was planning more bad stuff. Why are you even trying to make a case for him and Iran? They beat the shit out of any protesters over there and lock them up. Free the Iranians!
I was trying to be scarcastic to him :biggrin:Quote:
Originally Posted by Heisenberg
I watched the interview referred to in this piece earlier and it was good to hear someone speaking in honest, clear, easily understandable, terms on subjects the public want to be told about - I learned a hundred times more from him than I do when having to listen to the vague platitudes trotted out at Government briefings;-
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...scientist-says
:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
Another "strong man" leader showing he is anything else but that;-
"Here is a further update from Reuters on Brazil, which has removed from public view months of data on its Covid-19 epidemic.
The health ministry in Brazil - which has the world’s second-largest coronavirus outbreak - removed the data from a website that had documented the epidemic over time and by state and municipality.
The ministry also stopped giving a total count of confirmed cases, which have shot past 672,000, more than anywhere outside the United States, or a total death toll, which passed Italy this week, nearing 36,000 by Saturday.
“The cumulative data ... does not reflect the moment the country is in,” Bolsonaro said on Twitter, citing a note from the ministry. “Other actions are underway to improve the reporting of cases and confirmation of diagnoses.”
Bolsonaro has played down the dangers of the pandemic, replaced medical experts in the health ministry with military officials and argued against state lockdowns to fight the virus, hobbling the country’s public health response. Neither Bolsonaro nor the ministry gave a reason for erasing most of the data on the covid.saude.gov.br website, which had been a key public resource for tracking the pandemic."
Good work :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster
I know it's the weekend and the figures are always lower, but it's good to see no deaths in Scotland and Northern Ireland today and only 77 in the UK. That said, the first time there were 100 or more deaths in a day was on 23 March and if you had told people then that the next time it would drop below 100 in a day would be on June 7, they would have been absolutely horrified.
Nowhere have I stated that a random self-appointed subset of the population should be allowed to take it upon themselves to break established social distancing rules in an uncontrolled manner. You're just being a "silly"ass if you think the rule of law can be bypassed on ideological grounds if it suits your own specific agenda. You need to have agreed rules that everybody follows which take into account the situation of every person, and not play Russian roulette with peoples lives in a lawless fashion.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Why do you think I said I wasn't posting about the rights and wrongs of the protests but about your hypocrisy?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
Why do you consider solutions to problems to be hypocrisy? The economy is in freefall and some corretive action needs to be taken. You sound like a Welsh version of Kim Jong Un.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
You can find a scientist to to argue the case for pretty much every different aspect of the Coronavirus outbreak. The Guardian has naturally sought out comments to support their views, and the Telegraph, Mail, have also had editorials and articles with many scientists espousing different views - including the so-called 'R' number [which includes care homes and hospitals], and the general efficacy of the whole lockdown process. You pays yer money ...Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Coronavirus: US-China virus row flares with senator's comments https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52954697
How on earth could one country possibly block another from producing a vaccine? How would that be possible?Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
Something like Stuxnet perhaps.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
I suppose the question would be "why" rather than "how"?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
Also, very much "how"Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
By holding back information about specifics of the virus and its originsQuote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
There has been an increasing amount of press suggesting that the virus was manipulated in the biological laboratory in Wuhan, to make it easier to to replicate in a host..ie a chimena. Whether that's true and whether it was released intentionally or by accident who knows. Lets for the moment assume it came from the lab and not a wet market.
One thing that is increasingly evident is that two countries in particular, USA & UK, both with very advanced healthcare technology and with very similar lifestyles and diet, have suffered the worst death rates in the world. Generally, the further east you go the better the outcomes, through countries with a Mediterranean lifestyle, and lowest death rates in those with an Asian lifestyle.
If the virus was manipulated intracellularly there must have been an objective, and maybe that objective was to make it particularly virulent to those with a Western lifestyle and diet, particularly USA citizens for political reasons.
Im not sure whether such specific targeting is scientifically possible but it makes for an interesting hypothesis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
There are studies (not Chinese ones before you ask) where analysis shows it is natural and not manmade.
There are two things needed for a country to be at the top of the death league, and that's 1) lots of deaths and 2) accurate recording of death. The US and the UK are at the top because they are the countries with both. I'd be certain that China, Brazil, Russia, India etc (not western countries with western lifestyles) have actually had more deaths than the UK.
I'd also say that generally the further east you go, the better the governments reacted, rather than due to the lifestyle.
Did you mean chimera?
Yes.....spellcheck??
It’s definitely going to get messy in the next year. If it is proven to come from a Chinese lab then the future won’t look good for China. Them holding back on its origins, if true, isn’t a good look.Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
One thing I’m totally clueless about is SARS and mers, didn’t even register them at the time, similar corona virus I believe but how come they didn’t become a pandemic? Was it SARS that was spreading as far away as in Toronto?
One big difference is that SARS had major symptoms that started quickly. The vast majority get very ill so fast that it wouldn't spread. Whereas you can have Covid-19 without knowing it, so can go about your daily life and unknowingly infect others (hence the super spreaders).Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
At the moment, the question was the virus man made boils down to agenda driven alt right speculation v qualified people who know what they're talking about - I wonder who I should trust?
https://www.newscientist.com/term/coronavirus-come-lab/
https://www.asianscientist.com/2020/...-not-man-made/
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full...1.2020.1733440
And people call the lefties hysterical and paranoid:biggrin:Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
All cleared up then China have declared war on the West by releasing viral warfare via Wuhan. All cleared up, let’s all move on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Comment in today’s Telegraph that of all the wet markets in the world the virus happened to start from one that had a biological laboratory on its doorstep
This story has been going round since about January. You're at least four months behind Organ Morgan!Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
https://www.vox.com/2020/4/23/212264...onavirus-china
"Since there’s no robust evidence in support of the lab-leak theory, Daszak says he’s worried that it could become a conspiratorial distraction with serious consequences.
“There is a group of people who do not want to believe that this is a natural, unfortunate incident,” he said. “And the real bad part of that is that if we don’t believe that we won’t try and stop other viruses in wildlife. Instead, we will focus on labs and close them down when they’re the ones trying to develop vaccines to cure us right now. I mean, how ironic could we go?”"
A bit like all the top secret labs in the World yet the novichok poisoning was not far from Porton Down, Britain's top secret biological and chemical warfare site.Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
I think most sane people have been saying this since late March.Quote:
“You’ve got an enormous disparity. I don’t believe the reason is any other than the actions taken by the government very early on,” says King. Ministers’ focus on other issues meant they failed to act in February and March, he says.
This view is shared by infectious disease and public health experts. “We have been playing catch-up from the start,” says Helen Ward at Imperial College London. She cites slowness on testing, tracing and isolating people, and on social distancing. A national lockdown wasn’t imposed until 23 March, about two months after the country’s first confirmed case.