Police commissioner requests 'immediate review' of decision to ban Maccabi Tel Aviv fans

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

According to your definition, that would involve me having "strong, unreasonable beliefs..."

My beliefs on this subject are not in the least bit unreasonable. Explosion of identity? Give me a break.

If you want to pretend these morons are putting up flags to express their 'exploding' identity, then bully for you. The fact is that anyone with a brain bigger than a peanut knows what's really happening, and why it's happening now when it's never happened before.

Before we know it you'll be telling us Tommy Ten Names and his fan club are virtuous individuals who have the very best of intentions.

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Not my definition. Cambridge Dictionary.

What a black and white world you live in. You should go and watch Cardiff Draconians! (Careful though, there is a Welsh flag on a lamppost in Ganalfa) and you wouldn't want to combust before watching the game.

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Originally Posted by TheBirchgrovePub

I have spoken to plenty of people like this and no one can ever give me an answer without it inevitably coming full circle to the main issue of there’s too many foreigners. They don’t care whether those people have been here 5 minutes or 20 years, they’re all lumped in together. They don’t care if they’re here illegally or legally, they’re all lumped in together.

The majority love catch phrases like “look after our own” whilst having zero idea of the meaning behind it. Let’s be fair you don’t have a clue how much your local council spends on “housing and feeding” immigrants but let’s be clear in the grand scheme of things it is minuscule in comparison to other spending across the UK. Immigrants prop up our NHS (nearly 40% of all NHS consultants were born overseas) but people are fed the narrative to blame immigrants for them not getting a hospital appointment and fall for it. When the reality is very different.

Still yet to hear anyone behind a reform policy (have they even announced any yet?) that doesn’t come back to let’s get rid of foreigners as if that will solve their problems in paying the rent every month. Driven by social media, right wing grifters and people hungry for fame who have spotted an opportunity to do the dirty work for the people pulling the strings well above them (and political parties) and gain some notoriety off the back of it.

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I don’t believe you’ve spoken to too many people about this. You’ve not really discussed it with me in an adult way, just hurled abuse.
I’ll stand in for Dave 52, and try to explain my views and hopefully we can meet in the middle.
I will never use the term “ there are too many foreigners” I do care if they’ve been here 5mins or 25 yrs. I very much appreciate the foreigners who move to this country to Work, learn, contribute, and mingle. I have lots of respect for them. I appreciate them. I also have compassion for refugees who come here to escape war torn countries and regions and will happily help them as much as I can.
What I don’t have much time for and I find frustrating, is the illegal immigrants who get to this country with no other motive other than to get what they can without giving anything back.
What I also don’t have time for is successive governments who promise to eradicate this problem, but then fail abysmally when they get into power.
I could talk all day about other ways successive governments have wazzed over working class people, but this is my opinion on the illegal immigrant situation
If you think I’m a bigoted racist for holding these views then so be it.

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Originally Posted by JamesWales

What a black and white world you live in.

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I live in the real world.

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

I donÂ’t believe youÂ’ve spoken to too many people about this. YouÂ’ve not really discussed it with me in an adult way, just hurled abuse.
IÂ’ll stand in for Dave 52, and try to explain my views and hopefully we can meet in the middle.
I will never use the term “ there are too many foreigners” I do care if they’ve been here 5mins or 25 yrs. I very much appreciate the foreigners who move to this country to Work, learn, contribute, and mingle. I have lots of respect for them. I appreciate them. I also have compassion for refugees who come here to escape war torn countries and regions and will happily help them as much as I can.
What I donÂ’t have much time for and I find frustrating, is the illegal immigrants who get to this country with no other motive other than to get what they can without giving anything back.
What I also donÂ’t have time for is successive governments who promise to eradicate this problem, but then fail abysmally when they get into power.
I could talk all day about other ways successive governments have wazzed over working class people, but this is my opinion on the illegal immigrant situation
If you think IÂ’m a bigoted racist for holding these views then so be it.

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How many of these people with “no other motive than to get what they can without giving anything back” have you met? Would love to know how you have come to that conclusion or as expected it is a narrative in your head that’s been slowly drip fed to you. They survive off about £10 a week in a small hotel room and the vast majority would love to have the right to work here. They aren’t being housed in luxury accommodation, given private medical and dental appointments and taking the jobs of everyone sat on their arse in Wetherspoons on a Wednesday morning despite what you seem to believe.

The fact you think Farage and his band of grifters are the men to sort this country out is genuinely laughable. Let’s not even get started on the Russian links. Absolute chancer.

If you’re on the same side as the likes of Nigel Farage, Tommy Robinson, Katie Hopkins and the horrible hate they spread then that should tell you everything you need to know about yourself.

This is from a BBC report in August:

"In one district, Weoley Castle, the BBC found two men carrying a ladder and shopping bags. A DIY trip this was not, because as we stop to talk to them one rests the ladder against a lamppost, the other pulls a union jack from the bag, and the next minute it's flying high. They tell us they want to spread "love, unity and patriotism", but don't want to be filmed or interviewed.

"While the Weoley Warriors have focused activities on Birmingham, Operation Raise the Colours claims to have supplied flags to areas such as Wolverhampton, West Bromwich and Staffordshire. On Thursday, in London's Canary Wharf, a large group of men, many masked, raised hundreds of flags in support of the campaign. The Weoley Warriors did not respond when BBC News tried to contact the group via social media and its crowdfunding page in relation to this piece."

Odd that so many of those involved in this "explosion of identity" wish to keep their identities concealed. Why can that be?

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life, paid taxes and funded the NHS why on Earth should he be concerned about the Government feeding and housing immigrants? It's nothing to do with Dave 52.

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life then he's unlikely to be homeless and he has enough to feed himself at the very least: if he's paid his taxes then he's unlikely to be in trouble with the Revenue and if he's paid into the NHS then hopefully he can get the necessary treatment if he falls ill. Oh and incidentally, receive treatment by many of the immigrants he griping about!!!

It all sounds like sour grapes to me. If Dave 52 honestly believes that stopping funds to immigrants will be diverted back into his pocket then he's sadly deluded. Any savings will inevitably be given away to higher earners as tax breaks. It's not the immigrants that's Dave 52's adversaries, it's the rich elite who milk us for all they can get and control the politics to boot.

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Originally Posted by TheBirchgrovePub

I have spoken to plenty of people like this and no one can ever give me an answer without it inevitably coming full circle to the main issue of there’s too many foreigners. They don’t care whether those people have been here 5 minutes or 20 years, they’re all lumped in together. They don’t care if they’re here illegally or legally, they’re all lumped in together.

The majority love catch phrases like “look after our own” whilst having zero idea of the meaning behind it. Let’s be fair you don’t have a clue how much your local council spends on “housing and feeding” immigrants but let’s be clear in the grand scheme of things it is minuscule in comparison to other spending across the UK. Immigrants prop up our NHS (nearly 40% of all NHS consultants were born overseas) but people are fed the narrative to blame immigrants for them not getting a hospital appointment and fall for it. When the reality is very different.

Still yet to hear anyone behind a reform policy (have they even announced any yet?) that doesn’t come back to let’s get rid of foreigners as if that will solve their problems in paying the rent every month. Driven by social media, right wing grifters and people hungry for fame who have spotted an opportunity to do the dirty work for the people pulling the strings well above them (and political parties) and gain some notoriety off the back of it.

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I think you are fibbing. You’ve not spoken to plenty of people about this. You’ve not even discussed it with me without getting abusive.
It seems beyond comprehension to the likes of you, TLG and Dorcus that there are plenty of genuine good people who don’t think there are too many foreigners in the country (as you put it), that welcome all nationalities who want to work here, contribute and mix., that welcome all refugees from war torn countries and regions., but draw the line at illegal immigrants who are just here to take and not contribute.
Are you happy with illegal immigrants entering the country?
Why do countries bother having borders? Why don’t we just open up all the borders and do away with passports.? That way anyone could enter any country when ever they wanted, and for whatever reason. Would that work?
The reason Reform have become so popular, is not because we’ve become an island full of moronic racist xenaphobes, but because they have said they will do what both Labour and Conservatives governments promised to do and didn’t.. get on top of the problem of illegal immigrants.
Most people have accepted being wazzed over on all other points over the yrs, but illegal immigration is the one sticking point that is not going away. For future governments to ignore this will be sheer folly.

Define ‘illegal immigration’.

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

I think you are fibbing. You’ve not spoken to plenty of people about this. You’ve not even discussed it with me without getting abusive.
It seems beyond comprehension to the likes of you, TLG and Dorcus that there are plenty of genuine good people who don’t think there are too many foreigners in the country (as you put it), that welcome all nationalities who want to work here, contribute and mix., that welcome all refugees from war torn countries and regions., but draw the line at illegal immigrants who are just here to take and not contribute.
Are you happy with illegal immigrants entering the country?
Why do countries bother having borders? Why don’t we just open up all the borders and do away with passports.? That way anyone could enter any country when ever they wanted, and for whatever reason. Would that work?
The reason Reform have become so popular, is not because we’ve become an island full of moronic racist xenaphobes, but because they have said they will do what both Labour and Conservatives governments promised to do and didn’t.. get on top of the problem of illegal immigrants.
Most people have accepted being wazzed over on all other points over the yrs, but illegal immigration is the one sticking point that is not going away. For future governments to ignore this will be sheer folly.

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Reform are popular because people like a scapegoat solution to their problems and Reform are skilled in whipping up fear, frustration, hate and fantasy.

Incidentally, I don’t know about anyone else but I don’t think we’ve suddenly become an island full of moronic, racist xenophobes. I believe there have always many millions of such people in the UK. The difference in recent times is that social media has given them a platform and they have become increasingly emboldened by the rhetoric of the personality politicians, the far right cheerleaders and the disgusting, deceitful populist media outlets.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

Incidentally, I donÂ’t know about anyone else but I donÂ’t think weÂ’ve suddenly become an island full of moronic, racist xenophobes. I believe there have always many millions of such people in the UK. The difference in recent times is that social media has given them a platform and they have become increasingly emboldened by the rhetoric of the personality politicians, the far right cheerleaders and the disgusting, deceitful populist media outlets.

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Absolutely, I would say if 30 percent are voting reform them 3 out of ten people being racist is bingo

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Originally Posted by Jordi Culé

We know that the first organised campaign to display flags called ‘Operation Raise the Colours’ was started by a former freak of the EDL who calls himself Andy Saxon and Britain First paid for the flags.

Interesting reasons behind the explosion of identity isnÂ’t it?

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FAO: Jimbo

You ignoring this?

I thought I was doing you a favour to try and stem some of your previous waffle.

Penny for your thoughts?

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Absolutely, I would say if 30 percent are voting reform them 3 out of ten people being racist is bingo

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Social media has ushered in the acceptability of being racist and many have become emboldened to "come out" having spent most of their lives in the closet. It's actually become fashionable within a certain social grouping.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

Social media has ushered in the acceptability of being racist and many have become emboldened to "come out" having spent most of their lives in the closet. It's actually become fashionable within a certain social grouping.

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Caerphilly Reform Candidate

In response to lowest ethnic population figures in his area in south wales , less than 3 percent

" I dont believe the census figures "

🤣

If hes an idiot no wonder those voting for him have nothing going on upstairs

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Caerphilly Reform Candidate

In response to lowest ethnic population figures in his area in south wales , less than 3 percent

" I dont believe the census figures "

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If hes an idiot no wonder those voting for him have nothing going on upstairs

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I live in Caerphilly and there are no ethnics there. However this goes against the Reform agenda.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life, paid taxes and funded the NHS why on Earth should he be concerned about the Government feeding and housing immigrants? It's nothing to do with Dave 52.

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life then he's unlikely to be homeless and he has enough to feed himself at the very least: if he's paid his taxes then he's unlikely to be in trouble with the Revenue and if he's paid into the NHS then hopefully he can get the necessary treatment if he falls ill. Oh and incidentally, receive treatment by many of the immigrants he griping about!!!

It all sounds like sour grapes to me. If Dave 52 honestly believes that stopping funds to immigrants will be diverted back into his pocket then he's sadly deluded. Any savings will inevitably be given away to higher earners as tax breaks. It's not the immigrants that's Dave 52's adversaries, it's the rich elite who milk us for all they can get and control the politics to boot.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

Define ‘illegal immigration’.

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Explain why we need borders and passports.

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

Explain why we need borders and passports.

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Even if starmer and labour had hit the ground running in regard to boats ....as we know a small but visible part of the immigration issue .....reform are the party that either out and out racists or the generally pissed off can vote for

The fact that in tv debates and other outlets and in polling figures ...lets call it 30 percent give or take .....when confronted with facts they dont want to face them or in the case of the caerphilly candidate ...... " dont believe them " its clear that we have 30 percent of the population who are a mix of racist , ignorant and stupid

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life, paid taxes and funded the NHS why on Earth should he be concerned about the Government feeding and housing immigrants? It's nothing to do with Dave 52.

If Dave 52 has probably worked all his life then he's unlikely to be homeless and he has enough to feed himself at the very least: if he's paid his taxes then he's unlikely to be in trouble with the Revenue and if he's paid into the NHS then hopefully he can get the necessary treatment if he falls ill. Oh and incidentally, receive treatment by many of the immigrants he griping about!!!

It all sounds like sour grapes to me. If Dave 52 honestly believes that stopping funds to immigrants will be diverted back into his pocket then he's sadly deluded. Any savings will inevitably be given away to higher earners as tax breaks. It's not the immigrants that's Dave 52's adversaries, it's the rich elite who milk us for all they can get and control the politics to boot.

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Even if starmer and labour had hit the ground running in regard to boats ....as we know a small but visible part of the immigration issue .....reform are the party that either out and out racists or the generally pissed off can vote for

The fact that in tv debates and other outlets and in polling figures ...lets call it 30 percent give or take .....when confronted with facts they dont want to face them or in the case of the caerphilly candidate ...... " dont believe them " its clear that we have 30 percent of the population who are a mix of racist , ignorant and stupid

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That’s all well and good, but you’ve not explained why we need borders and passports?

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

ThatÂ’s all well and good, but youÂ’ve not explained why we need borders and passports?

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It is indeed all well and good in that it sums up the reform vote

As for your question about why we need borders and passports that is a question for dorcus I believe so I will let him answer it

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

Explain why we need borders and passports.

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To keep Reform politicians out.

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

Explain why we need borders and passports.

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I can’t. Never really thought about it. But you’ve mentioned illegal immigration frequently. So how do you define it? I’m not talking about a general definition, I’m talking about your personal definition.

To me, the casual, glib way in which people happily describe other people as ‘illegals’ is nauseating.

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

I can’t. Never really thought about it. But you’ve mentioned illegal immigration frequently. So how do you define it? I’m not talking about a general definition, I’m talking about your personal definition.

To me, the casual, glib way in which people happily describe other people as ‘illegals’ is nauseating.

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Passports are no defence against illegal arrivals.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

I live in Caerphilly and there are no ethnics there. However this goes against the Reform agenda.

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I’ve seen feeds today where people actually believe there are MILLIONS of migrants in Wales now and there should be another Census.

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Originally Posted by Dave Blue

I’ve seen feeds today where people actually believe there are MILLIONS of migrants in Wales now and there should be another Census.

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I believe you and many of the same people believe the Earth is flat and they've seen Elvis in Tesco.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

I believe you and many of the same people believe the Earth is flat and they've seen Elvis in Tesco.

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I don’t believe Dave Blue believes the feeds he’s read.

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Originally Posted by Dorcus

Passports are no defence against illegal arrivals.

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They're not illegal when they arrive on the boats, they are entitled to seek asylum. There is no conventional route for these people to take.