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These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Will they be used on football fans any time soon?
My guess is yes of course......
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
Will they be used on football fans any time soon?
My guess is yes of course......
Of course they will be. Labour have already said they won't repeal them, either
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Not sure. Football fans have been detained in advance before I am not sure under what guise, but on intelligence they would commit trouble I guess.
This is to largely stop people like Just Stop Oil, and rightly so. Everyone has a right to protest, buy not to close whatever roads they like and bring the country to a halt. I don't have a right to close the M4 because Cardiff Council didn't pick my bins up last Thursday or whatever. Just Stop Oil etc pushed the law, and well.. there are consequences. The law changes.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Everyone has a right to protest.
Agreed.
Not sure the met police or the government do based on their actions this weekend mind.....
(Totally agree roads shouldn't be blocked etc under any circumstances)
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
Agreed.
Not sure the met police or the government do based on their actions this weekend mind.....
(Totally agree roads shouldn't be blocked etc under any circumstances)
So what do the police do if they suspect someone is about to lock themselves to fencing / run on the road etc?
I'd also add, there are people who would literally kill the main people involved in all this. Thst isn't the case for the leader of Republic I am certain of that, but the police cannot fk about. It was probably the most high profile event in the world this week, was front page news globally and the idea the police will sit back and watch is naive in the extreme.
Lots of people did peacefully protest, and good for them. That some were arrested suggests perhaps that they had other ambitions?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
I was looking forward to mass disorder on a level of the poll tax riots
Burning police vans
The kids of today have all gone soft
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
So what do the police do if they suspect someone is about to lock themselves to fencing / run on the road etc?
I'd also add, there are people who would literally kill the main people involved in all this. Thst isn't the case for the leader of Republic I am certain of that, but the police cannot fk about. It was probably the most high profile event in the world this week, was front page news globally and the idea the police will sit back and watch is naive in the extreme.
Lots of people did peacefully protest, and good for them. That some were arrested suggests perhaps that they had other ambitions?
You can’t arrest people based on ifs and buts. There had been meetings about this.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
I was looking forward to mass disorder on a level of the poll tax riots
Burning police vans
The kids of today have all gone soft
If you set fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
If you condone setting fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
Wonder who you'd be calling if someone filled you in? Ghostbusters?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dave Blue
You can’t arrest people based on ifs and buts. There had been meetings about this.
You clearly can if you suspect they weren't going to protest peacefully and were hellbent on disorder.
Maybe if we hadn't had a couple of years of people sitting in roads thinking they can do what the hell they like, then the legislation wouldn't have been needed.
Sensible people realise it was needed.
Peaceful protest is good, wilful disruption isn't.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
If you set fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
If you condone setting fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
Wonder who you'd be calling if someone filled you in? Ghostbusters?
Sludgebusters ?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
If you set fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
If you condone setting fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
Wonder who you'd be calling if someone filled you in? Ghostbusters?
Ladies And Gentlemen
The above post is a political post on behalf of the right wing of the Conservative party
The twats
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Ladies And Gentlemen
The above post is a political post on behalf of the right wing of the Conservative party
The twats
Guess you haven't seen the Labour position for what they will do re this new law yet.......
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
If you set fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
If you condone setting fire to a police van, then you're a real piece of shit.
Wonder who you'd be calling if someone filled you in? Ghostbusters?
I think he was joking , but needs must :hehe: a la France at the moment
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
Guess you haven't seen the Labour position for what they will do re this new law yet.......
Reading this,
https://www.thenational.scot/news/23...eral-election/
I’d say there’s a slight chance that the question posed out of the blue caught Lammy on the hop and he came out with a “holding”, pretty non commital reply. However, I’m probably being too generous there when you consider what Starmer said about student loans - apart from getting the Tories out, I can’t find too many reasons to support his version of the party.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Pedro de la Rosa
Of course they will be. Labour have already said they won't repeal them, either
Of course they won’t, they are all cut from the same cloth
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
I was actually pro these laws originally. I was sick of seeing activists interfering with the lives of normal people.
But these use of the powers are disgusting if the protests are fair and not intrusive.
It’s not a good sign of things to come
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Reading this,
https://www.thenational.scot/news/23...eral-election/
I’d say there’s a slight chance that the question posed out of the blue caught Lammy on the hop and he came out with a “holding”, pretty non commital reply. However, I’m probably being too generous there when you consider what Starmer said about student loans - apart from getting the Tories out, I can’t find too many reasons to support his version of the party.
Yes - too generous.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
Peaceful protest is good, wilful disruption isn't.
Tell that to the suffragettes.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
So what do the police do if they suspect someone is about to lock themselves to fencing / run on the road etc?
I'd also add, there are people who would literally kill the main people involved in all this. Thst isn't the case for the leader of Republic I am certain of that, but the police cannot fk about. It was probably the most high profile event in the world this week, was front page news globally and the idea the police will sit back and watch is naive in the extreme.
Lots of people did peacefully protest, and good for them. That some were arrested suggests perhaps that they had other ambitions?
Suspicion is not guilt. It is not even evidence of likely guilt. Anyone can say they "suspect" someone of something. It is no reason to arrest someone and take away their right to express their views.
Locking yourself to a fence while holding a "not my king" sign. Where is the harm in this? Is this what you class as "disorder"? Do you honestly believe that "suspecting" someone of intending to do this is a reason to infringe their human right to express their views? It is a very slippery slope.
The same right wing press who support your silly and dangerous views condemn Putin's Russia for arresting people who express THEIR view that it IS actually a war. Bizarre.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John Buchanan
Suspicion is not guilt. It is not even evidence of likely guilt. Anyone can say they "suspect" someone of something. It is no reason to arrest someone and take away their right to express their views.
Locking yourself to a fence while holding a "not my king" sign. Where is the harm in this? Is this what you class as "disorder"? Do you honestly believe that "suspecting" someone of intending to do this is a reason to infringe their human right to express their views? It is a very slippery slope.
The same right wing press who support your silly and dangerous views condemn Putin's Russia for arresting people who express THEIR view that it IS actually a war. Bizarre.
Football coaches in this country have been turned back from matches purely on suspicion of the likelihood of causing a breech of the peace.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Canton Kev
Tell that to the suffragettes.
They were fighting for a right to a voice. We all have a voice. It's profoundly different.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John Buchanan
Suspicion is not guilt. It is not even evidence of likely guilt. Anyone can say they "suspect" someone of something. It is no reason to arrest someone and take away their right to express their views.
Locking yourself to a fence while holding a "not my king" sign. Where is the harm in this? Is this what you class as "disorder"? Do you honestly believe that "suspecting" someone of intending to do this is a reason to infringe their human right to express their views? It is a very slippery slope.
The same right wing press who support your silly and dangerous views condemn Putin's Russia for arresting people who express THEIR view that it IS actually a war. Bizarre.
You would have to speak to the police about it. Are you saying the police should never intervene if they suspect disorder is imminent?
The comparison is Russia is laughable. The guy has been on TV talking about it. We would never have seen him again in Russia.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
You clearly can if you suspect they weren't going to protest peacefully and were hellbent on disorder.
Maybe if we hadn't had a couple of years of people sitting in roads thinking they can do what the hell they like, then the legislation wouldn't have been needed.
Sensible people realise it was needed.
Peaceful protest is good, wilful disruption isn't.
1984 was a work of fiction but we've now gone past that!
You can literally be arrested on suspicion of being about to protest. And people like you are arguing in favour of it!
You are making a point about something else re road blockages. Once someone does that the large majority of the country would support the police doing whatever they need to do to move that person on and that person to then have a significant consequence preventing them doing it again.
Come on you may agree with what the met did and that's fine but don't argue its something else. The met were speaking to the protestors in advance about their plans etc, all was agreed only for the met to turn up at the agreed location and arrest them as they arrived.
Re my OP the police will use this against football fans also. Arrange a rendezvous point in advance etc then hold/arrest people as they arrive. Watch it happen.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
Guess you haven't seen the Labour position for what they will do re this new law yet.......
I was talking about tory boy's whimpering post , not the labour party position
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
You would have to speak to the police about it. Are you saying the police should never intervene if they suspect disorder is imminent?
The comparison is Russia is laughable. The guy has been on TV talking about it. We would never have seen him again in Russia.
"Hmm, that guy is looking a bit shifty with a backpack. No, I cant be suspicious, I'd have to wait for him to explode a bomb".
Plenty of protestors protested with zero problems.
Leaders on one group were nicked. Maybe, just maybe the police had inside intelligence as to what was being planned?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
You would have to speak to the police about it. Are you saying the police should never intervene if they suspect disorder is imminent?
The comparison is Russia is laughable. The guy has been on TV talking about it. We would never have seen him again in Russia.
You avoid the point about Russia by changing it to wider point of the TV coverage. The main principle of arresting without proof for speaking your mind is exactly the same principle.
Having read your dangerous views on here, I SUSPECT that you are a danger to society. Therefore, following your line of thinking, you can have no argument when you are arrested and locked up.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
John Buchanan
You avoid the point about Russia by changing it to wider point of the TV coverage. The main principle of arresting without proof for speaking your mind is exactly the same principle.
Having read your dangerous views on here, I SUSPECT that you are a danger to society. Therefore, following your line of thinking, you can have no argument when you are arrested and locked up.
Is your SUSPICION based upon any intelligence you may have received about potential illegal activities by James? Yes or no?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
Is your SUSPICION based upon any intelligence you may have received about potential illegal activities by James? Yes or no?
I think law enforcement use terror as an excuse at times and plenty of false flags are laid by enforcement agencies to tighten laws.
Have a look into who funds Just Stop Oil and who it funds in return
https://twitter.com/willisellit/stat...LhmySD2aRt-GNg
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
"Hmm, that guy is looking a bit shifty with a backpack. No, I cant be suspicious, I'd have to wait for him to explode a bomb".
Plenty of protestors protested with zero problems.
Leaders on one group were nicked. Maybe, just maybe the police had inside intelligence as to what was being planned?
No because there have been laws in place to prevent terrorism that have been used for years. Many people have been convicted and are in prison now and will be for a very long time yet for planning terrorism acts.
Eg cardiff related is lloyd Gunton. Did he harm anyone? Nope. Did he get a life sentence? Yep. Is that controversial? Not really.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...st-attack-plot
We are talking about new laws here that have been used to arrest people who may have been about to stand still with a placard. Don't bring terrorism into it to make a point about something else.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TWGL1
Football coaches in this country have been turned back from matches purely on suspicion of the likelihood of causing a breech of the peace.
On top of this the section 60 order was used freely against city fans. I remember our coach being held for five hours by the met on the way to a spurs midweek game back in the day. Lots of innocent city fans suffered outrageous behaviour by police forces around the country due to a small amount of morons causing trouble in the clubs name.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TWGL1
False flags, lol.
"Just stop oil" have always been loons, hypocritical loons. Vince of course backs them because getting rid of that pesky oil should help his business.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
No because there have been laws in place to prevent terrorism that have been used for years. Many people have been convicted and are in prison now and will be for a very long time yet for planning terrorism acts.
Eg cardiff related is lloyd Gunton. Did he harm anyone? Nope. Did he get a life sentence? Yep. Is that controversial? Not really.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...st-attack-plot
We are talking about new laws here that have been used to arrest people who may have been about to stand still with a placard. Don't bring terrorism into it to make a point about something else.
The bomb example was less to do with terrorism and more to address the point of waiting for something to happen before arresting.
Another example which isn't terrorism then. If it become known that I might have said I was on my way to your place with a baseball bat to smash your head in I very much doubt you'd be using your same argument if I was to be arrested whilst on the way to do said deed.
Plenty of people standing still with placards weren't arrested. Care to explain why not?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Powis blue
On top of this the section 60 order was used freely against city fans. I remember our coach being held for five hours by the met on the way to a spurs midweek game back in the day. Lots of innocent city fans suffered outrageous behaviour by police forces around the country due to a small amount of morons causing trouble in the clubs name.
They stopped our bus up at Stoke with that nonsense , a copper came on board reading from a book
It was laughable
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
The bomb example was less to do with terrorism and more to address the point of waiting for something to happen before arresting.
Another example which isn't terrorism then. If it become known that I might have said I was on my way to your place with a baseball bat to smash your head in I very much doubt you'd be using your same argument if I was to be arrested whilst on the way to do said deed.
Plenty of people standing still with placards weren't arrested. Care to explain why not?
If you had a baseball bat then you could be arrested for that under current laws. Once again you are using laws that already exist and aren't really controversial to justify new laws. :thumbup:
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
If you had a baseball bat then you could be arrested for that under current laws. Once again you are using laws that already exist and aren't really controversial to justify new laws. :thumbup:
No, I'd be on my way to play baseball in a park with mates.
Since you want to attempt sophistry then, I'm unarmed apart from fists and feet of steel, honed by watching Cobra Kai and thus would be spin kicking your head off.
Would you still be using the same argument given I'd committed no offence?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JamesWales
They were fighting for a right to a voice. We all have a voice. It's profoundly different.
Should’ve done that fighting peacefully
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
They stopped our bus up at Stoke with that nonsense , a copper came on board reading from a book
It was laughable
Thatcher brought that shitty law in - Flying Picketts - and they applied it to football fans
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
No, I'd be on my way to play baseball in a park with mates.
Since you want to attempt sophistry then, I'm unarmed apart from fists and feet of steel, honed by watching Cobra Kai and thus would be spin kicking your head off.
Would you still be using the same argument given I'd committed no offence?
In this scenario I would be happy with calling the police to give them a heads up then in the unlikely scenario you did actually turn up you could then be arrested if you did anything. I'd lock the door and call the police when you turned up knocking or shouting (public order offence would then have been committed) and restraining orders etc could then be in place. Video evidence would also be used. The phone calls in advance to the police would be used as evidence against you in court to ensure you got a long sentence- as well as any texts or calls received in advance of threats.
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Father Dougal
In this scenario I would be happy with calling the police to give them a heads up then in the unlikely scenario you did actually turn up you could then be arrested if you did anything. I'd lock the door and call the police when you turned up knocking or shouting (public order offence would then have been committed) and restraining orders etc could then be in place. Video evidence would also be used. The phone calls in advance to the police would be used as evidence against you in court to ensure you got a long sentence- as well as any texts or calls received in advance of threats.
So you'd be calling the police to report a crime that hadn't happened, which you had no knowledge of happening? Wouldn't that be wasting police time, hmm?
Knocking a door is a public order offence is it? You sure about that?
You know full well that with credible suspicion from your phone call, police would be entitled to pull me over.
Now, going back to the question that seems to be unanswered by people like you, how do you explain the very many protestors who were NOT arrested during the coronation then?
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Re: These new laws that were used to arrest everyone for any Republic protests
Quote:
Originally Posted by
logic
So you'd be calling the police to report a crime that hadn't happened, which you had no knowledge of happening? Wouldn't that be wasting police time, hmm?
Knocking a door is a public order offence is it? You sure about that?
You know full well that with credible suspicion from your phone call, police would be entitled to pull me over.
Now, going back to the question that seems to be unanswered by people like you, how do you explain the very many protestors who were NOT arrested during the coronation then?
Are you a traffic warden or something :hehe: