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How positive can you stay?
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
I think there's a decent percentage of [us] fans who would agree, but are waiting til the Newcastle game when we can see for ourselves how our full [excluding injuries] squad copes at home with a mid-table Newcastle...
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Re: How positive can you stay?
You’re right, IT WAS ONLY ONE GAME.
We were outclassed in the 1st half, Bournemouth played at a much greater pace. But when made changes to the team in the 2nd half, we had a period of 20 minutes of being a lot more in control and if the bounce of the ball had gone our way, could easily have equalised.
Saturday will be a learning experience for the squad - this league is a big step up and teams are clinical and punish mistakes. It will take them a few games to get up to speed but with a few players coming in and players in the right positions, I think we’ll be ok.
I don’t think for a minute we’ll be troubling the Derby record.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
New boys need to settle in and we need to get Bamba out of midfield. Hopefully starting with Newcastle we will see things very differently. I'm more concerned that he has kept Damour as his "5th" centre mid but still preferred Bamba in there against Bournemouth. This looks like a wasted squad slot to me where we had more experienced options further forwards in Pilkington and Tomlin.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Our home form will keep us up if we stay up let’s just see how we do at home, our midfield should be in better shape vs Newcastle
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jamieccfc
Our home form will keep us up if we stay up let’s just see how we do at home, our midfield should be in better shape vs Newcastle
This
warnock said himself he dident want to play bamba in midfield but due to arter betis and gunnar not being available it was a makeshift midfield. my only concern is a striker as I dont believe Zohore can cut it at this level but I hope im proved wrong
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Give it 10 games and we will know where we are at. I largely agree we don’t have players to do this, but my national team was top in the FIFA rankings for a decade with shit players playing hoofball, so it can be done. Worst case scenario we go into December with 6 to 9 points and that will be the end of Neil, Tan thinking we should do better instead of invest in what’s needed. But we have what we have and there is nothing that can be done about it now. All we can do is give the boys time to acclimatize, Neil finding his best 11 and formation. And that is where the debates should lie with fans also. Think most would agree we didn’t prepare for the transfer market.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Seems I'm certainly more positive than some. I think we'll be in a relegation dog fight all season and wil struggle to get out of the bottom 4 or 5 at all. I don't subscribe to us being amongst the lowest points totals ever, I think we'll get more than last time around. I do agree that scoring goals is absolutely critical. We know we can defend and grind out draws but turning draws into wins will be pivotal.
Last time we beat Man City it was a springboard, If we don't get points off both Newcastle & Huddersfield it is going to be a very, very long season. We're capable of getting 2, I'm hoping for 4.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
If Zohore had been fit, Reid probably wouldn't have started Saturday's game. Therefore, all of our reported 26m investment would have been warming the bench. My worry is that Warnock will remain too loyal to those players from last season, despite some of them not being up to this level.
I'd love to see Arter, Murphy, Reid and Casamara start against Newcastle, alongside the long awaited reintroduction of Jazz Richards. Anyone else think we're going to be left frustrated by the non-introduction of Casamara? Ok, I know we've only played 1 game and the player needed time to acclimatise and get to know his teammates, I don't know why, but I just have this feeling that Warnock will be reluctant to start him (he'll probably put Gunnarsson in ahead of him when he is fit again) - we seem to favour players who huff & puff rather than those with technical ability.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Just don't get all the panic really.
What's the point of watching us last season, celebrating and wanting promotion to then dread what might happen to us when we do get up.
Just enjoy it, if as predicted we get relegated who knows when it may happen again, what if it was another 50 years?
We will take some beatings but particularly at home I think we will be tough to beat.
Just relax and enjoy seeing our club challenge some of the world's best players, it's hardly scrapping about in league 1 or 2.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Yes Rock flock, i suspect Casamara will be some way off introduction to. I also believe he is the type of player who will need a run of games to find his footing, and I’m not sure he will get that unless it is forced upon through injuries etc.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
I believe you have to decide your start point.
Mine is of very low expectation in terms of results or survival supported by the view that if we were playing in the Championship my expectation of achieving promotion would be also tempered. Can you imagine the hysteria if we got off to a bad start in the Championship.
Relegation, whist very disappointing, I can accept. I would not be embarrassed by it.
And as long as the club remains sensible then the financial position would be far stronger than had we not got promoted.
What would bother me would be a lack of effort, a lack of nous, capitulation.
And of course whilst I would be disappointed to see us shipping goals the 1-0 losses are even harder to take.
All easier to say than do, but Ill keep reminding myself.
And if we do achieve 17th or higher I will be ecstatic.
So, I will try and enjoy the matches what ever the position that we are in and take each match as it comes.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BLUEAWAY
I believe you have to decide your start point.
Mine is of very low expectation in terms of results or survival supported by the view that if we were playing in the Championship my expectation of achieving promotion would be also tempered. Can you imagine the hysteria if we got off to a bad start in the Championship.
Relegation, whist very disappointing, I can accept. I would not be embarrassed by it.
And as long as the club remains sensible then the financial position would be far stronger than had we not got promoted.
What would bother me would be a lack of effort, a lack of nous, capitulation.
And of course whilst I would be disappointed to see us shipping goals the 1-0 losses are even harder to take.
All easier to say than do, but Ill keep reminding myself.
And if we do achieve 17th or higher I will be ecstatic.
So, I will try and enjoy the matches what ever the position that we are in and take each match as it comes.
I think that's a good summary for how I am feeling about things too. We've taken a long odds bet on surviving in the Prem whilst ensuring the financial health and facilities of the Club improve. Whilst this focus on off-field improvement vs on-field improvement seems odd I think it is the best way forward for us when I look at the mess Sunderland, Villa and Brum have got themselves into from gambling beyond their means.
Given what I have seen over the years at Cardiff, this approach suits me fine despite my advancing years and the possibility we may never get here again in my lifetime. I'd rather the Club grew gradually and sustainably and my kids and grandkids had a Club to support.
However, where I differ from you is that I think once we've settled into the division after a few games that we will more than ruffle a few feathers as I do think we will have enough going forward with the new players plus our attack that did well last year.
The Championship is a good league and you don't get out of it by being a rubbish team. I don't subscribe to the National media bullshit and propaganda that we don't stand a chance, but the players have to believe that themselves for us to be able to give this a real good go. I think this is where NW's strategy of bringing in leaders wherever he can will pay off.
I'm really looking forward to seeing what these players are capable of doing as right now anything is possible still...
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Re: How positive can you stay?
The road to it going very wrong is easy to see - lose our next two, then we face nightmare fixtures in September and October, before a run of easier looking games in November and December. If we had as bad an autumn as we might well do and then results didn't improve in November, we could then be looking at one of the worst Premier League campaigns ever because, even in a squad whose spirit is as strong as this ones is, heads would start to drop then.
However, that's a long, long way off yet and I think we'll have points on the board by the time we face Arsenal - we got more points than most promoted sides manage in what was considered a pretty strong Championship last season, so we must have something going for us and we've added more quality since then. People are writing us off because we play in an unsexy way, we have a manager who many in the game can't stand, we have a "James Bond villain" owner and we're not spending all of our television money on new players and their wages.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Trigger
Just don't get all the panic really.
What's the point of watching us last season, celebrating and wanting promotion to then dread what might happen to us when we do get up.
Just enjoy it, if as predicted we get relegated who knows when it may happen again, what if it was another 50 years?
We will take some beatings but particularly at home I think we will be tough to beat.
Just relax and enjoy seeing our club challenge some of the world's best players, it's hardly scrapping about in league 1 or 2.
It’s not panic Trigger. I started watching the City in the mid 70’s , so I’ve endured some of the worst football we’ve played, and also seen some of the best. It’s just the squad we have, seems way too lightweight and bereft of ability to even contend in a relegation battle.
It’s less than 20 yrs ago we were playing the Jacks in a bottom division game, so to be where we are is a minor miracle. I just can’t summon up my usual optimism, although my support will be unwavering.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
How positive do you think Fulham fans are feeling now after being beaten 2-0 at home after all the money that they’ve spent
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
A Quiet Monkfish
I think there's a decent percentage of [us] fans who would agree, but are waiting til the Newcastle game when we can see for ourselves how our full [excluding injuries] squad copes at home with a mid-table Newcastle...
That's still too early to say how we'll do as well. We only need 10 wins this season so whereas first home game may be a fantastic opportunity for one of those it's likely our best results will come as the weather closes in and as teams get beaten up by chanpions league/cup schedule. No one will like playing in Cardiff then.
It's an uphill battle this year but that hill gets a lot steeper if we lose our home advantage, and we lose a bit of our home advantage if we drop our positivity and loudly supportive crowd. Keep the faith til the final outcome is known - jack's stayed up for 3 years with a squad no better than ours.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
Come on mate, cheer up. It's like Jekyll and Hyde reading those few sentences. After what we've been through and how brilliant the team and management were last season, they deserve more than a 90 minute appraisal. We went on that 4 match losing streak in the winter and capitulated at Derby but things turned out alright. Have some belief in these characters. IF we find ourselves in the bottom three in May then at least it would have been worth the journey and we'll be stronger for it.
I believe we did fine in the second half and weren't disgraced, despite the midfield emergency situation. Warnock has given the lads what they deserve and kept faith with those that got us up. He can now look them in the eye and show them what they need to improve on and they'll have nothing to complain about. Our Neil knows what he's doing.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
It’s not panic Trigger. I started watching the City in the mid 70’s , so I’ve endured some of the worst football we’ve played, and also seen some of the best. It’s just the squad we have, seems way too lightweight and bereft of ability to even contend in a relegation battle.
It’s less than 20 yrs ago we were playing the Jacks in a bottom division game, so to be where we are is a minor miracle. I just can’t summon up my usual optimism, although my support will be unwavering.
I was sort of agreeing with you and then started noting who I thought weren't lightweight and had the ability to hold their own at this level:
Etheridge
Morrison
Bamba
Ralls
Arter
Hoillett
I then listed those who I have reservations about but I think will probably do OK:
Smithies
Bennett
Cunningham
Richards
Manga
Connolly
Gunnarsson
Camarasa
Paterson
Reid
Murphy J
NML
Zohore
Before listing those I think will struggle to take the step up:
Murphy B
Peltier
Damour
Kadeem
Ward
Madine
So overall I'm hopeful we have a decent first team and bench in the whole squad. We may even have a few real stars if Reid, J Murphy, Zohore, Ralls, Camarasa, Etheridge, Arter, Hoilett, Bamba and Morrison play as I hope they will.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Pretty positive, less than 2 years ago I was on the way back from losing 2-0 at Burton Albion in the pouring rain as we slipped closer and closer to League 1. Now we're in the Premier League. We could quite easily have been in League 1 and returning to oblivion at this point the way it was going before Warnock arrived
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Lets see where we are after the first three matches.
If then we have 0 points we are in trouble.
Every point will be golden this season.
What I hope we get is some decisions going our way - that pelanty on Saturday could have seen heads dropping and a 4/5 goal beating.
I think that will be the difference been survival and relegation.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Penarth Blues
I was sort of agreeing with you and then started noting who I thought weren't lightweight and had the ability to hold their own at this level:
Etheridge
Morrison
Bamba
Ralls
Arter
Hoillett
I then listed those who I have reservations about but I think will probably do OK:
Smithies
Bennett
Cunningham
Richards
Manga
Connolly
Gunnarsson
Camarasa
Paterson
Reid
Murphy J
NML
Zohore
Before listing those I think will struggle to take the step up:
Murphy B
Peltier
Damour
Kadeem
Ward
Madine
So overall I'm hopeful we have a decent first team and bench in the whole squad. We may even have a few real stars if Reid, J Murphy, Zohore, Ralls, Camarasa, Etheridge, Arter, Hoilett, Bamba and Morrison play as I hope they will.
Based on Saturday, I'd stick Reid, Josh Murphy & Manga in the first list. Ward looked good when he came on as well, NML was awful and should have come off earlier IMO
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rock_Flock_of_Five
If Zohore had been fit, Reid probably wouldn't have started Saturday's game. Therefore, all of our reported 26m investment would have been warming the bench. My worry is that Warnock will remain too loyal to those players from last season, despite some of them not being up to this level.
I'd love to see Arter, Murphy, Reid and Casamara start against Newcastle, alongside the long awaited reintroduction of Jazz Richards. Anyone else think we're going to be left frustrated by the non-introduction of Casamara? Ok, I know we've only played 1 game and the player needed time to acclimatise and get to know his teammates, I don't know why, but I just have this feeling that Warnock will be reluctant to start him (he'll probably put Gunnarsson in ahead of him when he is fit again) - we seem to favour players who huff & puff rather than those with technical ability.
I think he would've. Patterson would've been on the bench; and Reid in behind Zohore.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ccfcwelshlad
I think he would've. Patterson would've been on the bench; and Reid in behind Zohore.
couldent agree more once everyone is fit patterson wont be seen anywhere near the midfield
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
steve davies
couldent agree more once everyone is fit patterson wont be seen anywhere near the midfield
Not necessarily a positive thing that. For his limitations he scores goals and was our top scorer, all that from a new signing playing in a new position.
I'm not sure we have strengthened significantly going forward that we can just drop a player capable of those goals from midfield.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Trigger
Not necessarily a positive thing that. For his limitations he scores goals and was our top scorer, all that from a new signing playing in a new position.
I'm not sure we have strengthened significantly going forward that we can just drop a player capable of those goals from midfield.
we have to bear in mind that he was signed as a fullback and not a midfielder and it was warnock who changed his position. i agree it worked in the championship but probably out of his depth in the premiership
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Trigger
Not necessarily a positive thing that. For his limitations he scores goals and was our top scorer, all that from a new signing playing in a new position.
I'm not sure we have strengthened significantly going forward that we can just drop a player capable of those goals from midfield.
You could argue that he's taking up Reid's best position at the moment, behind the striker. Reid still offers goals (as shown last season) but also a lot more in open play than Paterson does. Paterson is a bit of an enigma - he scores goals and wins a lot of headers, but doesn't appear to be able to do anything else.
I'll be very disappointed if Reid isn't playing behind Zohore or Ward on Saturday.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Hopefully that midfield on Saturday will never need to be repeated with Arter, Camarasa and Gunnarsson once fit to select from. I’m concerned about Peltier over Richards and Mendez-Lang over Murphy, don’t think those two starters are Premier League players. The fact that with Zohore unfit Madine was not introduced until the 88th minute tells you all you need to know about the faith the management have in Madine, not buying another striker looks a bit reckless to me. I like Reid and Murphy and think we can fashion a decent first 11 out of our squad. We must use home advantage to stay alive until January and then look again where we are, I’m sure we’ll all be roaring the boys on even when things get a bit sticky. Bluebirds!
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
William Treseder
Ok. It’s only one game. But it was a game that showed straight away, how poor our squad is.
I’m not wanting us to get into massive debt, to chase the almost impossible dream, and I will always be a bluebird, what ever happens to the club, but I fear we really are in for a torrid time this season.
The gulf in class between the premier league and the championship is massive, and with the signings we’ve made, I think we could well end up getting the least amount of points since the premier league started.
Anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a positive and optimistic kinda guy, but also a realist. On paper I feel we have one of the weakest squads to ever appear in the top flight.
It goes without saying that I’d love to be proved wrong, but I feel it will be a long, hard season that will test the patience of every one of our fans.
You say that you are a 'positive and optimistic kinda guy' but the evidence of your own post above indicates the exact opposite. How the hell you can write off our chances like that after one game, where most observers stated that we did ok for large periods in the second half of the game. Also where two of our new signings didnt feature at all, one only came on in the second half and two others of our main squad were out injured, is beyond me. Get a grip.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Very positive. Once the changes were made I think we showed that we can trouble a side of Bournemouth's ability which should mean we can trouble the majority.
Bamba isn't a midfielder.
Reid isn't a lone striker.
Murphy is a step above NML.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Penarth Blues
I think that's a good summary for how I am feeling about things too. We've taken a long odds bet on surviving in the Prem whilst ensuring the financial health and facilities of the Club improve. Whilst this focus on off-field improvement vs on-field improvement seems odd I think it is the best way forward for us when I look at the mess Sunderland, Villa and Brum have got themselves into from gambling beyond their means.
Given what I have seen over the years at Cardiff, this approach suits me fine despite my advancing years and the possibility we may never get here again in my lifetime. I'd rather the Club grew gradually and sustainably and my kids and grandkids had a Club to support.
However, where I differ from you is that I think once we've settled into the division after a few games that we will more than ruffle a few feathers as I do think we will have enough going forward with the new players plus our attack that did well last year.
The Championship is a good league and you don't get out of it by being a rubbish team. I don't subscribe to the National media bullshit and propaganda that we don't stand a chance, but the players have to believe that themselves for us to be able to give this a real good go. I think this is where NW's strategy of bringing in leaders wherever he can will pay off.
I'm really looking forward to seeing what these players are capable of doing as right now anything is possible still...
Ditto your last line.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
I was happy to get promotion. I want us to stay up. However, I just don't see how it can be done. We just don't have enough talent. In my opinion we needed at least a 50m investment and 2 or 3 more new faces.
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Re: How positive can you stay?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dml1954
You say that you are a 'positive and optimistic kinda guy' but the evidence of your own post above indicates the exact opposite. How the hell you can write off our chances like that after one game, where most observers stated that we did ok for large periods in the second half of the game. Also where two of our new signings didnt feature at all, one only came on in the second half and two others of our main squad were out injured, is beyond me. Get a grip.
You do know that it’s possible to be positive and optimistic, but not on every occasion do you?
