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Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Before all answer with "I do, to help those less fortunate and to pay for the NHS.." , a couple of points. First the BBC asked 1000 people the same question, and 15% said 'yes'. They then handed the form which authorizes the govt. to accept more tax that is legally required and said they'd help them complete it for them. Not one person took the form.
Secondly, we're currently taxed more than any time in the last 56 years.
The significance of my question is whether many on here realised that in 2019 Wales was given tax raising powers - the can increase by a further 10p in the pound in any tax band. The Senydd can dictate where and when we go places, what we teach in schools, what can and can't open, and how much money we're allowed to take home. There's no doubt that taxes in Wales will soon push up ahead of England - we already pay much higher Council taxes.
Seems we've got Home Rule from the Bay already..
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Welsh Labour has promised not to use those powers whilst the economic impact of Coronavirus remains. A bit vague, but when they do I guess theyll look at the highest rates first.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
The average band D council tax for wales is £1591 , whereas for England it is £1818, so is the council tax in wales really "much higher"?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rjk
The average band D council tax for wales is £1591 , whereas for England it is £1818, so is the council tax in wales really "much higher"?
I may have got that wrong !
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Bloop
Welsh Labour has promised not to use those powers whilst the economic impact of Coronavirus remains. A bit vague, but when they do I guess theyll look at the highest rates first.
Hope so. I think they'll definitely increase taxes.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
A Quiet Monkfish
Hope so. I think they'll definitely increase taxes.
Good
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Conservatives have said they will freeze council tax for 2 years if elected.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
You should all know by now NOT to vote Conservative.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Toadstool
Conservatives have said they will freeze council tax for 2 years if elected.
Two thoughts on that -
I think it was in their election broadcast they said 'average' council tax wont rise. Does that mean that some will rise and some wont?
I can't find any policy from them regarding Income Tax levels. Is that because they're making no commitments on whether they'll increase it or not, or because I haven't looked hard enough?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Toadstool
Conservatives have said they will freeze council tax for 2 years if elected.
Or, in other words, council services will be cut.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Bloop
Two thoughts on that -
I think it was in their election broadcast they said 'average' council tax wont rise. Does that mean that some will rise and some wont?
I can't find any policy from them regarding Income Tax levels. Is that because they're making no commitments on whether they'll increase it or not, or because I haven't looked hard enough?
This was their post:
❌ Labour has been raising council tax in #Wales for years.
✅ But we will freeze council tax for at least two years to help get families back on their feet post-pandemic.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Stanmore Bluebird
You should all know by now NOT to vote Conservative.
Why not? Labour have been in power in Wales for god knows how long...
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
I'm seeing far more Plaid posters than Labour up here.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
I have long been of the belief that there were few options but for everyone to pay more tax - it looked the only way out of a very deep hole. But if the government can keep issuing bonds, and the Bank of England can keep printing money to buy them, there's no reason why we should pay any more than we currently do.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tforturton
I have long been of the belief that there were few options but for everyone to pay more tax - it looked the only way out of a very deep hole. But if the government can keep issuing bonds, and the Bank of England can keep printing money to buy them, there's no reason why we should pay any more than we currently do.
We've got to the point where the national debt is so large, no Govt. is going to bother trying to reduce it, so yes, just print what you need and so long as there's a market for bonds & gilts then this makes sense.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
A Quiet Monkfish
Before all answer with[I]
The significance of my question is whether many on here realised that in 2019 Wales was given tax raising powers
Do you mean via the Welsh Revenue Authority?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
A Quiet Monkfish
We've got to the point where the national debt is so large, no Govt. is going to bother trying to reduce it, so yes, just print what you need and so long as there's a market for bonds & gilts then this makes sense.
Then it becomes a political ideology to not do this to help the worst off in society.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Toadstool
Why not? Labour have been in power in Wales for god knows how long...
thats because generally , Wales is a left of centre country , thank god
I think the current Welsh government is crap but the idea of having a right wing party governing the parts of Wales we are able to govern scares the bejesus out of me
They will follow Boris and hes a right wing libertarian
We have left Europe and now people are voting tory , in Wales?
God help us
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
thats because generally , Wales is a left of centre country , thank god
I think the current Welsh government is crap but the idea of having a right wing party governing the parts of Wales we are able to govern scares the bejesus out of me
They will follow Boris and hes a right wing libertarian
We have left Europe and now people are voting tory , in Wales?
God help us
Exactly...the current Welsh government being crap isn't a reason to vote Tory, it's why more of us should be voting for a proper socialist party...Plaid Cymru
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RichardM
Exactly...the current Welsh government being crap isn't a reason to vote Tory, it's why more of us should be voting for a proper socialist party...Plaid Cymru
I would vote for them but they want independence so they are living in the clouds
Which is shame as they are more socialist than labour
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
I would vote for them but they want independence so they are living in the clouds
Which is shame as they are more socialist than labour
You wouldn't vote for a Socialist Party, you're Centrist.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
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Originally Posted by
Tuerto
You wouldn't vote for a Socialist Party, you're Centrist.
Well i am a socialist but I realise that this country will never ever elect a left wing socialist party , much though I wish they would
So I live in reality and hope that those who don't vote tory , most of the country , will unite under a left of centre coalition so we can get some of our policies implemented
If we don't, we will be waving our arms around for ever
My socialist views are backed up by actions , marching against the racist English defence league when most people sat on their arses , sending sleeping bags , underwear , wet wipes , toothpaste , t shirts, jogging bottoms , tents and other items to an organisation called cardiff help the homeless , which provides emergency help to rough sleepers in Cardiff, I think I have sent 600 quid worth of stuff since lockdown , I have recently become involved in theneedtofeed which helps people escaping violence , the homeless and ex servicemen with ptsd and drug and alcohol problems
So I don't feck about
Its all very well pining for a socialist government but its never going to happen so its a case of getting off your arse and doing something and fighting for whats right and getting a government in that will get as much as what you believe in into power .
Benn , Skinner , Mclusky , Abbott , Corbyn all talk a good game but simply don't have what it takes to win over middle ground voters and keep them
In life you can accept society needs changing and do things personally and try and get a forward thinking left of centre government , of various interests elected ......which is the best we are going to get ......
Or act like someone from the socialist workers student society and forever be left holding the baby .
Bluebirds !
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
If you truly want a left of centre coalition Sludge, are you going to consider voting for Plaid or the Greens on the regional list? Voting Labour on most regional lists in the Senedd elections will be a waste of time, and ultimately help the right wingers.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
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Originally Posted by
AntEvans
If you truly want a left of centre coalition Sludge, are you going to consider voting for Plaid or the Greens on the regional list? Voting Labour on most regional lists in the Senedd elections will be a waste of time, and ultimately help the right wingers.
Yes I would consider voting plaid on the regional lists to keep down the tory representatives in the senedd but long term I want a left of centre party to emerge
Plaid , unless they gain independence, which they won't, and why I wouldn't vote for them unless it was tactically will have to accept they are at best going to get some of what they want . In this latest election it means a coalition with Labour to keep out the tories . Adam Price has said he won't prop up a labour administration but if he wants any sort of representation for plaid he's going to have to .
As for drakeford and gethin etc the sooner they walk the plank the better
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Well i am a socialist but I realise that this country will never ever elect a left wing socialist party , much though I wish they would
So I live in reality and hope that those who don't vote tory , most of the country , will unite under a left of centre coalition so we can get some of our policies implemented
If we don't, we will be waving our arms around for ever
Sludge,
My socialist views are backed up by actions , marching against the racist English defence league when most people sat on their arses , sending sleeping bags , underwear , wet wipes , toothpaste , t shirts, jogging bottoms , tents and other items to an organisation called cardiff help the homeless , which provides emergency help to rough sleepers in Cardiff, I think I have sent 600 quid worth of stuff since lockdown , I have recently become involved in theneedtofeed which helps people escaping violence , the homeless and ex servicemen with ptsd and drug and alcohol problems
So I don't feck about
Its all very well pining for a socialist government but its never going to happen so its a case of getting off your arse and doing something and fighting for whats right and getting a government in that will get as much as what you believe in into power .
Benn , Skinner , Mclusky , Abbott , Corbyn all talk a good game but simply don't have what it takes to win over middle ground voters and keep them
In life you can accept society needs changing and do things personally and try and get a forward thinking left of centre government , of various interests elected ......which is the best we are going to get ......
Or act like someone from the socialist workers student society and forever be left holding the baby .
Bluebirds !
Sludge, what is perceived as socialism in this country is actually just plain old left wing politics. It's because of so many other factors that people have moved to the right, including yourself in my opinion. The constant chipping by the media and the bosses seems to have worked, when people see plain old left wing policy as some kind of radicalism. If not for left wing policy, you and I wouldn't be having this vaccine through the NHS.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
Sludge, what is perceived as socialism in this country is actually just plain old left wing politics. It's because of so many other factors that people have moved to the right, including yourself in my opinion. The constant chipping by the media and the bosses seems to have worked, when people see plain old left wing policy as some kind of radicalism. If not for left wing policy, you and I wouldn't be having this vaccine through the NHS.
The UK has always been right leaning
It’s not a bad thing it’s a fine balance
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Still trying to figure out how the question in the title of this thread leads to, another, discussion on here in which posters with left wing views end up dissing the Labour Party (or at least the Welsh part of it this time) - what’s that saying........with friends like these, who needs enemies?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Do I want to pay more income tax?
Not me there’s plenty of less regressive taxes and the real tax avoidance is from the internet based companies
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
I’m still trying to get my head round the OP assertion that we are currently taxed more than anytime in last 46 years?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SLUDGE FACTORY
Well i am a socialist but I realise that this country will never ever elect a left wing socialist party , much though I wish they would
So I live in reality and hope that those who don't vote tory , most of the country , will unite under a left of centre coalition so we can get some of our policies implemented
If we don't, we will be waving our arms around for ever
My socialist views are backed up by actions , marching against the racist English defence league when most people sat on their arses , sending sleeping bags , underwear , wet wipes , toothpaste , t shirts, jogging bottoms , tents and other items to an organisation called cardiff help the homeless , which provides emergency help to rough sleepers in Cardiff, I think I have sent 600 quid worth of stuff since lockdown , I have recently become involved in theneedtofeed which helps people escaping violence , the homeless and ex servicemen with ptsd and drug and alcohol problems
So I don't feck about
Its all very well pining for a socialist government but its never going to happen so its a case of getting off your arse and doing something and fighting for whats right and getting a government in that will get as much as what you believe in into power .
Benn , Skinner , Mclusky , Abbott , Corbyn all talk a good game but simply don't have what it takes to win over middle ground voters and keep them
In life you can accept society needs changing and do things personally and try and get a forward thinking left of centre government , of various interests elected ......which is the best we are going to get ......
Or act like someone from the socialist workers student society and forever be left holding the baby .
Bluebirds !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
Still trying to figure out how the question in the title of this thread leads to, another, discussion on here in which posters with left wing views end up dissing the Labour Party (or at least the Welsh part of it this time) - what’s that saying........with friends like these, who needs enemies?
Because they're right wing, and have fallen into the arms of a right wing media and the perceived sensibilities of right wing policy. If sludge and co were around 70 odd years ago they would be talking of the NHS and education as a wonderful idea, although fanciful and idealistically naive. That's how far we've sunk I'm afraid.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
Because they're right wing, and have fallen into the arms of a right wing media and the perceived sensibilities of right wing policy. If sludge and co were around 70 odd years ago they would be talking of the NHS and education as a wonderful idea, although fanciful and idealistically naive. That's how far we've sunk I'm afraid.
you silly **** , I am left wing but the things I want are not achievable by voting for a far left party because not enough people will support it to gain enough seats to form a government
If I had my way I would nationalise water , gas , electricity and trains but its not going to happen
You can live in a dreamworld or try and get politicians elected who will help you see some of your principles in actual reality
There was a bloke standing for the Welsh socialists a few years back , he got 15 votes
Great ideas but I would hope u can see the reality
A left of centre democratic alternative to the tories would sweep up
The next time the far right March in Cardiff I will be there and I expect to see you there too , then you can tell me I am not a socialist
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Everyone will be paying more tax, example 1 Attachment 4400
Wales is "too poor to be independent" but can afford things like this, the UK government and its political system wastes more money than anything in the world.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Interesting articles regarding the Wales is not big enough to be an independent country bollox;-
https://www.theglobalist.com/smaller...n-a-big-world/
https://www.worldometers.info/world-...on-by-country/
Wales would be around the 130 mark when it came to population size out of 238
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
But would it be beneficial leaving the union. I don’t see it at all
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
WJ99mobile
But would it be beneficial leaving the union. I don’t see it at all
the union will only ever be run to the benefit of south east England and London specifically.
When Ireland left the union they had a similar population as wales has now, a very underdeveloped economy and a poorly educated workforce.
Ireland today is a modern European country and has a good standard of living and high levels of wealth. If they were still in the union I cannot believe that they would have been able to develop as far, as the uk priority would still have been London.
It took a long time but if it worked for them, then why couldn't we do the same?
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rjk
the union will only ever be run to the benefit of south east England and London specifically.
When Ireland left the union they had a similar population as wales has now, a very underdeveloped economy and a poorly educated workforce.
Ireland today is a modern European country and has a good standard of living and high levels of wealth. If they were still in the union I cannot believe that they would have been able to develop as far, as the uk priority would still have been London.
It took a long time but if it worked for them, then why couldn't we do the same?
Absolutely. The list of countries that have gained independence from much larger masters and have regretted it is very small indeed.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
the other bob wilson
These are very interesting links.
The Laws in Wales Acts 1535 and 1542 made English the only language of the law courts and said that those who used Welsh would not be appointed to, or paid for, any public office in Wales. This language clause laid the foundation for a thoroughly anglicised ruling class of landed gentry in Wales. The parts of the 1535 Act relating to language were definitively repealed in 1993, by the Welsh Language Act 1993.
I lifted this from Wikipedia as I didn't want to re-write history (sic).
So, that's 1993! That's over 400 years Wales was subject to the whims and fancies of an English (London) parliament and Monarch (in this afomentioned case it was that role-model of a husband Henry VIII who kicked it off). So we haven't evolved and been allowed to develop as an independent country with our own language, economy, laws, taxes and parliament for 486 years!
In other words, we've been London's bi*tch for too long.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Citizen's Nephew
These are very interesting links.
The Laws in Wales Acts 1535 and 1542 made English the only language of the law courts and said that those who used Welsh would not be appointed to, or paid for, any public office in Wales. This language clause laid the foundation for a thoroughly anglicised ruling class of landed gentry in Wales. The parts of the 1535 Act relating to language were definitively repealed in 1993, by the Welsh Language Act 1993.
I lifted this from Wikipedia as I didn't want to re-write history (sic).
So, that's 1993! That's over 400 years Wales was subject to the whims and fancies of an English (London) parliament and Monarch (in this afomentioned case it was that role-model of a husband Henry VIII who kicked it off). So we haven't evolved and been allowed to develop as an independent country with our own language, economy, laws, taxes and parliament for 486 years!
In other words, we've been London's bi*tch for too long.
It should also be mentioned that Elizabeth I passed a law requiring a Welsh translation of the book of Common Prayer after Henry VIII split from Rome. Soon after came a Welsh translation of the Bible.
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rjk
the union will only ever be run to the benefit of south east England and London specifically.
When Ireland left the union they had a similar population as wales has now, a very underdeveloped economy and a poorly educated workforce.
Ireland today is a modern European country and has a good standard of living and high levels of wealth. If they were still in the union I cannot believe that they would have been able to develop as far, as the uk priority would still have been London.
It took a long time but if it worked for them, then why couldn't we do the same?
:thumbup:
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Re: Who Fancies paying more Income tax ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rjk
the union will only ever be run to the benefit of south east England and London specifically.
When Ireland left the union they had a similar population as wales has now, a very underdeveloped economy and a poorly educated workforce.
Ireland today is a modern European country and has a good standard of living and high levels of wealth. If they were still in the union I cannot believe that they would have been able to develop as far, as the uk priority would still have been London.
It took a long time but if it worked for them, then why couldn't we do the same?
Ireland just slashed corporation tax.
If everyone do that it would just be a race to the bottom