http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...s-under-attack
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Well, yeah, but is religion itself the problem, or just used as a justification by a minority of psychopaths for their atrocities?
ISIS and those rednecks, two sides of the same coin surely?
Eventually Muslims and Christians will destroy each other, and then people will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view, or something.
It's quite blatant now isn't it? Even a few people on this board have embarassed themselves by sincerely advocating a ban on religion to attain "world peace". Anyone who thinks that religion "religeon is the cause of all war" needs to stop talking like a bong smoking student and actually read some books. And what are these agnstic fascists proposing exactly? Thought police? Book burning?
I'm not religeous myself, but firmly believe that what any individual chooses to think or believe is sacred and sovereign to themself.
NC, if find posts on the politics forum to almost always bang on and find myself agreeing with you a lot.
I'm not really sure of the angle you want to debate here? You're kind of asking me if I'm guilty of cognitive dissonance, because if I'm making a defence argument for the sovereignty of people's beliefs and world view, then I'm also making a case for people's sexual orientation (within reason of course!!).
Anyone who claims to take someone's life in the name of religeon, fundementally is not religeous. What else is there to say?
When you wrote that Christians and Muslims will destroy each other you were only half right. To know what will happen in the Western World you only need to compare the philosophies of the three groups – Muslims (kill the infidel), Jews (an eye for an eye) and Christians (turn the other cheek). Christians will disappear in Europe just as they have in Palestine. Christianity is a very weak religion. In the long run it stands no chance.
The only Christians will be Irish Travellers and nomadic groups like them who will be living according to their own rules and beliefs. The Church of England clergy are already preparing their surrender. Within a few generations the last Archbishop of Canterbury will have converted to Islam.
Christianity's 'weakness' is also a strength. Christian's don't have to live out their lives as devout Christians in order to function like the other two religions you mentioned.
'Christians' won't disappear, they won't convert to Judaism or Islam en-mass - they will just become more agnostic fewer and fewer will actively practise anything actively religious.
Then whom would supposedly less passive religions turn upon when that happens? 'everybody else'? Lookout..
You seem to be saying that Christians don't have to go to church or even believe in Christianity in order to be Christians. I think most of the Christian clergy would agree with you. They would add that as long as you are nice to people, especially your enemies, that is all that matters.
Unfortunately, some of those people you are being nice to regard your niceness as a sign of submission and feebleness.
If someone smashes his way into your house to rape your kids then Jesus tells us we shouldn't stop him. "That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also."
When Muslims read things like that it is no surprise that they see us as despicable and weak infidels.
Just to be clear, you're talking about all Muslims there?
For some reason I've been trying to remember something I used to sing in my youth this morning - ah yes;-
"Onward Christian soldiers!
Marching as to war,
With the cross of Jesus
Going on before.
Christ, the royal Master,
Leads against the foe;
Forward into battle,
See, His banners go!"
A metaphorical call to arms, rather than a literal one, of course, but it's hardly "turn the other cheek" is it.
My point is that, just like a Muslim with the Qoran, a loon who wants to use their Christianity as a justification for the mass murder they intend to commit will be able to find something in their religion that they will believe justifies their actions - the difference between the two these days seems to be that one of them will be labelled a nutter and the other one will be called a terrorist.
The bible is littered with inconsistencies
"Turn the other cheek" v "An eye for an eye" the most memorable.
And let's not forget the Spanish inquisition - (nobody expects the Spanish inquisition etc) - among other atrocities committed in the name of religion, they made a royal decree ordering Muslims to either convert or leave Spain. Hmm, I'm sure I've seen similar comments to that recently......
I caught a snippet of Radio 4 this morning and a senior clergyman (not sure which one) spoke about false news. Bloody rich from someone who believes in fairy tales (and fairy tales that we filched from previous religions).
Jesus did not write "Onward Christian soldiers". Today nearly all Christians in this country believe Christianity is only about Jesus' call for universal love. Christianity today is a pacifist religion. The exhortations to violence in the Old Testament are, in the main part, only accepted by Jews and Muslims. They are also the only ones who still adhere to the Old Testament dietary restrictions. In our dog eat dog world Christianity will disappear. Pacifism can't succeed against aggression in the long run. Judaism and Israel will survive because Tit for Tat is a successful evolutionary strategy.
Anyway, the Christian soldiers in the song are not marching against unbelievers they are marching against Satan. There is a big difference between a message to fight Satan and a message to kill unbelievers.
I see you didn't answer my question about whether your comment on how Christians are perceived applies to all Muslims.
So many generalisations in what you say in your first paragraph.
You missed, or decided to ignore, the point I was making about Onward Christian Soldiers.
We both know you can't use the word "all" to anything outside scientific generalisations, but that doesn't stop us noticing patterns. As far as I can see most Muslims take their holy book literally. They believe in Jihad and that is bad news for non-Muslims. Either you convert or you will be seen as the enemy.
Christians have been 'well 'ard' over the centuries.
Crusades for a start, and imposing Christianity - by force - wherever the Christians could .. and 'they' couldn't.
That was then.
Perhaps it is someone else's turn now. Maybe it is still the middle ages for some of them.