I can't see how an independent Wales would be able to finance itself, I'd also be concerned about being ruled by a Welsh-speaking Crachach cabal. I'm interested in people's views......
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I can't see how an independent Wales would be able to finance itself, I'd also be concerned about being ruled by a Welsh-speaking Crachach cabal. I'm interested in people's views......
If they are a totally Welsh organisation I just wonder why they use english in their title. :shrug:
Have you read any of the information on the Yes Cyrmu website, for example https://www.yes.cymru/booklet-5?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomcat
As it is now, we would 'ruled' (I prefer governed) by the people we elect. Being independent doesn't mean " being ruled by a Welsh-speaking Crachach cabal."
Come the revolution you’ll all be driving around in a Porche
I don't like Porche’s. Come the revolution, you’ll drive what your told!
:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by William Treseder
Yes, one-eyed at best :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM
Not this again :hehe:
Maybe because there are multiple languages in Wales so why alienate anyone by just having it named in Welsh.Quote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
All their literature is available in both English and Welsh.
If it gains support for Welsh independence they can call themselves whatever they want as far as I'm concerned.
The dragon has two tongues. It's a campaign to get people talking about what independence could be, and heck a lot of work to do before it's realistic possibility..but we'd be better off it it was possible and declined because we love the UK rather than because being part of the UK (at least in current set up) apparently makes us too weak to leave.
it wouldn't be able to fund itself
In South wales we have more in common with the west country than we do with Llanidloes or Llangollen
Our trade and transport is along the M4 , Paddington route
Its quicker to get to Nottingham than it is to get to Bangor
A plane service from Cardiff to the North was hardly ever used , except by politicians
In most of North Wales they look toward the urban centres of Liverpool and Manchester , not Cardiff
We have the joy of watching Wales beat Belgium in euro 2016 but economically and socially we are miles apart , quite literally
Seems that anything the senedd actually has control over; education, health etc lags behind England, often dropping further since they got any control.
As a proud Welshman I want a separate country but it seems unrealistic. I have read the yes cymru stuff and it all just seems a bit like brexit over again. Lots of vague facts about how we will be better under self rule but very little substance besides maybe we could sell our water and electricity to England. That will pay for it all..
If what you say is true, and Wales couldn’t fund or support itself, then what a sad inditement that really is. It basically tells us that we aren’t part of the UK by choice any more, but by necessity, we may as well change our name to West England.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
The vast majority of the population of Wales live in the urban centres of Newport, Cardiff and Swansea and the South Wales valleys
Thats where the industry is , where commerce is , when the transport links are , where the entertainment industry is based
Do people have any idea how much it would cost to build a motorway from merthyr up to caernarfon ?
If Wales wants to be a separate country then it needs to surely have decent transport links from the main area of population to the only other concentration of population .....the Wrexham, Colwyn Bay, Llandudno, caernarfon , Bangor region
And even if billions is spent building this road its not like we are connecting cardiff to Birmingham, its cardiff to a small population
Who is going to use it ?
People in the North are still going to watch bands in Manchester or fly from Liverpool Airport
I am all for strength in language but Welsh independence in 2021 is potty
It is trueQuote:
Originally Posted by William Treseder
Its been that way since the industrial revolution and the coal , steel and Iron industries that brought loads of people from Somerset and the West Country to work in South Wales
Maybe because we've been ****ed over by Westminster for decades.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
Huge metal & dogging community in Llangollen that would put Bridgend to shame.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
well I am not going to disagree about thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman
But I believe a strong Wales within the UK is the best option given that independence is never going to happen
We can blame corbyn for us losing loads of seats to a party that is opposed to Wales being anything other than a shiny shoe boy
I don't blame Corbyn.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
People should have seen through the bullshit peddled about him.
I have seen costings that suggest Wales can pay for itself, which seemed entirely reasonable.Quote:
Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
We sit here thinking - oh poor Wales, cant afford to be a proper country - yet why is that still the case, after x hundred years of control by England, why are we still the poorest part of the UK? because we are continually neglected, and there is no reason to imagine that is going to change any time soon.
100 years ago Ireland was becoming independent. It was the poorest part of the UK, only really did trade with the UK. and had a really weak economy.
100 years later and they have fared a lot better on their own than they would have within the UK. If they can do it then why can't we?
There are plenty of countries in Europe that would have a lower GDP than a separate Wales. Croatia for example - they manage to be a functioning country don't they?
I think you will find that, give it another year or two and the Welsh economy will be in ruins because of the inability of the current Sennedd to persuade manufacturing or businesses to relocate to Wales.Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman
I don't think soQuote:
Originally Posted by DubaiDai
Any costings are fanciful at best and as for the Irish argument the place was a wasteland until they joined the EU.And the poor bastards will feel the effect of brexit just like us but at least we voted for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
strange that you dismiss any costings as fanciful when I haven't even provided the link yet? because they don't conform to you preconceived ideas?Quote:
Originally Posted by sneggyblubird
Have you got anything to read on costings? Genuine interestQuote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
My feelings on the Scottish thread is that Wales would get squeezed to an inch of its life by England if independent.
The topography alone inhibits so much natural investment. Why on earth do we think companies would want to go to the top of the valleys
There's quite lot of stuff out there, but this is interesting . Pretty even handed I'd say:Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
The same group have written a number of papers on the topic over the years.
https://www.cardiff.ac.uk/__data/ass...ture_FINAL.pdf
It does highlight that there will be big challenges, but there are also ways to overcome them . Staying in a union that is only interested in investing in the south east of England is also a risk as highlighted in the report.
And at last it shows that all the talk of becoming a 3rd world country within a few years is really without foundation.
do people really think that Wales are due to become a 3rd world country ? ? ? are people really buying that
I'm one of the 18,000 Yes Cymru members. They are not aligned with any one party. They simply want a better future for Wales. The UK as we know it will be gone over the next decade or so. Scotland will leave, so it makes sense to at least consider the alternatives. Do I think we'd initially face some tough times as an independent nation? Without a doubt. I'd prefer that over being ruled by Westminster, though. How often does Wales actually vote for the party in power at Westminster? And why are the English so desperate to keep control of us and Scotland if we have nothing to offer? The Eton Elite are hardly know for their utilitarianism.
I used to be very pro plaid cymru, as a apprenticeship i worked with a bloke who was massive Welsh Nationalist ( he always said he was a relative of Dennis Coslett ( of FWA fame ), he had the same surname, so who knows ? ? ? ) I was right into it
It was not till i moved down here that i realised, The English really do not hate the Welsh, they really are indifferent about us as a nation, yes we have sports rivalry, during the Euro 16 campaign, a fair few were supporting Wales, some even like Tom Jones
Now the idea that Westminster doesnt have time for Wales, if you speak to people from the midlands or up north, they say exactly the same thing, The Cornish think that the Government do not spend enough money in Cornwall, this moan is not exclusive to the Welsh, i bet if you spoke to the Gogs they might say that the Senedd spend too much money on south wales, people like to blame others for anything they can
Brilliant summary .Quote:
Originally Posted by blue matt
:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman
There are too many Sun and Daily Mail readers on this forum to appreciate your comment though, unfortunately.
Even Swansea are still going on about that swimming pool they had. :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by life on mars
A very good argument for more devolution and local decisions, not just for Wales, but for the English regions as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by blue matt
Cornwall definitely needs its own Parliament.Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM
Some parts of England voted against regional devolution when it was offered to them.
I think we need more than devolution though. A federal UK is required at a minimum, with the English given their own Parliament too. That way there are 5 devolved governments.