Looks like we are offering £45,000,000 of new shares, and our share value is down 90% ?
Is that correct ? :shrug:
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Looks like we are offering £45,000,000 of new shares, and our share value is down 90% ?
Is that correct ? :shrug:
I got a letter as well.
Total gobbledygook to me.
Hopefully Keith can enlighten us and tell me whether I need to agree and send the document back or ignore.
Glad it's not just me then ! Doubt it's good news for small investors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Morris
Do you want to post it on here? I'm not a shareholder but would be interested to read it.Quote:
Originally Posted by G rangetown Blue
Up to 'The Boss'! .... I don't mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Optimistic Nick
Can’t understand a single word of that letter! Looks like they are issuing new shares with a nominal value of £0.01 having the same rights as ordinary shares with a nominal value £0.10 but no idea what that actually means!Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Morris
There is an option to sign but not returning the forms means you dont agree - which seems unusual as not doing anything is probably the default setting of most of the small investors
MikeQuote:
Originally Posted by Michael Morris
We checked this morning and the Trust as a shareholder have not received a letter. I have chased up the club on this but, in the meantime, if someone can scan and post a copy of the letter on here I will be free later to comment on it
Keith
Last letter I had from Mr Choo was 2016 and because the majority shareholder had 89% the resolution was effectively passed. Like others I await being told what it all means and how rich I'm not:)
If someone could do that it would be great. I’m travelling this afternoon and I don’t have the letter with meQuote:
Originally Posted by Ninian1962
Yikes this means the club are trying to raise money, essentially this means current shareholders have been ****ed over badly short term. Long term if that £45m was spent on players to help with a premiership push then maybe the current shareholders can still make a profit.
But if I held shares in Cardiff right now I'd be PISSED.
edit: I didn't even know you could buy shares in Cardiff.
I wonder why the club might need money, does anyone know if we have any legal cases in the next few weeks? :sherlock:Quote:
Originally Posted by Doucas
Are they doing a rights issue to raise money?
As a share holder you’d hope not to lose out as you can usually buy shares at an issue price which should be lower than the market price, the overall share price will average down but you should end up with enough shares to not lose money. Not seen the letter though as only guessing.
This goes back to around 2001 when we stumped up some cash for Kurt Nogan in return for shares. I had mentally written my modest sum off about a year later....Still, would be nice to get something out of it apart from the occasional Cardiff City letter. I wish.
Think the Isaac case is very soon and we have the Sala one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
Oh and scrounging Sam's case.
If you PM me your e mail I'll send it over nowQuote:
Originally Posted by Optimistic Nick
I might be wrong, but I think a former director is suing the club and/or its owner as a result of a previous dilution of his shareholding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
from this message boards point of view, Not sure a lot of the original fan share buy lot ( No-Goals-Nogan ) will have a lot of shares left by now, they have been diluted a few times ( from memory )Quote:
Originally Posted by Doucas
Yes, this is the basis of the Michael Isaac case. The issue of new shares has devalued his own holding. The problem here (as far as his case in concerned) is that any issue of shares must be voted through by the Board. So it's all legit - I can't see that he has a leg to stand on. Unless there's more to it than meets the eye....Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
This looks like the club trying to raise cash via outside investment. But it could also mean that Tan is going to swap debt for shares.
I'm thinking the asia based group that wanted to buy the club are now interested in buying shares in the club?Quote:
Originally Posted by tforturton
Same here!Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Morris
I bought my shares many years ago but never expected to make any money out of it (and I haven't been surprised in that regard). At the time I equated it with giving money to a charity. :hehe:
Same hereQuote:
Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
Steve Borley has replied on Twitter to say it’s debt to equity related to FFP:
https://twitter.com/stevecmb/status/...070909954?s=21
#Steve`s response is really strange because converting debt to equity has no impact on Profitability and Sustainability (FFP) compliance. It is a balance sheet adjustment which improves that balance sheet but has no effect on the profit and loss account which is what FFP is all about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madlock
Despite the above misunderstanding , a debt to equity conversion should be very much welcomed as it is a return to the steps promised by VT to convert all his debt to equity which has been delayed by the impact of Covid over the last coupke of years.
So, good news in essence, but some clarification required?
Yes, when Steve replied I thought it a bit strange, as it appeared to me that VT was taking on £45m of debt, which is clearly good news for the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninian1962
How exactly does this work , debt to equity in respect of Cardiff City ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Former Labour leader
The current debt is £93m , so if VT converts £45m does Cardiff City’s debt reduce by £45m ?
Also is he really converting £45m?
No flies on you.....Quote:
Originally Posted by TWGL1
:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
I deserved that … good news all the same ….
:hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
You might be right if you take admin,tax and commission charges into considerationsQuote:
Originally Posted by TWGL1
Debts owing to shareholders and other connected parties were £49m in the last accounts. I’d expect that has grown since, although the wage bill has shrunk dramatically since, we will still have been making losses.Quote:
Originally Posted by TWGL1
Either way the conversion of that £45m is really very good news and puts a big hole in our massive debts.
Just need 3 points tonight now
were some people not recently telling us that VT has lost interest in us ? ? ?
wiping 45 Mill of debts might mean he hasn't after all
I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to ffp (and most things) but is tan's debt interest bearing and does the interest expense get taken into account in the ffp rules?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninian1962
And we got them Tim:-)Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawnmower
Now that the game has finished I can comment on the shareholder letter, a copy of which was only received by me this evening.
The letter is to give notice of passing shareholder resolutions to increase the share capital by up to £45m. The resolutions will all be passed as Vincent Tan already holds the vast majority of hares in issue.
The reason that the shares are 1p ones rather than existing 10p ones is that new shares cannot be issued at a nominal value greater than their market value - it will come as no surprise to most to see that the club is worth less than 10p per share.
I have had it confirmed that the shares are being issued to enable a further debt to equity conversion but don`t know if the full £45m will be converted. If all or most of the £45m is converted this will greatly improve the club`s balance sheet and go a long way to recommencing Vincent Tan`s promise to convert all debt into shares which has been held up recently by financial constraints due to Covid.
What any conversion won`t do, in contradiction of what Steve Borley said in his tweet, is have any impact on the Profitability and Sustainability (FFP) position as debt to equity just improves the balance sheet and has no impact on the profit and loss account
Hope this helps
Keith
Thanks Keith. 👍Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninian1962