Re: Covid-19 death figures
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
Throughout the Covid-19 pandemic, the public in Wales have consistently been subjected to more restrictions than our English counterparts, while a wide variety of Welsh businesses have had to contend with more frequent closures or limitations than their equivalents across the border.
Nevertheless, according to the latest set of official figures, the death rates with Covid-19 as a contributory factor are higher in Wales than in any of the other UK nations.
The current rates per 100,000 of the UK population with death certificates that mention Covid-19 as one of the causes since the start of the pandemic are as follows:
285 - Wales
257 - England
225 - Scotland
207 - Northern Ireland
Just three of the nine regions in England have a higher rate than Wales. They are the North West (311), the North East (297) and the West Midlands (286).
Surprisingly, London has a substantially lower rate than Wales (233), while the rate for our near-neighbours in the South West is much lower still at 167.
So, more restrictions for the Welsh public and Welsh businesses, and yet a higher rate of deaths with Covid-19. What do you believe are the reasons for this situation?
I understand that the way we recorded Covid deaths in the first wave of the pandemic is partly responsible. Someone mentioned something about this in another thread.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Bigger collection of working class towns who are closer to the poverty line made up of older people.
The only country with labour in control of the NHS. Welsh NHS is the worst performing.
Who knows really.
Why do you think?
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eric the Half a Bee
I understand that the way we recorded Covid deaths in the first wave of the pandemic is partly responsible.
No mention of that (that I could find). The site does say that England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales use different methodologies for collating the 'deaths within 28 days of a positive test' figures, so they can’t be directly compared. No such note on the deaths with Covid-19 on the death certificate section, though.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Trigger
Why do you think?
I honestly don't know. Almost certainly a combination of factors, but I'm struggling to think of any one element that stands out. Unless we genuinely do have the unhealthiest population of the four nations, which is a distinct possibility.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
I honestly don't know. Almost certainly a combination of factors, but I'm struggling to think of any one element that stands out. Unless we genuinely do have the unhealthiest population of the four nations, which is a distinct possibility.
Poverty, leading to long term illness and disease.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
We’ve got an older population.
Our population density is higher, ~50% live in a 50mile radius.
We’re a poorer nation.
Different methodologies for measuring deaths/cases/hospitalisations/etc.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Canton Kev
We’ve got an older population.
Our population density is higher, ~50% live in a 50mile radius.
We’re a poorer nation.
Different methodologies for measuring deaths/cases/hospitalisations/etc.
We have quite a high proportion of people who are long term sick. Diabetic, Obese, Lung diseases etc. I suppose that South wales figures would be on a par with the poorest regions of England as well.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Makes you wonder what our death rates would have been without those harsher restrictions
Re: Covid-19 death figures
A lot to read in this, but it says Wales’ excess deaths figure is some way short of England’s
https://gov.wales/sites/default/file...h-covid-19.pdf
A very thorough piece on Covid in Wales from the BBC
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52380643
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
I honestly don't know. Almost certainly a combination of factors, but I'm struggling to think of any one element that stands out. Unless we genuinely do have the unhealthiest population of the four nations, which is a distinct possibility.
Doesn't Wales have a higher number of over 60 ' in the UK , therefore increasing death risk ??
I know before Covid Sepsis death in Wales were also unusual higher than most countries in UK , there was a lot of criticism pre covid of overall performance within the Welsh NHS , it would be nice to view pre covid deaths by other diseases to ascertain performance in general, perhaps there are underlying issues ?
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Are Welsh residents who die in English hospitals (thinking about Powys residents who go to a hospital in Shrewsbury, for example) still counted in the English figures?
As others have said though, the regions with the highest rates seem to be former industrial areas.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
I honestly don't know. Almost certainly a combination of factors, but I'm struggling to think of any one element that stands out. Unless we genuinely do have the unhealthiest population of the four nations, which is a distinct possibility.
Wales has the worst life expectation of all four countries. Regions in England have worse life expectations but the average are raised by the populous southern regions.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
Throughout the Covid-19 pandemic, the public in Wales have consistently been subjected to more restrictions than our English counterparts, while a wide variety of Welsh businesses have had to contend with more frequent closures or limitations than their equivalents across the border.
Nevertheless, according to the latest set of official figures, the death rates with Covid-19 as a contributory factor are higher in Wales than in any of the other UK nations.
The current rates per 100,000 of the UK population with death certificates that mention Covid-19 as one of the causes since the start of the pandemic are as follows:
285 - Wales
257 - England
225 - Scotland
207 - Northern Ireland
Just three of the nine regions in England have a higher rate than Wales. They are the North West (311), the North East (297) and the West Midlands (286).
Surprisingly, London has a substantially lower rate than Wales (233), while the rate for our near-neighbours in the South West is much lower still at 167.
So, more restrictions for the Welsh public and Welsh businesses, and yet a higher rate of deaths with Covid-19. What do you believe are the reasons for this situation?
Being different to England justifies the Welsh Assembly's existence. You can look forward to years to come of unchallenged 'Government' by the Labour & Plaid coalition
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
A Quiet Monkfish
Being different to England justifies the Welsh Assembly's existence. You can look forward to years to come of unchallenged 'Government' by the Labour & Plaid coalition
Ain’t that the truth, god knows why any business would set up here….
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
No mention of that (that I could find). The site does say that England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales use different methodologies for collating the 'deaths within 28 days of a positive test' figures, so they can’t be directly compared. No such note on the deaths with Covid-19 on the death certificate section, though.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths
Problem with the various death rates over the world is that we do not know what criteria each country uses for Covid deaths.
For example it was reported on the news once that Russia only include deaths where there has been a post mortem to confirm that it was Covid.
The question I have with the "death within 28 days of a positive test" used here is that many of those with underlying health issues may well have died anyway in that time whether they caught covid or not. I know that at one time if someone died in a car accident withing 28 days of a positive test they were still counted as dying of Covid even though the death wasn't related. This was not surprisingly changed!
According to the Office for National Statistics the underlying cause of death is defined by the WHO as
a) the disease or injury that initiated the train of events directly leading to death, or
b) the circumstances of the accident or violence that produced the fatal injury
This seems a bit more precise than the "death within 28 days of a positive test"
Re: Covid-19 death figures
I think we are a very unhealthy nation. You only have to look at the number who are obese and add in the drink and drugs culture.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Elwood Blues
Problem with the various death rates over the world is that we do not know what criteria each country uses for Covid deaths.
For example it was reported on the news once that Russia only include deaths where there has been a post mortem to confirm that it was Covid.
The question I have with the "death within 28 days of a positive test" used here is that many of those with underlying health issues may well have died anyway in that time whether they caught covid or not. I know that at one time if someone died in a car accident withing 28 days of a positive test they were still counted as dying of Covid even though the death wasn't related. This was not surprisingly changed!
According to the Office for National Statistics the underlying cause of death is defined by the WHO as
a) the disease or injury that initiated the train of events directly leading to death, or
b) the circumstances of the accident or violence that produced the fatal injury
This seems a bit more precise than the "death within 28 days of a positive test"
My father died a year ago with four conditions on his death certificate. He had no covid symptoms but renal failure and type 1 diabetes. I hate the fact he is a covid statistic.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The Lone Gunman
Throughout the Covid-19 pandemic, the public in Wales have consistently been subjected to more restrictions than our English counterparts, while a wide variety of Welsh businesses have had to contend with more frequent closures or limitations than their equivalents across the border.
Nevertheless, according to the latest set of official figures, the death rates with Covid-19 as a contributory factor are higher in Wales than in any of the other UK nations.
The current rates per 100,000 of the UK population with death certificates that mention Covid-19 as one of the causes since the start of the pandemic are as follows:
285 - Wales
257 - England
225 - Scotland
207 - Northern Ireland
Just three of the nine regions in England have a higher rate than Wales. They are the North West (311), the North East (297) and the West Midlands (286).
Surprisingly, London has a substantially lower rate than Wales (233), while the rate for our near-neighbours in the South West is much lower still at 167.
So, more restrictions for the Welsh public and Welsh businesses, and yet a higher rate of deaths with Covid-19. What do you believe are the reasons for this situation?
As others have said we are an aging population and many areas are deprived and have poor health in general. The fact that that north of England is worse than the South of England and Wales shows how much inequality plays a part.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Porth Pouncer
My father died a year ago with four conditions on his death certificate. He had no covid symptoms but renal failure and type 1 diabetes. I hate the fact he is a covid statistic.
Sorry for your loss. It is never easy to lose a parent or any other relative
This does show the imprecision of the within 28 days of a positive test rule though, as you obviously don't regard him to have died of Covid
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Elwood Blues
Sorry for your loss. It is never easy to lose a parent or any other relative
This does show the imprecision of the within 28 days of a positive test rule though, as you obviously don't regard him to have died of Covid
So if i had a positive test on day 1, isolated until day 11, got hit by a bus and killed on day 12, Covid would be my cause of death? Am i not following you? If i am, then that's lunacy.
Re: Covid-19 death figures
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tuerto
So if i had a positive test on day 1, isolated until day 11, got hit by a bus and killed on day 12, Covid would be my cause of death? Am i not following you? If i am, then that's lunacy.
Not having a go but nearly every time I’ve heard this analogy it’s ‘hit by a bus’. I think it’s so unfair and upsetting for bus drivers, Stan Butler posts on here y’know, stop and think of him now and again.
