Bring in James Collins on Saturday?

I don't have the exact figures, but an awful lot of Northern Ireland's goals in the last two years have come from set pieces. Our defence isn't the biggest and I can see the main danger for us being from free kicks and corners where McAuley, Cathcart and Evans can come forward.
Playing James Collins would help us in this regard and, thinking about it, maybe keeping Sam Vokes in the team would make sense from a defensive point of view, but I think the big Northern Irish defenders would be quite happy about having him to deal with, as opposed to someone like Robson-Kanu who would drag them into areas they wouldn't want to go.
Do you think Wales should make a change aimed at nullifying a possible domination at set pieces by Northern Ireland, or should we take the attitude that we go with the same side and let them do the worrying about us?

Let them WORRY about us, not us them.

We stick to our gameplan, if they score 2 we score 3 simples.

You're turning into WOY:hehe::hehe:

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I don't have the exact figures, but an awful lot of Northern Ireland's goals in the last two years have come from set pieces. Our defence isn't the biggest and I can see the main danger for us being from free kicks and corners where McAuley, Cathcart and Evans can come forward.
Playing James Collins would help us in this regard and, thinking about it, maybe keeping Sam Vokes in the team would make sense from a defensive point of view, but I think the big Northern Irish defenders would be quite happy about having him to deal with, as opposed to someone like Robson-Kanu who would drag them into areas they wouldn't want to go.
Do you think Wales should make a change aimed at nullifying a possible domination at set pieces by Northern Ireland, or should we take the attitude that we go with the same side and let them do the worrying about us?

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Hi Paul,I would agree with you about Collins and N.I's threat from set pieces.I was at the game in March,and their goal came from corner as a result of us not clearing our lines.Vokes started that game,and as I recall was largely ineffectual,with N.I happy to let us play in front of them and defend the 18 yard box.We looked better when Allen came on,and obviously we had no Bale and Ramsey that night.It is going to be difficult to break them down,but you would have to back us in this one,and as you say we might need to drag them about and be patient.

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Originally Posted by Bruce Foxton

Hi Paul,I would agree with you about Collins and N.I's threat from set pieces.I was at the game in March,and their goal came from corner as a result of us not clearing our lines.Vokes started that game,and as I recall was largely ineffectual,with N.I happy to let us play in front of them and defend the 18 yard box.We looked better when Allen came on,and obviously we had no Bale and Ramsey that night.It is going to be difficult to break them down,but you would have to back us in this one,and as you say we might need to drag them about and be patient.

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Your memory of the game in March matches mine Bruce. Northern Ireland were slightly the better team until Joe Allen came on and then we started causing them problems. If Ramsey and Bale play like they did on Monday, then we'll have a quality that they won't be able to match, but you couldn't have hand picked a better defence/midfield for the latter to face than Russia and our opponents on Saturday won't be as naive as they were in our previous game.

If it was my choice to make, I'd, just about, go for the same defence and hope that we'll cope with their set pieces, but I'd be tempted to make a change up front. I think Jonny Williams could be effective against a side like Northern Ireland, but that would probably mean we'd have to use Bale in a similar role to the one he played against Slovakia and I'd much prefer him to be running at defenders from deeper positions, so I think I'd bring in Robson-Kanu for Vokes.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Your memory of the game in March matches mine Bruce. Northern Ireland were slightly the better team until Joe Allen came on and then we started causing them problems. If Ramsey and Bale play like they did on Monday, then we'll have a quality that they won't be able to match, but you couldn't have hand picked a better defence/midfield for the latter to face than Russia and our opponents on Saturday won't be as naive as they were in our previous game.

If it was my choice to make, I'd, just about, go for the same defence and hope that we'll cope with their set pieces, but I'd be tempted to make a change up front. I think Jonny Williams could be effective against a side like Northern Ireland, but that would probably mean we'd have to use Bale in a similar role to the one he played against Slovakia and I'd much prefer him to be running at defenders from deeper positions, so I think I'd bring in Robson-Kanu for Vokes.

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I can see the logic behind considering Collins but who would you drop? Chester and Davies have been outstanding and though Williams has been the quieter of the three you're not going to drop your captain. I read somewhere recently about how small a percentage of goals are actually scored from corners so I think we stay with the same back 5. Vokes played well against Russia but I would bring Robson-Kanu back for this game, as you say we need to try and pull their centre halves out of position.

They are very good at defending deep and their record in qualifying was excellent, this wont be easy and we're not at our best when the onus is on us to go forward, that last home game against Andorra being a prime example, we made real hard work of that. Still, I think the quality of the holy trinity of Bale, Allen and Ramsey should see us through a very tight game

I'd usually be reluctant to make a change at this stage. However you lot make a really good case for bringing Collins in.
However I thought the defence handled dzubya magnificently. And he is a handful.

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Originally Posted by Don Corleone

I can see the logic behind considering Collins but who would you drop? Chester and Davies have been outstanding and though Williams has been the quieter of the three you're not going to drop your captain. I read somewhere recently about how small a percentage of goals are actually scored from corners so I think we stay with the same back 5. Vokes played well against Russia but I would bring Robson-Kanu back for this game, as you say we need to try and pull their centre halves out of position.

They are very good at defending deep and their record in qualifying was excellent, this wont be easy and we're not at our best when the onus is on us to go forward, that last home game against Andorra being a prime example, we made real hard work of that. Still, I think the quality of the holy trinity of Bale, Allen and Ramsey should see us through a very tight game

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I fully agree with the above. We did indeed make hard work of the Andorra game. The NI game will obviously be different as there has to be a winner. So NI have to come at us at times. The Dynamic Trio may indeed give us the edge in this game.
Spedger

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I don't have the exact figures, but an awful lot of Northern Ireland's goals in the last two years have come from set pieces. Our defence isn't the biggest and I can see the main danger for us being from free kicks and corners where McAuley, Cathcart and Evans can come forward.
Playing James Collins would help us in this regard and, thinking about it, maybe keeping Sam Vokes in the team would make sense from a defensive point of view, but I think the big Northern Irish defenders would be quite happy about having him to deal with, as opposed to someone like Robson-Kanu who would drag them into areas they wouldn't want to go.
Do you think Wales should make a change aimed at nullifying a possible domination at set pieces by Northern Ireland, or should we take the attitude that we go with the same side and let them do the worrying about us?

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That's a good shout , he undoubted strength is in the air, and NI are a bruiser side , and we could l get bullied . However it would be cruel to change a winning side who have undoubted spirit as Blutit rightly states Wales has far more talent going forward , play like they did against Russia and they will win .

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I don't have the exact figures, but an awful lot of Northern Ireland's goals in the last two years have come from set pieces. Our defence isn't the biggest and I can see the main danger for us being from free kicks and corners where McAuley, Cathcart and Evans can come forward.
Playing James Collins would help us in this regard and, thinking about it, maybe keeping Sam Vokes in the team would make sense from a defensive point of view, but I think the big Northern Irish defenders would be quite happy about having him to deal with, as opposed to someone like Robson-Kanu who would drag them into areas they wouldn't want to go.
Do you think Wales should make a change aimed at nullifying a possible domination at set pieces by Northern Ireland, or should we take the attitude that we go with the same side and let them do the worrying about us?

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Sounds harsh to say, considering we have just enjoyed two great wins and a near miss but I would be very tempted bring in Collins for our Ash.
I was worried about the latter's ability to cope with Russia's big lad up top but I needn't have been, not because Ash was concincing, but because the striker was so poor. There weren't many duals but I remember one example in the 2nd half where AW jumped, got nowhere near the ball and fell over thus leaving his man free.
Luckily the Russian blazed his shot over but Williams seems to end up on his backside an awful lot for me lately.

As TOBW posed, perhaps NI will go route un much more and Collins would be the ideal man to cope.
Not so sure CC will see it that way mind.

I wouldn't, but can see the point, always a major mistake in the 90 mins Collins game, i'd like to see him get some game time but maybe if 3-0 up with 5 mins to go.

I would drop Taylor and play Ben Davies at left back and bring in Collins as a third centre half. I can't see Northern Ireland causing any problems apart from at set pieces.

I wouldn't change the back 5 at all personally.
I think the 5 we've got defend as a unit and they've dealt with better teams than Northern Ireland comfortably.
They've played Belgium 4 times and I think we've conceded 1 goal against the threats of Lukaku and Bentley who are considerably better in every way than Kyle Lafferty.

I think moving the ball quickly between the lines will be very important and I hope we run with the ball and attack defenders from 35 yards out as I think a free kick will be how we can break them down without getting in behind them.

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Originally Posted by MacAdder

Sounds harsh to say, considering we have just enjoyed two great wins and a near miss but I would be very tempted bring in Collins for our Ash.
I was worried about the latter's ability to cope with Russia's big lad up top but I needn't have been, not because Ash was concincing, but because the striker was so poor. There weren't many duals but I remember one example in the 2nd half where AW jumped, got nowhere near the ball and fell over thus leaving his man free.
Luckily the Russian blazed his shot over but Williams seems to end up on his backside an awful lot for me lately.

As TOBW posed, perhaps NI will go route un much more and Collins would be the ideal man to cope.
Not so sure CC will see it that way mind.

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Understand the thinking, but we have a great team spirit and some of the credit for that must go to the captain. This could be a nervy, draining affair and think we'll need all the leadership and experience we can muster. Taking the captain could be a bit unsettling at this stage for what has been a solid defence imo.

James Collins is better in the air, quicker,a better tackler, and captain, than Williams, and he's also Welsh.
People are only just realising how overrated Ash is, we still haven't come up against any quality strikers, I was concerned about the Russian guy, but he had no service whatsoever, and when he did he looked awful.
Our luck continues, and we have NI, beat them and it will prob be Belgium, who I can't see slipping up against us for a third time.
I've enjoyed our adventure, just had a great 2 weeks out there, back to Paris for 4 days, then hopefully head to Lille.
The success brings it's own problems, part time/rugby fans (and songs), and people getting a little bit carried away.
Bale, Ramsey, Allan, Davis and Hennessey have been superb for us,we are where we are despite our manager and captain, not because of them, in my opinion.
Enjoy it, but keep it real I say.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

Understand the thinking, but we have a great team spirit and some of the credit for that must go to the captain. This could be a nervy, draining affair and think we'll need all the leadership and experience we can muster. Taking the captain could be a bit unsettling at this stage for what has been a solid defence imo.

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The team spirit is more to do with having the most expensive player in the World, and the best British midfielder in your team, than some oaf waving his arms around for 90 minutes!

I'm back! :hehe:

I would axe Taylor for Collins. Not because of the Irish threat but because it would improve the team.

Davies to left back.

Yeah, Taylor was exposed against England, although he did a lot better in game 3, just not sure how bad that Russian team is!

I rate Davis, defending, and an attacking force down the flanks.

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Originally Posted by G rangetown Blue

I'm back! :hehe:

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OK, who are you mate?

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Originally Posted by G rangetown Blue

I'm back! :hehe:

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:hehe: :hehe: :hehe: :thumbup:

I thought ginge not being in the side might of pushed you over the edge

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I don't have the exact figures, but an awful lot of Northern Ireland's goals in the last two years have come from set pieces. Our defence isn't the biggest and I can see the main danger for us being from free kicks and corners where McAuley, Cathcart and Evans can come forward.
Playing James Collins would help us in this regard and, thinking about it, maybe keeping Sam Vokes in the team would make sense from a defensive point of view, but I think the big Northern Irish defenders would be quite happy about having him to deal with, as opposed to someone like Robson-Kanu who would drag them into areas they wouldn't want to go.
Do you think Wales should make a change aimed at nullifying a possible domination at set pieces by Northern Ireland, or should we take the attitude that we go with the same side and let them do the worrying about us?

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I would be more inclined to let them worry about us.We need to hit them going forward with speed and quick passing .Having said that before Russia I was all for dropping Taylor moving Davies over and bringing in Collins and part of me feels the same now.

The only change I can see Coleman making is HRK coming in for Vokes.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

OK, who are you mate?

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The biggest badass bitch on yer