That’s where the real problems lie.
Never trust a car salesman .
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That’s where the real problems lie.
Never trust a car salesman .
don't we just need an actual director of football, those guys can stay
No.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
Choo can stay as Tans eyes and ears but Dalman has got to go.
What role would Dalman have if we had a DOF?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
We don't agree on much but spot on.
In any other line of work this incompetence would see people out of a job.
We have been promoted twice despite this lot being here rather than because of. I honestly think a decent DOF and we would have stayed in the Premier League for at least a few seasons.
We seem to be a million miles behind other clubs with this. How many clubs of our size operate without a decent scouting structure and a DoF in place? It just means every time a manager leaves everything gets ripped up and starts again.
It wasn't that long ago we were congratulating the club for an excellent transfer window. The problem at the club doesn't rest with the Board. We have a better squad than our position in the table suggests. The problem lies with the manager.
No quality in the middle of the park for 3 seasons now. It’s pointless with Tomlin or Wilson in the number 10 role when there are two cloggers behind them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
Over past 10 years we have made a series of managerial changes which appear to be the exact opposite of what has just left.Quote:
Originally Posted by Croesy Blue
We have had limited success in transfer market considering how active we have been.
We have had very limited success in youth development.
It's not like money hasn't been spent by Tan but we have little to show for it.
An excellent transfer window. Really? When was this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
We've got no pace and no quality in the midfield. We've got one right back, who's injured. All of our wingers are hit and miss, or slow in terms of Hoilett. We've got one striker that's good enough and nobody runs beyond him. It isn't a good team, there's so many holes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
All these issues will miraculously disappear by sacking HarrisQuote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
The consensus was that Wilson and Moore were good additions.Quote:
Originally Posted by J R Hartley
Sadly that is not my experience at those levels, most get promoted. Known as the 'Peter Principle', car salesman to CEO of a football club.Quote:
Originally Posted by blue lewj
Football is also terrible for recognising incompetence, players, managers etc are constantly rewarded with a new job somewhere else. Its happens in large retail and banking firms but especially in government.
It's only the little guy and normally that isn't their fault, it is that of their incompetent manager :biggrin:
Warnock's first three windows were good as well. When it goes wrong it seems to go really wrong and that could be us being so dependent on manager's assessment of a player, much more so than other clubs our size.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindec
It wasn't Dalman & Choo TRYING to play out from the back.
A decent Director of Football would help a manager, offer support (and I mean football specific support not business support which I think are two different things in this sense).
Even the Harris supporters could agree that his style was not a change in direction. According to Dalman it was. This is one of the men we are turning to when appointing a new manager. He even laughed at how many shots he wanted us to have at a time when a very serious head was needed.
As an update on that the football hasn't changed all that much in 12 months. The league position has got worse. We got the play offs, failed and now we are looking at a relegation battle rather than promotion if we're being honest.
As it is we have bit part car dealers who allocate some of their time to this. We need a full time DOF and have for quite some time. Just throwing another badly picked manager in and saying "Succeed or else" won't work with people who do not understand the footballing world.
Clubs are evolving around us and seeing success. Cardiff City are stagnating with non football people in key positions and are in danger of going backwards very fast if it isn't remedied.
To put it another way would Ken Choo put a Director of Football in charge of his car dealership. I very much doubt it, and for the same reasons the same should not happen the other way.
City are an established Championship team. They should be knocking on the door and making progress. If Tan is so content on watching the pennies then the best thing he could do is put somebody in charge to oversee this who know what they are doing and not two people who are playing at guiding the club forward.
Keeping these people in their positions, being hit and miss with managers, transfers and the like is losing him far more money than a decent wage for a Director or Football would cost.
A DoF would aim to ensure we have a longer term plan and stick to it, that each change is an evolution rather than an expensive and time consuming revolution. Arguably, Harris being brought in and the last two posts highlighting that our players being encouraged to play out from the back more and yet the style has not changed that dramatically is exactly what a DoF would call evolution.
A decent director of football might go some way to explaining where we are going wrong though and be able to offer support.Quote:
Originally Posted by surge
Can you see Dalman or Choo discussing with Harris what went wrong last night in detail outside of we didn't shoot and score enough? Some of their comments are beyond belief.
I think when the brown stuff hits the fan at City you need to look at everything that went wrong. At the moment I think it is a case of just pointing at the manager and using him as a scapegoat.
most of these issues Harris inherited. he was left with too many problems to sort out in one curtailed transfer window, and there is a heck of a lot more problems building up for next summer as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa
much of this should be at Neil warnocks door
Put simply if any of us set up say a plumbing business tomorrow.
You got your brother who was an electrician involved, your mate who cleaned a few windows and some lad who was an accountant to oversee what they were all doing. Would you be surprised if the whole thing went belly up fast?
You would see what was wrong fairly early and fix it though I'm sure. We're sacking one bloke each time and pretending everything else is great. It isn't.
That's far too sensible a suggestion for CCFC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
Someone with football experience, who also knows finances. When not to pay too much in transfer fees (Madine etc), or too high wages (everybody Warnock signed).
It's clear that Dalman and Choo have no idea when negotiating with players' agents, so get someone in who has that experience.
And a manager who doesn't turn decent players in to relegation fodder too.
Given all of the evidence since 2013, do people seriously believe that a club owned and controlled by Vincent Tan is ever going to appoint a genuine Director of Football and give such a person any real influence?
Oh for sure but there's so many key areas we haven't been addressed for two windows now. How we've got the same centre midfield for 2 transfer windows is mad. One right back? I'd have driven Gavin Whyte somewhere, how we couldn't get anything for him I don't know. You might as well pay him up now, he's behind Mark Harris in the pecking order. He's not even the worst buy of that bloody transfer window.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
Vincent does know a really good painter-decorator though.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
I'm sure the current managerial consultant at Stevenage would be interested in the DoF role.
You're probably right, but who knows really?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
He must be aware that it is an area we are deficient in, as it is a model that so many clubs are using these days.
He had an interest in LAFC for a while, who seemed to be using this kind of approach to great success.
And when they appointed Trollope they were making noises about being stats driven etc, but all that went out the window within 12 games and we went as far in the opposite direction as possible and appointed Warnock.
No, I don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
I think he wants people in charge who dance to his tune and anything that veers away from total control will not be something he will explore. A Director of Football would be exactly this. It would mean Vincent putting faith in and trusting somebody else. I'm not sure he is willing to do that.
Trollope never really wanted the job and it showed. It was bloody awful. The one thing this lot have got right is hiring Warnock in 2016. Letting him stay after relegation is another matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
I think that Dalman & co need to put a statement out after last nights debacle, either back him or sack him. the rumblings need to be addressed.
If you back him, you might as well sack him. Everyone knows a vote of confidence means only one thing, a vote of no confidence. Harris has two games to turn this round, I think he should go if we lose to Luton. If we go into Watford, Stoke then Swansea playing like this we might as well give up. He won't get past the Swansea game, if we lose that one and are 18th or whatever, that's it. I think he'll be gone sooner but that game is the backstop, we're either improving or he's done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer
For what it's worth, I have lost a lot of respect for the players. I don't care who the manager is, the gutless and spineless performances we've seen of late (of which last night was truly in a class of it's own) cannot be ignored.
As a squad we're a mess. Harris tried to add some 'class' to the side, but it hasn't really made us better because to play decent football you need to start from the back : Bacuna, Pack, Ralls, Vaulks, Whyte - enough said. If we do get it on the deck it's out wide to Wilson or Hoillet, for a cross into either Moore or Glatzel. That's the sum total. We can't play slick football to cut open defences, and Harris has realised this, so he's opting for as many balls into the box as we can muster. It's so easy for even the worst Championship defences to defend..Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro de la Rosa