Wes Burns

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19-02-24, 20:02
Baloo

Wes Burns

Cardiff boy.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A fun trip to Swansea this weekend 👀🙆🏼*♂️ <a href="https://t.co/toXe6uHiNZ">pic.twitter.com/toXe6uHiNZ</a></p>— Wes Burns (@wesley__burns) <a href="https://twitter.com/wesley__burns/status/1759319672128717161?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 18, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
19-02-24, 20:20
NYCBlue

Re: Wes Burns

Love it!
19-02-24, 20:20
Taunton Blue Genie

Re: Wes Burns

Wes Burns, Googie Withers and Bill Withers. And is Charlotte Rampling and Claire Balding?
20-02-24, 08:46
FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

Re: Wes Burns

Another one who, like Tom Lockyer, was released from the City academy as a teenager.

Could add Regan Poole to that list, too.

Whoever was making the decisions at the academy during that period should have stuck to Football Manager.
20-02-24, 09:47
Trigger

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

Another one who, like Tom Lockyer, was released from the City academy as a teenager.

Could add Regan Poole to that list, too.

Whoever was making the decisions at the academy during that period should have stuck to Football Manager.

Easy in hindsight.

They likely came through at a time when there were better in their positions in the first team.

Ultimately they have had to spend some time in lower divisions to become the players they have.
20-02-24, 10:03
MacAdder

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie

Wes Burns, Googie Withers and Bill Withers. And is Charlotte Rampling and Claire Balding?

Surprised you don't know Wes's dad Vic.

Nice one Wes :ayatollah:
20-02-24, 11:35
FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trigger

Easy in hindsight.

They likely came through at a time when there were better in their positions in the first team.

Ultimately they have had to spend some time in lower divisions to become the players they have.

I'm talking about players who were released at 14/15, not 18/19.

Regan Poole was released in June 2014, aged 15, and was playing senior mens football just two months later. He was signed by Man Utd for £100k within a year.

Burns was picked up straight away by a fellow Championship club who he played 50 odd games for.
21-02-24, 01:20
Loramski

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

I'm talking about players who were released at 14/15, not 18/19.

Regan Poole was released in June 2014, aged 15, and was playing senior mens football just two months later. He was signed by Man Utd for £100k within a year.

Burns was picked up straight away by a fellow Championship club who he played 50 odd games for.

Burns had only played 21 Championship games before this season. He struggled to get games with Bristol City even after they were relegated, they sent him on loan five times before letting him go to League 1 Fleetwood in 2017.

Poole ended up playing one minute for Man Utd (in a European game where Rashford made his debut). He hasn't played in the Championship as of yet, although it's only a matter of time I'd have thought. He was doing well at Portsmouth before his ACL injury.

Lockyer played nearly 300 games in Leagues 1 and 2, as well as the Conference, before he played in the Championship.

Bristol City gave up with Burns and sold him, the other two players let their contracts run down at Bristol Rovers and Lincoln so any Prem or Championship club could've picked them up for nothing. The fact that the three went to Fleetwood, Charlton and Portsmouth suggests it wasn't just us who didn't see a lot of potential there. As Trigger said, it's easy with hindsight.
21-02-24, 06:44
Grangenders

Re: Wes Burns

Exactly. All clubs release players that go on to have decent careers. Chelsea had Salah and De Bruyne once!
21-02-24, 07:55
WJ99mobile

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

Another one who, like Tom Lockyer, was released from the City academy as a teenager.

Could add Regan Poole to that list, too.

Whoever was making the decisions at the academy during that period should have stuck to Football Manager.

I bet there’s hundreds more that were released and never made it as footballers.

Not saying that we don’t have a problem with youth football but it’s not that easy at that age to always spot
21-02-24, 08:25
FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loramski

Burns had only played 21 Championship games before this season. He struggled to get games with Bristol City even after they were relegated, they sent him on loan five times before letting him go to League 1 Fleetwood in 2017.

Poole ended up playing one minute for Man Utd (in a European game where Rashford made his debut). He hasn't played in the Championship as of yet, although it's only a matter of time I'd have thought. He was doing well at Portsmouth before his ACL injury.

Lockyer played nearly 300 games in Leagues 1 and 2, as well as the Conference, before he played in the Championship.

Bristol City gave up with Burns and sold him, the other two players let their contracts run down at Bristol Rovers and Lincoln so any Prem or Championship club could've picked them up for nothing. The fact that the three went to Fleetwood, Charlton and Portsmouth suggests it wasn't just us who didn't see a lot of potential there. As Trigger said, it's easy with hindsight.

It's a fair argument for Lockyer, who has said that leaving to play in the lower leagues made him the player he is. And, to an extent, Burns (although it's worth noting Fleetwood made the League 1 play-offs in two of the seasons he was there, one of which he won POTY. So it's not like he had to drop to the depths to prove himself).

I disagree with Regan Poole though. Poole was told he was too small to play U16s football (as was Lockyer, incidentally), but within 2 months someone at Newport decided he was big enough to play senior men's football. That's not a case of hindsight, that was awful judgement at the time (and I remember Danny Gabbidon who was involved in the club at that point, saying as much). Either he had one hell of a growth spurt in those 2 months, or someone wasn't doing their job properly.

As I said, I'm not talking about players released at 18/19 here. I'm talking about 14 and 15 years of age, with several years of development still ahead. If our production line had been churning out talent after talent over the last 15 years, you could say "OK a few slipped through the net". But given the absolute dearth of quality academy players coming through in that time, I don't think it's an unfair point.

I find it hard to believe that each of those players could have racked up hundreds of Football League games without showing any potential at 14. Especially when you consider that 95% of their teammates in those youth teams have gone on to do absolutely nothing in football.

Of course there's always an element of luck, I get that. Players develop at different rates. Coaches get calls wrong and rejected players become more determined to prove themselves. But over the last 15 years, City's academy hasn't got much right - and they got a few big ones wrong.
22-02-24, 00:30
Loramski

Re: Wes Burns

Quote:

Originally Posted by FormerlyJohnnyBreadhead

It's a fair argument for Lockyer, who has said that leaving to play in the lower leagues made him the player he is. And, to an extent, Burns (although it's worth noting Fleetwood made the League 1 play-offs in two of the seasons he was there, one of which he won POTY. So it's not like he had to drop to the depths to prove himself).

I disagree with Regan Poole though. Poole was told he was too small to play U16s football (as was Lockyer, incidentally), but within 2 months someone at Newport decided he was big enough to play senior men's football. That's not a case of hindsight, that was awful judgement at the time (and I remember Danny Gabbidon who was involved in the club at that point, saying as much). Either he had one hell of a growth spurt in those 2 months, or someone wasn't doing their job properly.

As I said, I'm not talking about players released at 18/19 here. I'm talking about 14 and 15 years of age, with several years of development still ahead. If our production line had been churning out talent after talent over the last 15 years, you could say "OK a few slipped through the net". But given the absolute dearth of quality academy players coming through in that time, I don't think it's an unfair point.

I find it hard to believe that each of those players could have racked up hundreds of Football League games without showing any potential at 14. Especially when you consider that 95% of their teammates in those youth teams have gone on to do absolutely nothing in football.

Of course there's always an element of luck, I get that. Players develop at different rates. Coaches get calls wrong and rejected players become more determined to prove themselves. But over the last 15 years, City's academy hasn't got much right - and they got a few big ones wrong.

We haven't been bringing players with three legs through the Academy though. It's bewildering trying to work out who's going to make it, there's no rhyme or reason to it half the time. Me and TOBW watched Bellamy's Academy team the season they won their league, we both thought we were seeing the basis of a future first team but Colwill's the last man standing for now. Some are still here but most are spread far and wide.

Sion Spence got released. Outrage on here. Palace picked him up, more outrage. Got a hat-trick for their under-23s, meltdown. My eldest played hockey at Chippenham recently. The clubhouse overlooks their football pitch, they were playing Havant and Waterlooville, who are next to bottom of the National League South, and Sion Spence plays for them now. Mark Harris is doing well for himself though. Go figure.

I'd love to see more local youngsters coming through but we can't keep them all here for ever just in case a couple make the grade ten or fifteen years later. How would we have kept the three you're talking about? How many times can you send someone out on loan while you're waiting for them to make the grade? Not local, but we let Ajayi go even though he was playing Championship football every week with Rotherham at the time.

Good luck to Regan Poole and I hope he makes it but, ten years after we released him, he still hasn't kicked a ball in the Championship and he's older than Declan Rice. I'm sure Chelsea fans can't understand how they released Rice when he was 14 but it just shows what a lottery player development can be.