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To my reckoning these are the ins and outs, 4 of the outs would get into the current team (imho).....looking much poorer as a team and squad - hoping for mid table mediocrity and a full season following the city :ayatollah: :ayatollah:
In Out
J Collins Glatzel
R Wintle Ojo
R Giles Wilson
M Mcguiness Bamba
J Williams
Bennett
Watters
Whyte
Osei-Tutu
Which 4 get into the current team?Quote:
Originally Posted by I'll give you the Malky!!
Wilson yes . Fully fit Bennett. That would be it for me.
Wilson, Bennet , Ojo and Osei Tutu
Depends on which factor you're looking at really but I'd love to see your reasoning for saying we're looking "much poorer".
I had us down as 8th/9th best squad last year and think we're probably about 10th this year. We've taken a small step back in trade off of looking after budget and investing in the future but "much poorer" seems way off at this point.
Ojo was good at times but less good at other times. We've got less depth now at AM (Wintle is not an AM) so will miss him but starting XI hasn't become worse.
Osei-Tutu was good but injured most of the season. It's brutal to say but we won't miss his contribution from last year.
I'd say we are clearly weaker than last season - but hopefully not TOO much. We've probably lost half of our operating budget and to be fair to Mick they've looked to take costs out in away that will hopefully allow us to still progress and build over the next couple of seasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'll give you the Malky!!
Collins / Glatzel - fairly even, might even get more out of collins.
Wintle looks a good signing too.
Giles / Ojo is probably fairly even, perhaps we will even get some more out of Giles.
the big ones for me are Bennett and Wilson.
Bennett is/was one of the best players in that position in the division, as much as I'm hoping Bagan will be great, it's asking a lot to expect him to be one of the best in the division as a teenager - if he does achieve that then there will be some big clubs coming in for him in the summer! Hopefully he has a good season and continues to develop with us. Longer term could be very good for us, bt over the shorter term I'd say we are weaker.
Likewise Harry Wilson - one of the best players in the division full stop. And we are hoping that Tomlin can stay fit and find some consistency and perhaps Colwill will continue to develop to replace him. To me he's inexplicably underrated on here, and we are going to miss what he brings.
All in all though it's hopefully not too much of a step back. A few of the older players are at an age where they're possibly going to start declining - pack, Flint, Morrisson. But that's counteracted by the younger guys hopefully kicking on as well.
In general all of the moves seem to make good sense, and our overall squad management seems a lot better than in recent seasons.
Not sure how anyone can think this is as good as last years squad.
I keep saying, I hope people aren’t going to get a terrible shock.
It’s already a squad that wasn’t blessed with pace and now a lot of those players are a year older - particularly the midfield.
Hopefully Giles is better than Ojo.
Glatzel was hopeless. Let alone Collins and Harris im hoping Isaak Davies is a better option. Osei-Tutu was a complete waste of a loan. Ng and Sang contributed more.
The big loss is Wilson.
Youll be in for a shock when wins appear on the board instead of 5 nil losses.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
if you look at non-penalty goals + assists per 90 minutes last season, our best player by some distance for that measure was Harry Wilson with 0.58.
Second was Sheyi Ojo with 0.46.
third was Kieffer Moore with 0.45.
then there's a huge gap to the next player - Joe Ralls on 0.21, and Will Walks on 0.2.
that is a massive hole in the team offensively that we are having to fill. Giles we are all hoping will be good, and then we are looking at Tomlin or youngsters stepping up, or perhaps Murphy realising his potential.
it isn't impossible that we will replace these goals and assists but a betting man would probably guess we will have less of a goal threat this season
I think Giles is going to be a better player for us than Wilson was. Ojo flattered to deceive, Glatzel was crap and Bamba is no longer good enough at this level. Wilson and Bennett are the two we'll miss but I won't miss Wilson trudging around the pitch totally uninterested when things don't go his way.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'll give you the Malky!!
I'll be delighted if giles does as well as Wilson did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric the Half a Bee
We have quite a small squad - just 24 players, according to Transfermarkt - compared to Newport, who have 26.
We did well on Saturday then:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hooded Claw
I think Wilson is a huge loss and I think we will see it more and more as the season goes on.
I would cautiously suggest that Ojo figures above are an example of where stats can be misleading. My memory suggests he was very hot for a few games (10 or less) but very average in short bursts or missing completely for rest. Now that might be what was going on around him more than anything but I understand he started well and faded at Rangers too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
Regarding Ojo, we'll miss him when he was hot, miss him as a depth piece when he was average and not miss him when he was cold or missing.
Over 46 games I expect Giles will be able to replace Ojo and moreso so Wilson will be the big miss in an attacking sense because think it's unlikely Giles does that well. But Ojo did allow some attention away from Wilson on reputation alone and not sure we have that now - the need for depth now seemingly missing. Wilson and Ojo also did a lot of hard work during our good run pre-Christmas as well.
Regarding full-backs for first half of last season we had Bacuna and Bennett. If NG, Sang and Bagan can do better than that combination then even though Bennett appears to be a big miss, us being exposed on one side, that doesn't become different til second half of the season.
We were much better than midtable sides, surprisingly bad against bottom sides and poor (a few one off days aside) against the best in the division last year. Midtable sides might get closer to us but we should be better against bottom sides so still waiting to hear how we're much worse than last year.
The only loss was Wilson who didn't always turn up at games .
Bennett was the most consistent up to his unfortunate Injury .
Of the rest ,Glatzel, Ojo, Bamba,J Williams,Watters,Whyte.,Osei-Tutu , you could argue outside of Ojo they didn't really appear in full games .
We do need to see Collins , Wintle, Giles, Mcguiness adapt and perform surely before we become woe is me
Ojo got 5 goals and 7 assists, which isn't bad . I hope those who are convinced that Giles is going to easily surpass that are correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by surge
Clearly we are weaker. Giles played 42 League games last season for Coventry and Rotherham, off which 27 were starts. Wintle has joined from Crewe. I cannot see Wintle getting in ahead of Pack, Ralls or Bacuna, and we have Vaulks too. Giles will useful, and probably be more consistent than Ojo, but if he plays at wing back we don't have a left winger except for Murphy. McGuinness will be back up for Morrison or Flint.
As said above , Wilson and Bennet are two big losses to the squad. We have replaced some ageing ineffective players like those listed (Glatzel, Bamba, Williams, Bennett and the others) with younger inexperienced players. The only way young players get experience is to start games regularly, as we will see with Bagan this coming season. I cannot see us getting Bennett back, depending on his injury, as his wages would still be a stumbling point. If he was on £20k pw as stated, what is he worth now. But there again will he get a deal anywhere when fit?
Giles might not surpass Ojo's ceiling, the 10 or less games where he was hot, but I still expect his average performance to be better and therefore over the course of a season being a better player for us...unless you rank Ojo's productivity in short periods of time as more important than an expected better average of performance over course of season because points win prizes rather than performances?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rjk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hilts
I certainly hope so. It’s possible too.
With youngsters and even with free transfers you never know for certain. Common sense should tell you that we’re pushing our luck here though and we have no fallback position.
I’ll be the most delighted man here if they all shine but my experience tells me that you’ve got to introduce ALL new players gradually , especially young kids and those who’ve moved up one or two leagues. How many players out of eleven do you need going to pieces before it’s a duck shoot ?
It can happen to experienced professionals occasionally as we saw against QPR and Sheffield Wednesday. Of course it can , but what the **** do we do if it starts sliding with all these experimental players and kids ? It’d ruin their own confidence and progress as well you know, and he’s got no back up to save them and the club IF that starts happening.
It’s NOT professional to take massive chances without a plan B, but please don’t think I WANT it to go tits up. Like everyone here I want them to succeed - I’m just screaming at them not to chuck the spare tyre out in order to take an extra crate of beer.
Agreed. All 4 would walk into our side.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'll give you the Malky!!
Also, as an aside, has anyone not noticed how poor Ng has been this pre-season.
I hope it is because he is still recovering from COVID, because he has been ponderous and slow, or perhaps more cynically, they are the signs that prove he has now become properly embedded into our system.
I think this is a really fair, honest, and well-thought-out post and you're certainly not alone with these thoughts and concerns. We can only hope MM will work miracles and, of course, like you, I want them to succeed and will be at every home game supporting them.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
this chance with "experimental players and kids" is basically what almost every other side in the division has to do every season.Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieBird
our experiment with youth so far has only amounted to a handful of appearances between Sang, Bagan and Harris, mostly to cover injuries.
this is normal. the previous state of affairs where we had 3 senior players in each position is not