Question: going with youth
I'll admit I haven't seen much U23/academy football apart from the occasional 30 minutes, when I have insomnia, on the club's website.
I'm curious because I know a few people on here (possibly led by TOBW) watch a lot of it.
My main question is - is this current crop of youngsters the best we've had in a few academy generations of youngsters? Also are they that much better than the past graduates? Or are we just going with youth because it's cheap and this is what we have available? Or is it somewhere between the two?
Re: Question: going with youth
Cheap and we're skint (like most yes I know) saw it a mile off, don't mind us doing it but the way it was put across wasn't genuine, they did it like they were listening to fans and finally changing things, when in reality it's because we are broke and out of options.
Even now we'll see square pegs (experience played out of position rather than like for like kids in natural positions) in round holes.
Re: Question: going with youth
I keep hoping MM knows what he’s doing and has got some clever plan but I can’t see it.
Re: Question: going with youth
The only way to know if the kids are good enough is to play them. I feel like every manager we've had since Dave Jones has been terrified of blooding any in.
I'm still not convinced by Bagan, can't understand why he's been given the number 3 shirt. Hoping to be proved wrong. I think Tom Sang has something about him but want to see him in his natural position.
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
az city
I'll admit I haven't seen much U23/academy football apart from the occasional 30 minutes, when I have insomnia, on the club's website.
I'm curious because I know a few people on here (possibly led by TOBW) watch a lot of it.
My main question is - is this current crop of youngsters the best we've had in a few academy generations of youngsters? Also are they that much better than the past graduates? Or are we just going with youth because it's cheap and this is what we have available? Or is it somewhere between the two?
There's always the standard refrain about results not being important at Academy level and in most respects it's true, but, when a question like yours gets asked, there's not a great deal else you can go on.
Our Academy started up in 04/05 and, apart from last season, I watched something like two thirds of the home games we played during that time at Under 18 level. Therefore I cannot comment on younger age groups, but, as the last season most of them will play before the decision to offer them a senior contract or not is made, I'd say it is the best age group to use in trying to answer your question.
The main thing which strikes me looking back on all of those teams and players I've seen down the years is how similar, in terms of results at least, they were. I would say that for at least three quarters, maybe even more, of those seasons we've finished in the middle third of whatever division we've been in with a record which may have a small number more wins than losses or vice versa. I'm struggling to think of any season where we've finished in the bottom two or three of our league, but there are barely any where there has been a title challenge either.
I'm not quite talking about a level playing field mind, because it needs to be said that we played against sides like Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and Villa until about 2010. Now, as a level two Academy, the only time we'll get to play sides of that stature is if we draw them in the Youth Cup - so in the era when our Academy pretty consistently produced first team players, they were up against the top sides.
In the last sixteen or seventeen years though, I'm only aware of one City team that have won the league they played in. That was in 18/19 I believe (it was the team which had Ratcliffe, Bagan, Bowen, Patten, Evans and Davies in it anyway). Not only did they win their league, they reached the Final of the end of season Play Off's and only lost 3-2 at Hillsborough to Sheffield Wednesday in a match which saw them reduced to nine men.
On that basis, I'd definitely name that side as the best of the era which saw Academy's categorised, so you'd like to think that they represent the best chance in a long time of seeing some make the transition to first team regulars.
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spooky Tree
The only way to know if the kids are good enough is to play them. I feel like every manager we've had since Dave Jones has been terrified of blooding any in.
I'm still not convinced by Bagan, can't understand why he's been given the number 3 shirt. Hoping to be proved wrong. I think Tom Sang has something about him but want to see him in his natural position.
Mick's obviously a fan
Could provide some opportunities for Tom Davies who has been impressive in pre season
Re: Question: going with youth
Tbh I don't think we will see that much of many of them, probably Bagan as first choice and Colwill and Brown from the bench or to cover injuries.
We have enough players to play an experienced team and have the youth pushing through which I think is the right way to go about it. Problem is a lot of fans want youth to have a chance but still expect all the big signings and a squad full of experienced players.
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
2b2bdoo
Tbh I don't think we will see that much of many of them, probably Bagan as first choice and Colwill and Brown from the bench or to cover injuries.
We have enough players to play an experienced team and have the youth pushing through which I think is the right way to go about it. Problem is a lot of fans want youth to have a chance but still expect all the big signings and a squad full of experienced players.
If we had any long term planning at all we'd be giving these guys opportunities. 9 first team players (Smithies, Morrison, Tomlin, Flint, Pack, Vassell, Ralls, Murphy, Vaulks) are out of contract at the end of the season, a fair few of them could/should be released, giving opportunities to younger players now would help make it clear who has to be kept and who we can safely let go
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
City123
If we had any long term planning at all we'd be giving these guys opportunities. 9 first team players (Smithies, Morrison, Tomlin, Flint, Pack, Vassell, Ralls, Murphy, Vaulks) are out of contract at the end of the season, a fair few of them could/should be released, giving opportunities to younger players now would help make it clear who has to be kept and who we can safely let go
I agree, the best need to get integrated into the team this season I'm just not sure if we will see it happen.
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
2b2bdoo
I agree, the best need to get integrated into the team this season I'm just not sure if we will see it happen.
Yes, the more who are capable of playing at this level the easier our job will be next summer.
the fewer players we need to bring in the better quality they can be.
And if any of the youngsters turn out to be better than just "doing a job" at this level then even better.
Re: Question: going with youth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
City123
If we had any long term planning at all we'd be giving these guys opportunities. 9 first team players (Smithies, Morrison, Tomlin, Flint, Pack, Vassell, Ralls, Murphy, Vaulks) are out of contract at the end of the season, a fair few of them could/should be released, giving opportunities to younger players now would help make it clear who has to be kept and who we can safely let go
Micks comments about Ciaron Brown and Warnock's offer state he's in final year of his current contract as well:
"Browny is in his last year [of his contract]. So if Neil Wants to offer something that's anywhere near our valuation, even though the player has only got 12 months to run, then we may have to sell him. We don't want him to go on a free transfer.
TOBW's comments suggest moving to Category 1 Academy would do a lot to improve youth development. It's not like we can easily pick up London's best a la Brentford or Crystal Palace.
