Cameron in the kacky?

[Des Parrot]

Firstly let me say that I'm not defending anyone or any principle here.

I'm an ex-resident of the Isle of Man, my wife is Manx as are 2 of my 4 sons. My background in Motor-cycle racing led to me living & working there.

The population of the Island has increased by 30% in the last 25 years and the number of "come-overs" now exceeds the number of hereditary Manx people. Tax avoidance is seen as a "rich mans" domain. Yes there are actors, bankers and sports stars taking advantage of the Manx tax system, but they are far outnumbered by the "worker class" seamen, rig workers, airline staff, chefs, engineers etc. who take advantage of being in Britain for less than 6 months of the year and get paid into a Manx bank account.

There are a lot of righteous people, who point the finger at others but if the opportunity presented itself would do the same thing.

[Barry Dragon]

It is a non story (or want it to be ) if you are a Tory apologist who wants to avoid the PM being shown up as a liar and hypocrite.

For me there is a bigger story, one being covered up by this story. Thousands of rich , much richer than cameron, using these schemes themselves. That is what needs covering. Yes cameron has dug himself a whole with his response, but the problem is much bigger much more important than him holding some shares. Would he get the same attention if he held shares in google, tesco, or apple?

Its a distraction technique played out by the people guilty of far worse. Focus on the real problem, not something that flatters your hatred of the tories.

[GRUMPYS DEN]

In your opinion he's right , in my opinion he's wrong and loads of people on radio stations this morning think he's wrong too

I don't speak for others so of course it's my opinion.That's what a message board is about surely.Do you want me to right 'in my opinion' on each post!!!!

[GRUMPYS DEN]

For me there is a bigger story, one being covered up by this story. Thousands of rich , much richer than cameron, using these schemes themselves. That is what needs covering. Yes cameron has dug himself a whole with his response, but the problem is much bigger much more important than him holding some shares. Would he get the same attention if he held shares in google, tesco, or apple?

Its a distraction technique played out by the people guilty of far worse. Focus on the real problem, not something that flatters your hatred of the tories.

To satisfy Sludge-in my opinion you have summed it up perfectly.

[Dénia Bluebird]

Cent ?

Euro surely ?

Have you been on the glue

You bloody immigrant , taking Spanish jobs

OMG there are even more morons than I anticipated. If you had half a brain you would know a Euro comprises 100 centimos, popularly known as cents. And further more, I have taken no jobs from locals as I am 100% retired!

[TruBlue]

OMG there are even more morons than I anticipated. If you had half a brain you would know a Euro comprises 100 centimos, popularly known as cents. And further more, I have taken no jobs from locals as I am 100% retired!

Poor old Sludge has had a mare on the Cent issue.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

I don't speak for others so of course it's my opinion.That's what a message board is about surely.Do you want me to right 'in my opinion' on each post!!!!

It would help although your opinion is always to the right of centre with a wooden stake stuck up your backside by sitting on the right side of the fence , if that's possible

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

OMG there are even more morons than I anticipated. If you had half a brain you would know a Euro comprises 100 centimos, popularly known as cents. And further more, I have taken no jobs from locals as I am 100% retired!

I am fully aware of that I was taking the piss out of you

Is it nice and sunny over there ?

Got your feet up on the sun lounger or have the Germans got there first

Bloody immigrants eh !!

Don't hurry back

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

To satisfy Sludge-in my opinion you have summed it up perfectly.

Spoken as a true I am middle of the road but as I get older I am turning into a Tory but can't hide it perfectly, in my opinion

It's sunny today but a bit cold

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Firstly let me say that I'm not defending anyone or any principle here.

I'm an ex-resident of the Isle of Man, my wife is Manx as are 2 of my 4 sons. My background in Motor-cycle racing led to me living & working there.

The population of the Island has increased by 30% in the last 25 years and the number of "come-overs" now exceeds the number of hereditary Manx people. Tax avoidance is seen as a "rich mans" domain. Yes there are actors, bankers and sports stars taking advantage of the Manx tax system, but they are far outnumbered by the "worker class" seamen, rig workers, airline staff, chefs, engineers etc. who take advantage of being in Britain for less than 6 months of the year and get paid into a Manx bank account.

There are a lot of righteous people, who point the finger at others but if the opportunity presented itself would do the same thing.

I wouldn't

[Barry Dragon]

I wouldn't

I was reading about several people who were not rich and said this, but found as they got rich, they did partake in such activities. Because thats the way it tends to work. Easy to say you wouldn't when not well-off. Come back and say it if you make loads of money.

I am a big critic of tax avoidance, but where is the moral line to be drawn. Is using the marriage allowance okay? Is using a limited company and taking the tax benefits that come over being self employed okay. Where is the moral line, is there a line. It certainly moves depending on your wealth.

[GRUMPYS DEN]

It would help although your opinion is always to the right of centre with a wooden stake stuck up your backside by sitting on the right side of the fence , if that's possible

Bless you -predictable in your own sweet way as you say I am.

[lardy]

I was reading about several people who were not rich and said this, but found as they got rich, they did partake in such activities. Because thats the way it tends to work. Easy to say you wouldn't when not well-off. Come back and say it if you make loads of money.

I am a big critic of tax avoidance, but where is the moral line to be drawn. Is using the marriage allowance okay? Is using a limited company and taking the tax benefits that come over being self employed okay. Where is the moral line, is there a line. It certainly moves depending on your wealth.

From your earlier post, you suggest that as long as it's not as bad as the big corporations then it's ok.

[GRUMPYS DEN]

Firstly let me say that I'm not defending anyone or any principle here.

I'm an ex-resident of the Isle of Man, my wife is Manx as are 2 of my 4 sons. My background in Motor-cycle racing led to me living & working there.

The population of the Island has increased by 30% in the last 25 years and the number of "come-overs" now exceeds the number of hereditary Manx people. Tax avoidance is seen as a "rich mans" domain. Yes there are actors, bankers and sports stars taking advantage of the Manx tax system, but they are far outnumbered by the "worker class" seamen, rig workers, airline staff, chefs, engineers etc. who take advantage of being in Britain for less than 6 months of the year and get paid into a Manx bank account.

There are a lot of righteous people, who point the finger at others but if the opportunity presented itself would do the same thing.

There are probably plenty who say they wouldn't for the sake of being seen as on the moral high ground!!!!!!

[cardiff55]

As far I can can extract from whats out there. He held shares in a scheme his father setup. He paid tax on the dividends he received from the company, and when he disposed of the shares the capital gain (split between the 2 of them) was below the capital gains tax threshold so no tax was payable. So he has not directly avoided any tax.

Its as good as a non story. Especially compared to the levels of dodgy tax avoidance uncovered. Its purely an anti tory rhetoric. Completely avoiding the real story.

A tax avoidance scheme us illegal.

It is perfectly fine to have offshore investments, but anyone who is a UK resident/domicile MUST declare income and gains to HMRC. Tha aim of many of these companies is to hide ownership etc of assets, and they do not have to declare to UK HMRC any details if individuals. The same used to happen in Jersey but about 10 years ago the rules changed and Jersey based companies had declare interest etc to the UK. Cameron said that investing in the Panama based trust allowed investment in overseas investments and investments in other currencies. That can be done FA the UK Stick Market quite legally with full reporting structures to the tax authorities. So why invest in these trust then? Simple....tax avoidance.

One question not yet asked us how much if wealth accumulated in his dad's trust grew tax free with no tax reporting?That would mean anyone who inherited this wealth has benefited from something that didn't pay tax and therefore was worth much more because of not paying tax.

These people can give whatever excuse they want, and a large number of people will believe them as their explanations are perfectly plausible, but others know the real reasons.

[GRUMPYS DEN]

A tax avoidance scheme us illegal.

It is perfectly fine to have offshore investments, but anyone who is a UK resident/domicile MUST declare income and gains to HMRC. Tha aim of many of these companies is to hide ownership etc of assets, and they do not have to declare to UK HMRC any details if individuals. The same used to happen in Jersey but about 10 years ago the rules changed and Jersey based companies had declare interest etc to the UK. Cameron said that investing in the Panama based trust allowed investment in overseas investments and investments in other currencies. That can be done FA the UK Stick Market quite legally with full reporting structures to the tax authorities. So why invest in these trust then? Simple....tax avoidance.

One question not yet asked us how much if wealth accumulated in his dad's trust grew tax free with no tax reporting?That would mean anyone who inherited this wealth has benefited from something that didn't pay tax and therefore was worth much more because of not paying tax.

These people can give whatever excuse they want, and a large number of people will believe them as their explanations are perfectly plausible, but others know the real reasons.

Tax evasion is illegal-tax avoidance is not apparently.

[Vimana.]

Ooops, its not going away ... Cameron really under the cosh now.

I'm sure the lines of 'right and wrong' are a little blurred, but nevertheless the guy has found himself in a situation where he now reeks of hypocrisy, and also appears to have been avoiding telling the full truth. Not good for a PM...

I bet he wishes everyone just went back to talking about him with his todger that pigs head again ..

Will be interesting to see how/if he gets out of this one.
And terrifying as to what might follow if he doesn't. Frying pan .. fire.
Lucky ol' Britain ..

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Bless you -predictable in your own sweet way as you say I am.

And bless you dame Maggie of Thatcher , bless you

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Tax evasion is illegal-tax avoidance is not apparently.

He's a sharp cookie this one , watch out hmrc

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

There are probably plenty who say they wouldn't for the sake of being seen as on the moral high ground!!!!!!

Not me Norman tebbits, not me

[GRUMPYS DEN]

And bless you dame Maggie of Thatcher , bless you

You talk about sharp cookies lol I suppose the analogy is tool and box!!

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

I was reading about several people who were not rich and said this, but found as they got rich, they did partake in such activities. Because thats the way it tends to work. Easy to say you wouldn't when not well-off. Come back and say it if you make loads of money.

I am a big critic of tax avoidance, but where is the moral line to be drawn. Is using the marriage allowance okay? Is using a limited company and taking the tax benefits that come over being self employed okay. Where is the moral line, is there a line. It certainly moves depending on your wealth.

You clearly speak for yourself mate , if I became rich most of it would go to charity for the homeless and mentally ill

Not everyone is greedy once they get some dosh

[GRUMPYS DEN]

Not me Norman tebbits, not me

I'll take your word for it

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

You talk about sharp cookies lol I suppose the analogy is tool and box!!

No sharp cookie mr Rees mogg, sharp cookie

[Barry Dragon]

A tax avoidance scheme us illegal.

It is perfectly fine to have offshore investments, but anyone who is a UK resident/domicile MUST declare income and gains to HMRC. Tha aim of many of these companies is to hide ownership etc of assets, and they do not have to declare to UK HMRC any details if individuals. The same used to happen in Jersey but about 10 years ago the rules changed and Jersey based companies had declare interest etc to the UK. Cameron said that investing in the Panama based trust allowed investment in overseas investments and investments in other currencies. That can be done FA the UK Stick Market quite legally with full reporting structures to the tax authorities. So why invest in these trust then? Simple....tax avoidance.

One question not yet asked us how much if wealth accumulated in his dad's trust grew tax free with no tax reporting?That would mean anyone who inherited this wealth has benefited from something that didn't pay tax and therefore was worth much more because of not paying tax.

These people can give whatever excuse they want, and a large number of people will believe them as their explanations are perfectly plausible, but others know the real reasons.

Your mixing it up. Tax avoidance is LEGAL, tax evasion is illegal. Where is the line separating the 2, well that depends on how clever your accountant is. You have mixed up legal procedures (as the rules stand) and some illegal practices.

He did pay tax on the funds made from the wealth from the trust, he paid dividend tax.

Putting funds abroad and growing them is legal. Hiding the money abroad is illegal. The trust his dad setup is 100% legal, not moral, but legal. Another case that was on the panama program where a guy who made money through property investments by putting it through a nameless company is apparently legal too, but barely, and could be investigated to be illegal evasion of tax.

Tax avoidance measures can be as simple as using the marriage allowance, its legal. But there is no clear line between whats legal and whats illegal, that can be made to look legal. Thats what needs attention.