What leave voters voted for?

[Wales-Bales]

,
So you believe everything you read on certain alt right sites and you're an independent thinker, I sometimes question what I see in the Guardian and on the BBC website and I'm brainwashed? I see.

I don't read alt right sites. I follow an equal number of left/right journalists, politicians and social commentators on Twitter, including lardy's favourite ones.

[the other bob wilson]

I don't read alt right sites. I follow an equal number of left/right journalists, politicians and social commentators on Twitter, including lardy's favourite ones.

And yet so many of the things you post on here come off Alt right sites. What you say doesn't reflect the point I was making though, even if you did read all of the stuff you claim to do -, you, without fail, come to the same anti globalist conclusions, whereas I am at least capable of sometimes being critical of the people and organisations I generally support and yet I'm the one who is brainwashed?

[Wales-Bales]

And yet so many of the things you post on here come off Alt right sites. What you say doesn't reflect the point I was making though, even if you did read all of the stuff you claim to do -, you, without fail, come to the same anti globalist conclusions, whereas I am at least capable of sometimes being critical of the people and organisations I generally support and yet I'm the one who is brainwashed?

What I have posted will become mainstream news, I am just ahead of the curve. We already know that everything lardy posted on the subject was a load of rubbish. Once the truth is revealed, I will be vindicated.

[RonnieBird]

And yet so many of the things you post on here come off Alt right sites. What you say doesn't reflect the point I was making though, even if you did read all of the stuff you claim to do -, you, without fail, come to the same anti globalist conclusions, whereas I am at least capable of sometimes being critical of the people and organisations I generally support and yet I'm the one who is brainwashed?

That's a lot of nonsense. You can't possibly relate all these historic events to socialism and to try to do that shows a misunderstanding of the concept. Mostly these people wanted equality ,freedom and representation, which is quite contrary to socialism with its all powerful state and destruction of the individual, together with his religious and racial identity, and his ability to succeed or excel .

I doubt whether anyone has read Marx over and over because it's so boring, but if what you say is correct then you should read some other stuff too. Since you like lefties so much check out Trotsy's views of socialism and anti semitism.

If you read Mein Kampf you'll see that Adolf says some pretty similar stuff about Jews , as did Stalin ,and that's because it's the default position of socialists. As with labour today, there's always an excuse or qualification for anti semitism , ( the Jews are clever people but they are a danger to Germany because they trade with the enemy ..... It's not the Jews we hate, but the actions of the Israeli government against Arab Moslems we also invade and bomb ......)

Dress it up however you like. It comes down to the same evil thing and ,unlike the stuff we ban and make a fuss about today, it is genuinely dangerous to many human beings. I don't accuse you of wanting another hollocaust because I'm sure you don't understand what your dealing with - nor did the mass of people in Germany who fell for it , but it's no less dangerous or wicked for any of that.

[jon1959]

That's a lot of nonsense. You can't possibly relate all these historic events to socialism and to try to do that shows a misunderstanding of the concept. Mostly these people wanted equality ,freedom and representation, which is quite contrary to socialism with its all powerful state and destruction of the individual, together with his religious and racial identity, and his ability to succeed or excel .

I doubt whether anyone has read Marx over and over because it's so boring, but if what you say is correct then you should read some other stuff too. Since you like lefties so much check out Trotsy's views of socialism and anti semitism.

If you read Mein Kampf you'll see that Adolf says some pretty similar stuff about Jews , as did Stalin ,and that's because it's the default position of socialists. As with labour today, there's always an excuse or qualification for anti semitism , ( the Jews are clever people but they are a danger to Germany because they trade with the enemy ..... It's not the Jews we hate, but the actions of the Israeli government against Arab Moslems we also invade and bomb ......)

Dress it up however you like. It comes down to the same evil thing and ,unlike the stuff we ban and make a fuss about today, it is genuinely dangerous to many human beings. I don't accuse you of wanting another hollocaust because I'm sure you don't understand what your dealing with - nor did the mass of people in Germany who fell for it , but it's no less dangerous or wicked for any of that.

I have just realised that was supposed to be a reply to me not to Paul.

What an incoherent, ignorant pile of horseshit! Even if you intended to talk about communism not socialism (which makes a nonsense of your attack on the 'socialist' Labour Party) and you were even more narrowly trying to describe the objectives of a Leninist Party after 1905 (clearly you are not looking at the 1st or 2nd Internationals in the period between the 1848 revolutions and the Paris Commune - the period of Marx) you have succeeded in confusing yourself and substituting crass propaganda (worthy of Goebbels) for history.

I have done many years of checking out Trotsky's writings, thanks. What point or reference are you grasping for? He, like many of the members and leaders of left-wing organisations in that period and later, was Jewish. The Bolsheviks believed that the Tsarist regime was inherently anti-semitic (through the Orthodox Church, secret police, black hundreds and periodic pogroms for political purposes) and had to be overthrown if Jews were to be free. Most of the leaders of the revolution had the same view (it was part of the party programme). When Stalin seized power over the party and state apparatus some Tsarist anti-semitic language was given space again.

If your attack is on Stalinism why not just say so? I would agree with some of that. But instead you have gone back to your sad little rant about equating Nazism with socialism (by way of Stalin it seems) and then seem to imply that socialists and other anti-racists are working (deliberately or unknowingly) to bring about another holocaust.

You really are disgraceful! I thought I'd seen it all from you, but there you go finding a new and sickening low.