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Thread: Peter Oborne.

  1. #26

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    You missed my point, I'm refering to the inference that the press /media is right biased. They have enjoyed slaughtering May and Boris in equal measure.
    I didn’t miss your point at all. We have a Prime Minister who has has the backing of many print newspapers and indeed up till recently revived a very handsome fee from one (The Telegraph). So it’s fair to say he’s got a lot of support.

    You (again) seem to suggest there is some bias against him despite he fact that he is a Politician in the most prominent position in the country and needs to be held to account and so come up with some ridiculous distracting piece of analogy involving Firefighters.

    By the way it’s not ‘hysteria’ to comment on a PM :
    Lying to the Queen
    Proroguing Parliament
    Voting down an agreement twice to enhance his own reputation and nothing more
    Etc etc etc...::

    TOBW is right, you’ve made an utterly ludicrous argument

  2. #27

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    The BBC are pro right wing, pro Monarchy, pro bosses against workers, pro Israeli, anti Irish, pro union state, pro England, the beeb is an instrument used by the English led UK state to influence thick people.

  3. #28

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    The BBC are none of those things. There is no bigger critic of the Corporation than me, but I'm afraid that's utter nonsense .
    You appear to be on some freaky wind up mission.

  4. #29

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Kaardiff professor types did research on the Beeb [commissioned by the beeb I believe] and they were found to be right wing, pro bosses, pro leave EU, pro Israeli over Arabs, anti Scottish independence etc etc.
    Scotland might well be independent now if it wasn't for Auntie.

  5. #30

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Which makes the same error of over estimating the power of the BBC and establishment in influencing voting patterns as did the Remain and Clinton campaigns.
    I should think it's quite easy to find evidence of anything you want to find in such research , so that probably says more about the professor himself than anything else.
    It might be that some people will give it credibility because a professor produced it, but I'm afraid that fewer people these days automatically accept the word of academics because they've been caught out manipulating the facts for political or financial reasons so often.

  6. #31

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Those Welsh based bods are the go to types for this type of thing, they looked at air time given to one side and the other side, they looked at positive and negative slants given to one side and the other side, they looked at how Auntie treated one side when they were in Government and then how the other side were treated when they were in Government.

    But I knew it all along, it was obvious to anybody that is impartial and has seen the English led UK State broadcaster report on the troubles in Ireland, Industrial disputes, right and left wing political arguments, the middle East conflict, Scottish independence referendum etc etc, that the beeb has a bias towards the middle England type of view point.

  7. #32

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    You just said the same thing again

  8. #33

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    You just said the same thing again
    Well their findings coincide with my findings and they did a detailed analysis.

  9. #34
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    Which makes the same error of over estimating the power of the BBC and establishment in influencing voting patterns as did the Remain and Clinton campaigns.
    I should think it's quite easy to find evidence of anything you want to find in such research , so that probably says more about the professor himself than anything else.
    It might be that some people will give it credibility because a professor produced it, but I'm afraid that fewer people these days automatically accept the word of academics because they've been caught out manipulating the facts for political or financial reasons so often.
    What part of their report - the data collection, analysis and/or methodology - do you disagree with?

    http://theconversation.com/hard-evid...-the-bbc-17028

    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/whall...9-07-15a.252.2

  10. #35

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    What part of their report - the data collection, analysis and/or methodology - do you disagree with?

    http://theconversation.com/hard-evid...-the-bbc-17028

    https://www.theyworkforyou.com/whall...9-07-15a.252.2


    I wouldn't get sucked into that discussion Jon.
    I regret that data collection and graphs have largely replaced higher thinking in our dumbed down society since it's actually meaningless . You can gather and present data to back up anything you want to prove - I was doing that myself forty or fifty years ago with figures for press and public consumption. Also , you can and will be misled even if you genuinely draw conclusions from figures alone.
    I know you won't accept that, but on the other hand, it's no use trying to convince me that such simple arithmetical sophistry is credible.
    It's a pity that so many people are happy to sub contract thinking to "experts" because they're no more trustworthy than anyone else.

  11. #36

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Ronnie I regard myself as impartial, pride myself on it actually and for decades i've seen the Beeb to be right wing biased and anti left wing causes then the Beeb commissioned experts to look at their coverage and the experts told them they were right wing biased, the Beeb claim that they are putting things in place to try and redress the balance.
    So its not me reading about it and agreeing, its me always saying they are right wing biased over the decades and my view then gets backed up by experts.

    Same with little clubs and little countries in football being more likely to get done by poor refereeing decisions that the big teams and the big countries, the Welsh clubs particularly likely to be done because of English only officials refereeing matches between English and Welsh clubs no doubt going back to the early days, my whole memory imo for certain, I used to name them, Liverpool and Man Utd, England and Germany, some people would say they can remember a wrong decision go against them, oh yes but for ever one wrong decision that goes against them they get two wrong decisions go for them, Welsh team get treated particularly badly, ive always known it and said it and then just like the Beeb case somebody does research sending recently retired top level refs every game for a Premier League season and for them to look at every goal scored and every goal disallowed, I didn't need no experts I knew Liverpool and Man u would come out top for wrong decisions in their favour and the Swans come bottom for having the most wrong decisions go against them.

    Then there was the Brexit vote, our Celtic cousins in N.Ireland and Scotland voted in, Wales surprisingly till you know the facts voted out along with England, but I knew and said just like I said with the right wing biasedness of the Beeb and the big team getting the lions share of wrong decisions in their favour that the huge English immigrant population in Wales had swung the Welsh vote from remain to leave, then experts look at it and yet again agree with trampie09.

    Always keep your eyes wide open and be true and impartial don't allow any prejudice into your thought process, look at the troubles in N.I I have no involvement with Irish or English but believing in fairplay it was obvious the rights and wrongs and used to say give it 200 years and the goodies will be seen as the baddies and the baddies as the goodies, you should have seen the London press coverage back in the day, oh well some people are easily fooled.

  12. #37
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by RonnieBird View Post
    I wouldn't get sucked into that discussion Jon.
    I regret that data collection and graphs have largely replaced higher thinking in our dumbed down society since it's actually meaningless . You can gather and present data to back up anything you want to prove - I was doing that myself forty or fifty years ago with figures for press and public consumption. Also , you can and will be misled even if you genuinely draw conclusions from figures alone.
    I know you won't accept that, but on the other hand, it's no use trying to convince me that such simple arithmetical sophistry is credible.
    It's a pity that so many people are happy to sub contract thinking to "experts" because they're no more trustworthy than anyone else.
    Your 'higher thinking' is just to ignore evidence, data and rigorous analysis and opt for blind prejudice, wrapped up in self-satisfied posturing.

    Much like the poster profile now known as Wales-Bales.

    You do it in every thread. I suppose you can (both?) at least claim consistency.

  13. #38

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    I wish you wouldn't introduce all this childish name calling you know.

  14. #39

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Kuenssberg, Neil and Peston are often accused of pedalling the Conservative #10 line.

  15. #40

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by trampie09 View Post
    Ronnie I regard myself as impartial, pride myself on it actually and for decades i've seen the Beeb to be right wing biased and anti left wing causes then the Beeb commissioned experts to look at their coverage and the experts told them they were right wing biased, the Beeb claim that they are putting things in place to try and redress the balance.
    So its not me reading about it and agreeing, its me always saying they are right wing biased over the decades and my view then gets backed up by experts.

    Same with little clubs and little countries in football being more likely to get done by poor refereeing decisions that the big teams and the big countries, the Welsh clubs particularly likely to be done because of English only officials refereeing matches between English and Welsh clubs no doubt going back to the early days, my whole memory imo for certain, I used to name them, Liverpool and Man Utd, England and Germany, some people would say they can remember a wrong decision go against them, oh yes but for ever one wrong decision that goes against them they get two wrong decisions go for them, Welsh team get treated particularly badly, ive always known it and said it and then just like the Beeb case somebody does research sending recently retired top level refs every game for a Premier League season and for them to look at every goal scored and every goal disallowed, I didn't need no experts I knew Liverpool and Man u would come out top for wrong decisions in their favour and the Swans come bottom for having the most wrong decisions go against them.

    Then there was the Brexit vote, our Celtic cousins in N.Ireland and Scotland voted in, Wales surprisingly till you know the facts voted out along with England, but I knew and said just like I said with the right wing biasedness of the Beeb and the big team getting the lions share of wrong decisions in their favour that the huge English immigrant population in Wales had swung the Welsh vote from remain to leave, then experts look at it and yet again agree with trampie09.

    Always keep your eyes wide open and be true and impartial don't allow any prejudice into your thought process, look at the troubles in N.I I have no involvement with Irish or English but believing in fairplay it was obvious the rights and wrongs and used to say give it 200 years and the goodies will be seen as the baddies and the baddies as the goodies, you should have seen the London press coverage back in the day, oh well some people are easily fooled.



    I don't think anyone is impartial really. That's against human nature.
    The problem with the BBC is that they claim impartiality and I don't think they can do that.

    Now, I see them as left biased just as you see them as right biased and much as I dislike the organisation I don't see how they can win on that basis.
    You speak of racial divisions and racial similarities within the UK which I cannot share - Celtic cousins and so forth- and these divisions don't exist in reality since the ancient tribe you speak of has long been totally mixed with everyone else.
    There's little in common between Ireland ,Scotland and Wales in fact, and Wales is far more similar to England than the other two.
    I'll have to feel more energetic than I do right now to discuss the Irish troubles, but that's a great deal more complicated than Irish versus English. The rights and wrongs of it are far from clear though.

    I'm not going to start telling you what to think or say, but I'd guess you're enthusiastically opposed to racism, and I wonder whether you've considered that your arguments are based on what some would call racism ?

    That's a great post though and poses many questions

  16. #41

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Quote Originally Posted by trampie09 View Post
    Those Welsh based bods are the go to types for this type of thing, they looked at air time given to one side and the other side, they looked at positive and negative slants given to one side and the other side, they looked at how Auntie treated one side when they were in Government and then how the other side were treated when they were in Government.

    But I knew it all along, it was obvious to anybody that is impartial and has seen the English led UK State broadcaster report on the troubles in Ireland, Industrial disputes, right and left wing political arguments, the middle East conflict, Scottish independence referendum etc etc, that the beeb has a bias towards the middle England type of view point.
    More of same.

  17. #42

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Weight of numbers butt, Cofiwch Dryweryn, 35 out of 36 Welsh MPs opposed the bill with 1 not voting, but they were out voted on a Welsh matter by non Welsh MPs.
    That is why most decisions made in Parliament can be described as the English led UK State as the vast majority of MPs are English MPs.

  18. #43

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    What do you want then, three mp's in Welsh constituencies ?
    I'd be interested how you define English , and what about Welsh and Scottish Mp's who have seats in England ?
    I'm increasingly thinking that you're on a wind up

  19. #44

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    On the contrary the person on a wind up is you Ronnie.

  20. #45

    Re: Peter Oborne.

    Answer the questions then

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