Reply With QuoteThat seems to be how most Brexit supporters see Britain as well.Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
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It definitely ain't for good so where does that leave us?
That seems to be how most Brexit supporters see Britain as well.
The former can help some of those who are seriously ill. I think I remember reading about one eighth of people on a ventilator or needing oxygen. Absolutely brilliant, of course, but this is not greatly reducing fatalities or a miracle cure.
Oxford University hospitals who did the trials hailed it a breakthrough and said that if dexamethasone had been used from the start 5,000 UK patients would not have died. That's significant.
I agree, corbyn appeared to dither more than anyone so god knows what state we’d be in with this virus if he had won, but then we will never know.....
Well, they said "up to 5,000" lives could have been saved - I'm not knocking this but it's about 10%. The vast majority of deaths would still have occurred, so we need to keep our feet on the ground. It is a breakthrough, it is good news, it's not greatly reducing fatalities.
The trial was called RECOVERY, suggest you look at the data which covers over 2,000 patients and says....Dexamethasone reduced deaths by 20% in those patients that required oxygen, and 35% in those that required ventilation. If that's not significantly reducing fatalities, what is?
Meanwhile :
A health economist from Swansea University said that, in hindsight, spending £166m on 46 patients was "not a good use of limited resources".
Prof Ceri Phillips said: "Elective operations were cancelled, the level of demand was reduced, out-patients was reorganised so people weren't coming into hospital."
How many have deaths have occurred in Wales where Covid was present ? 2300? We have well passed the stage where deaths from lack of operations, delays in diagnosis, treatment, attendance in Hospitals, have far exceeded CV19 -influence deaths.
What is your point?
The current lot appear to have handled it worse than any other ruling party anywhere in the world - most deaths per capita and most financial distress.
The tories (especially the current lot) are the party of business, and always think about business interests ahead of people. They also want to see state "interference" minimised due to their dogmatic beliefs that the free market is always more efficient.
I think labour, especially the left of it, would have been much less reluctant to apply an early lockdown, which looking at other countries tells us would probably have saved tens of thousands of lives and made the financial impact much less.
Of course the newspapers would have been extremely critical of whatever Corbyn would have done.
I don’t know if Corbyn would have locked down sooner, we will never know. It’s easy looking back but we are talking about imposing something on the population that had never been done before in the history of man here. People were very blaise about it, until it suddenly hit super serious around the middle of March with the hoarding of food
Monkfish is saying, quite rightly, that decisions should be made with the full knowledge of what is to come. It's absolutely disgusting that they planned for a situation that didn't even happen. What a waste of taxpayers money. If we're not funding them for their precog ability, what are we funding them for? It's like Minority Report never happened.
people were absolutely Calling for a lockdown 2 weeks before we finally got one. Rory Stewart amongst them.
companies started to take decisions ahead of the government, It really wasn't leadership.
I thought he was saying that it was all a big drama and more people would die by worrying about it rather than with it, its tiny compared with the flu which was the line at the time. So the facilities were never going to be needed.
Or conversely the modelling has been shit and if we locked down a couple of weeks later when the R had gone from 3.5 to something much higher the hospitals could have been overwhelmed and we would have got a far better bang for buck out of the temporary facilities.
If only we could have seen what happened in other countries first.
There is at least one contributor to this thread who has said that Brexit has to be a higher priority - in fact he did it a few hours before your message I'm replying to.
The UK is abandoning its existing contact-tracing app and switching to the technology provided by Apple and Google, Sky News has confirmed.
The news will be announced at a briefing later today.
The move marks a major U-turn, after the government insisted its own centralised model was more effective than the model being proposed by the technology companies.
I wonder how much has been spent on it already
The silence from the Isle of Wight trial was deafening and once it went from being the centrepiece of a world leading contact test and trace system to the "cherry on top of the cake" this was always going to be the outcome. At least they did not put all their eggs in one basket and commissioned a Swiss company to progress with the apps that have been successfully developed elsewhere in the world.
Absolute shambles though. The decision making around the initiation of this, going our own way, presumably because we didn't want anything with an EU flavour, procurement, planning and the optimism of delivery will all be part of a case study into incompetence when it is crawled over by the NAO and Select Committees. I guess Hancock will be long gone by then though,discarded as Johnson's patsy.
It's so depressing how predictable this all was. Nothing we can do except laugh about it, I guess.
Or cry about it. What a shambles.
The Gov, NHS and many public bodies seem to want to create their own things despite good tested commercial options being available. I don't know if it's ego or an inherent distrust of commercial enterprise.
Good to see at last....and I mean at last...NHS have a £350m contract with Microsoft to supply 365 throughout their systems. For years they've had a mix and match with some regions doing their own thing while others operated on out of date Microsoft systems which were no longer supported.
Too serious to laugh about....pass the hankie
On the plus side I’m getting used to the UK being crap at everything again more quickly than I expected.
Yep, there were calls on Social Media asking for us to lockdown. At the time, my company told us to start planning working from home on a Monday, by the Wednesday we were working from home.
Tesco were having crisis meetings weeks before the lockdown.
I think blue matt was hoarding way before any of us. If he still has the receipt, he could give us the exact day that panic set in for the hard of thinking.
Not quite yet, because it has been in a clinical trial until recently so you are jumping the gun a little bit. Based on the results of the trial, it is estimated as many as 5,000 lives could have been saved if we were in a position to use the treatment earlier. That is not me knocking anyone, by the way, it was always going to take time to get treatments that were effective (and no doubt we will find treatments that are even more effective, or alternative treatments that will be effective on those people for whom dexamethasone is not effective). But, it highlights that this will save many lives globally, hopefully we will see the death rate curve dampen soon.
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