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Thread: Justice for George Floyd petition

  1. #511

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Again anyone questioning it should educate themselves, this video is very helpful:

    https://youtu.be/jQ_0bqWKO-k

  2. #512

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    I couldn't gife a toss whether you trust me or not frankly. But you better be careful about saying things like that on here. i said something similar and was put on the naughty step. appartently, according to the bible of CCMB all racist stems from Uk's colonial past. Everyone knows that.
    I should be alright on that score then as I wouldn't argue with CCMB if they thought that lots of UK racism stems from the UK's colonial past.

  3. #513

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    Again anyone questioning it should educate themselves, this video is very helpful:

    https://youtu.be/jQ_0bqWKO-k
    MTV Decoded is a great series on learning about racial matters

  4. #514
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    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    84% of white people murder victims in the USA are murdered by another white person.

    What's your point?
    The vast majority of people who are murdered knew the person who murders them. That's why professional hitmen get away with it, no connection.

  5. #515

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    The vast majority of people who are murdered knew the person who murders them. That's why professional hitmen get away with it, no connection.
    Exactly.

    The whole "black on black" argument is disingenuous anyway.

    Unless people are racist enough to think black people are genetically more prone to violence then they should be ready to accept that there would be an issue with society causing it.

  6. #516

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    It is all such a complicated intertwined paradigm that it’s tough for me to get my head and my emotions around.

    It struck me and shocked me 18 years ago when I moved here how there seemed to be more racial undertones than in the UK.

    To just blame racist police and other institutions is massively oversimplifying things.

    It’s how black people are perceived, still today....as too different and a threat by so many people and how how these perceptions must understandably perpetuate the feeling of disenfranchisement and resentment that needs addressing.

    Relative financial inequality is also another big factor that contributes to the cycle of problems and lord knows how to tackle that?

    One can only hope that this whole sorry situation is the catalyst for positive change.

  7. #517

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Seen Spike Lee on the box yesterday, giving a history lesson as regards the founding of the USA, genocide, stealing land and slavery.

  8. #518

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world...mpression=true
    Talking of racism the above story has made the news today and has been described as anti Irish racism perpetrated in this case by the English, England has a state religion, the supreme Governor of the church of England is the Queen.
    It's not just black people that suffer racism.

  9. #519

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue View Post
    It is all such a complicated intertwined paradigm that it’s tough for me to get my head and my emotions around.

    It struck me and shocked me 18 years ago when I moved here how there seemed to be more racial undertones than in the UK.

    To just blame racist police and other institutions is massively oversimplifying things.

    It’s how black people are perceived, still today....as too different and a threat by so many people and how how these perceptions must understandably perpetuate the feeling of disenfranchisement and resentment that needs addressing.

    Relative financial inequality is also another big factor that contributes to the cycle of problems and lord knows how to tackle that?

    One can only hope that this whole sorry situation is the catalyst for positive change.
    All good points, it definitely runs much deeper than just the police.

  10. #520

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    All good points, it definitely runs much deeper than just the police.
    Talking of the police was the Cardiff 5 all black/mixed race ?, and didn't the eventual trial against the police collapse due to missing paperwork ?
    There was all sorts of racism accusations against our police, were things ever put in place to prevent our police doing the same thing in the future ?, it's just not America there are problems.

  11. #521

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    I see the UK protests have turned ugly. Let’s attack UK police because of some psychos on the American force. Crazy.

  12. #522

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Wales-Bales View Post
    I'm sure a few on here who would be up for it judging by their moralistic posts. I am grateful that I was brought up the right way to respect everybody, so this public display of guilt-tripping is quite an alien concept to me.
    Cheers for the reply

    they appear to be ignoring my post though

  13. #523
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    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    Cheers for the reply

    they appear to be ignoring my post though
    It as probably too sensible

  14. #524

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by J R Hartley View Post
    I see the UK protests have turned ugly. Let’s attack UK police because of some psychos on the American force. Crazy.
    The Biggest disappointment with these protests is that most seem to have forgotten that the world is under attack from Covid-19 and its not as if the BAME community is exempt from it

  15. #525

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    The Biggest disappointment with these protests is that most seem to have forgotten that the world is under attack from Covid-19 and its not as if the BAME community is exempt from it
    The BAME community is affected more from COVID. You can look at the other side and say that the people protesting are taking on such a risk to protest

  16. #526

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by adz-a32 View Post
    The BAME community is affected more from COVID. You can look at the other side and say that the people protesting are taking on such a risk to protest
    A very selfish risk when it’s not just their own lives they are risking.

  17. #527

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    Cheers for the reply

    they appear to be ignoring my post though
    I ignored it because it was a stupid video of weirdos, what else did you want to hear?

  18. #528

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    Again anyone questioning it should educate themselves, this video is very helpful:

    https://youtu.be/jQ_0bqWKO-k
    Has JR really rumbled you? Are you Rude? Be honest now.

  19. #529
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    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Croesy Blue View Post
    I ignored it because it was a stupid video of weirdos, what else did you want to hear?
    Shouldn't all weirdos matter?

  20. #530

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Wales-Bales View Post
    Shouldn't all weirdos matter?
    Weirdos lives matter , I know this as I read their comments every day and care for their outright views , as thy are after all gods children
    😉

  21. #531

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    The Biggest disappointment with these protests is that most seem to have forgotten that the world is under attack from Covid-19 and its not as if the BAME community is exempt from it
    Quote Originally Posted by adz-a32 View Post
    The BAME community is affected more from COVID. You can look at the other side and say that the people protesting are taking on such a risk to protest
    I know thats why i posted about BAME, just looks suicidal to me

  22. #532

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Interesting view that Biden may have to think about :

    George Floyd. Eric Garner. Freddie Gray. Rodney King. The baleful list of the names of black men killed or brutalised by police in America is long and too familiar. So too the list of cities where these and other acts occurred, cities now engulfed in protest and mayhem: Minneapolis. New York. Baltimore. Los Angeles.

    These places have something else in common. Every one of them is controlled by the Democratic Party. Not just recently, or narrowly, or tenuously. Like almost all major cities in America where most instances of racial tension have occurred of late, they are citadels of one-party rule.

    Minneapolis, where Mr Floyd was killed, has had a Democratic mayor for the past 42 years. There hasn’t been a single Republican elected to*the city council there in the 21st century. The last time a Republican was mayor of Baltimore, Lyndon Johnson was president. Fourteen of the fifteen members of the Los Angeles city council are Democrats. The other is an independent. In New York City at the last council elections in 2017, Republicans celebrated inroads into the Democratic majority — they won four seats against the Democrats’ 47.

    In America, states and cities have a large measure of autonomy ???

  23. #533

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Interesting view that Biden may have to think about :

    George Floyd. Eric Garner. Freddie Gray. Rodney King. The baleful list of the names of black men killed or brutalised by police in America is long and too familiar. So too the list of cities where these and other acts occurred, cities now engulfed in protest and mayhem: Minneapolis. New York. Baltimore. Los Angeles.

    These places have something else in common. Every one of them is controlled by the Democratic Party. Not just recently, or narrowly, or tenuously. Like almost all major cities in America where most instances of racial tension have occurred of late, they are citadels of one-party rule.

    Minneapolis, where Mr Floyd was killed, has had a Democratic mayor for the past 42 years. There hasn’t been a single Republican elected to*the city council there in the 21st century. The last time a Republican was mayor of Baltimore, Lyndon Johnson was president. Fourteen of the fifteen members of the Los Angeles city council are Democrats. The other is an independent. In New York City at the last council elections in 2017, Republicans celebrated inroads into the Democratic majority — they won four seats against the Democrats’ 47.

    In America, states and cities have a large measure of autonomy ???
    Let me guess that populated, poor, minority, urban areas with high crime rates vote Democrate/Labour.

  24. #534

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Interesting view that Biden may have to think about :

    George Floyd. Eric Garner. Freddie Gray. Rodney King. The baleful list of the names of black men killed or brutalised by police in America is long and too familiar. So too the list of cities where these and other acts occurred, cities now engulfed in protest and mayhem: Minneapolis. New York. Baltimore. Los Angeles.

    These places have something else in common. Every one of them is controlled by the Democratic Party. Not just recently, or narrowly, or tenuously. Like almost all major cities in America where most instances of racial tension have occurred of late, they are citadels of one-party rule.

    Minneapolis, where Mr Floyd was killed, has had a Democratic mayor for the past 42 years. There hasn’t been a single Republican elected to*the city council there in the 21st century. The last time a Republican was mayor of Baltimore, Lyndon Johnson was president. Fourteen of the fifteen members of the Los Angeles city council are Democrats. The other is an independent. In New York City at the last council elections in 2017, Republicans celebrated inroads into the Democratic majority — they won four seats against the Democrats’ 47.

    In America, states and cities have a large measure of autonomy ???
    You should have posted the entire article with the headline too...

    'Democrats fail black voters and blame others'

    'George Floyd. Eric Garner. Freddie Gray. Rodney King. The baleful list of the names of black men killed or brutalised by police in America is long and too familiar. So too the list of cities where these and other acts occurred, cities now engulfed in protest and mayhem: Minneapolis. New York. Baltimore. Los Angeles.

    These places have something else in common. Every one of them is controlled by the Democratic Party. Not just recently, or narrowly, or tenuously. Like almost all big cities in America where most instances of racial tension have occurred of late, they are citadels of one-party rule.

    Minneapolis, where Mr Floyd was killed, has had a Democratic mayor for the past 42 years. There hasn’t been a single Republican elected to the city council there in the 21st century. The last time a Republican was mayor of Baltimore, Lyndon Johnson was president. Fourteen of the fifteen members of the Los Angeles city council are Democrats. The other is an independent. In New York City at the last council elections in 2017, Republicans celebrated inroads into the Democratic majority — they won four seats against the Democrats’ 47.

    In America, states and cities have a large measure of autonomy. These are not the local councils of England and Wales. They have extensive revenue-raising powers through a range of taxes: property, business, sales and, in some cities, personal income tax. Directly elected mayors, in concert with councils, control vast budgets with authority in most municipalities over housing, education, urban development, fire and, of course, the police.

    Police chiefs are in most cases appointed directly by the mayor and are supervised by and accountable to him or her. For decades these Democratic cities have had, in other words, near complete responsibility for the staffing, policies and performance of their police forces. If the mayor of Minneapolis and the city council that aligns with him had chosen, they could have transformed the police department. If they were alarmed about systemic abuse by police, about racist attitudes and behaviour, they’ve had more than 40 years to put them right. They could have replaced the entire force with black officers if they’d wanted to.


    And yet, in the safe hands of a party that protests its absolute support for eradicating inequality and protecting minorities, we still get cases like that of Mr Floyd and the others. How can this be?

    In part, it’s because Democratic politicians know that, whatever the shortcomings of their policies, they have a handy narrative to deflect responsibility. It’s always easy to blame racist white cops, “systemic racism” in the nation, the legacy of slavery and generations of inequality. They know that a complaisant media will, as it has done with particular alacrity in the past week, buy into and promote the idea that when a black man is killed by a police officer it’s nothing to do with the authorities who appointed, trained and now regulate that police officer, but somehow the fault of Republicans in Washington, or some nebulous threat of white supremacy.

    Perhaps, in fairness to these municipal kingpins, it’s also that the situation with urban police forces in the US is not quite as unremittingly racist as protesters, the media and Democratic politicians would have us believe. The picture painted in the past week of a daily reality for black men in which they cannot walk out their front door without fear of being murdered by a white police officer is grotesque.

    According to the latest data from the justice department, blacks accounted for about a quarter of all those killed by police in the past three years; whites were slightly more than half. Blacks of course represent a smaller proportion of the US population — about 13 per cent, so those black fatalities do indeed represent a significantly disproportionate number of deaths by law enforcement.

    But this is misleading. The relevant statistic when considering what happens to people at the hands of the police is not total population but the numbers of people who come into contact with police. In short, a better measure is the relationship between those who commit recorded violent crimes and those who are killed by police. According to the FBI, almost 39 per cent of murders and 54 per cent of robberies in the US are committed by African-Americans.

    For all the simplistic narrative that portrays every encounter between a black man and a white police officer as a clash between good and evil, the reality of urban policing is much more complex. The principal function in practice of police forces in these cities is, sadly, to try to stop black people from killing each other. In 2018, for every black person killed by a white in America, there were 11 blacks killed by a black person.

    It is not racist to point this out. It may well indeed primarily reflect the vast inequalities that entrap African-Americans: of income and wealth, education and opportunity, and of the prejudice that supports it. It may also owe in part to social pathologies that afflict black communities in particular, the sort that Barack Obama identified when running for president in 2008: “Too many fathers are MIA, too many fathers are Awol, missing from too many lives and too many homes . . . they have abandoned their responsibilities, acting like boys instead of men.”

    Of course, larger American society has a role in preserving the inequalities that persist and it has an obligation to help fix them. But for the realities of their daily economic life and security, African-Americans have lived largely under Democratic politicians who have happily taken their votes come election time, and then blame police officers, Republicans, the White House and history for their own tragic failures.'


    Not a very nuanced dog-whistling article, is it?

  25. #535

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Poorer areas traditionally used to vote Democrate/Labour, if people from those poorer areas then made it, unfortunately a lot of them would then vote Republican/Conservative.

    A phenomenon of the Labour party in the UK in some eyes is they were too successful and help cause their own demise, by fighting for education for all and health services for all some poorer people that then do make it then unfortunately they forget their roots and become middle class Tories, greed is a terrible thing.
    Of course things have changed in recent years in the UK with more and more poor voting Conservative and some middle classes with a social conscious voting Labour.

    The right wing is sweeping the board with the likes of Trump and Boris in charge, it's a sad state of affairs.

  26. #536

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Wash DC Blue View Post
    It is all such a complicated intertwined paradigm that it’s tough for me to get my head and my emotions around.

    It struck me and shocked me 18 years ago when I moved here how there seemed to be more racial undertones than in the UK.

    To just blame racist police and other institutions is massively oversimplifying things.

    It’s how black people are perceived, still today....as too different and a threat by so many people and how how these perceptions must understandably perpetuate the feeling of disenfranchisement and resentment that needs addressing.

    Relative financial inequality is also another big factor that contributes to the cycle of problems and lord knows how to tackle that?

    One can only hope that this whole sorry situation is the catalyst for positive change.
    The ethos of the US seems to be to look after number one and to pay as little in tax as possible. In what other country do you find such a huge proportion of the population not demanding a universal health care system and not demanding a ban on personal firearms? And the US accounts for almost half of the personal gun ownership in the world, it is said. Political candidates (usually very old white men) need to prostitute themselves to raise the many millions of dollars it takes to run for election and many appointments in the judicial system are political. It's a sick society in many ways and those at the bottom suffer most.

  27. #537

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
    You should have posted the entire article with the headline too...

    'Democrats fail black voters and blame others'

    'George Floyd. Eric Garner. Freddie Gray. Rodney King. The baleful list of the names of black men killed or brutalised by police in America is long and too familiar. So too the list of cities where these and other acts occurred, cities now engulfed in protest and mayhem: Minneapolis. New York. Baltimore. Los Angeles.

    These places have something else in common. Every one of them is controlled by the Democratic Party. Not just recently, or narrowly, or tenuously. Like almost all big cities in America where most instances of racial tension have occurred of late, they are citadels of one-party rule.

    Minneapolis, where Mr Floyd was killed, has had a Democratic mayor for the past 42 years. There hasn’t been a single Republican elected to the city council there in the 21st century. The last time a Republican was mayor of Baltimore, Lyndon Johnson was president. Fourteen of the fifteen members of the Los Angeles city council are Democrats. The other is an independent. In New York City at the last council elections in 2017, Republicans celebrated inroads into the Democratic majority — they won four seats against the Democrats’ 47.

    In America, states and cities have a large measure of autonomy. These are not the local councils of England and Wales. They have extensive revenue-raising powers through a range of taxes: property, business, sales and, in some cities, personal income tax. Directly elected mayors, in concert with councils, control vast budgets with authority in most municipalities over housing, education, urban development, fire and, of course, the police.

    Police chiefs are in most cases appointed directly by the mayor and are supervised by and accountable to him or her. For decades these Democratic cities have had, in other words, near complete responsibility for the staffing, policies and performance of their police forces. If the mayor of Minneapolis and the city council that aligns with him had chosen, they could have transformed the police department. If they were alarmed about systemic abuse by police, about racist attitudes and behaviour, they’ve had more than 40 years to put them right. They could have replaced the entire force with black officers if they’d wanted to.


    And yet, in the safe hands of a party that protests its absolute support for eradicating inequality and protecting minorities, we still get cases like that of Mr Floyd and the others. How can this be?

    In part, it’s because Democratic politicians know that, whatever the shortcomings of their policies, they have a handy narrative to deflect responsibility. It’s always easy to blame racist white cops, “systemic racism” in the nation, the legacy of slavery and generations of inequality. They know that a complaisant media will, as it has done with particular alacrity in the past week, buy into and promote the idea that when a black man is killed by a police officer it’s nothing to do with the authorities who appointed, trained and now regulate that police officer, but somehow the fault of Republicans in Washington, or some nebulous threat of white supremacy.

    Perhaps, in fairness to these municipal kingpins, it’s also that the situation with urban police forces in the US is not quite as unremittingly racist as protesters, the media and Democratic politicians would have us believe. The picture painted in the past week of a daily reality for black men in which they cannot walk out their front door without fear of being murdered by a white police officer is grotesque.

    According to the latest data from the justice department, blacks accounted for about a quarter of all those killed by police in the past three years; whites were slightly more than half. Blacks of course represent a smaller proportion of the US population — about 13 per cent, so those black fatalities do indeed represent a significantly disproportionate number of deaths by law enforcement.

    But this is misleading. The relevant statistic when considering what happens to people at the hands of the police is not total population but the numbers of people who come into contact with police. In short, a better measure is the relationship between those who commit recorded violent crimes and those who are killed by police. According to the FBI, almost 39 per cent of murders and 54 per cent of robberies in the US are committed by African-Americans.

    For all the simplistic narrative that portrays every encounter between a black man and a white police officer as a clash between good and evil, the reality of urban policing is much more complex. The principal function in practice of police forces in these cities is, sadly, to try to stop black people from killing each other. In 2018, for every black person killed by a white in America, there were 11 blacks killed by a black person.

    It is not racist to point this out. It may well indeed primarily reflect the vast inequalities that entrap African-Americans: of income and wealth, education and opportunity, and of the prejudice that supports it. It may also owe in part to social pathologies that afflict black communities in particular, the sort that Barack Obama identified when running for president in 2008: “Too many fathers are MIA, too many fathers are Awol, missing from too many lives and too many homes . . . they have abandoned their responsibilities, acting like boys instead of men.”

    Of course, larger American society has a role in preserving the inequalities that persist and it has an obligation to help fix them. But for the realities of their daily economic life and security, African-Americans have lived largely under Democratic politicians who have happily taken their votes come election time, and then blame police officers, Republicans, the White House and history for their own tragic failures.'


    Not a very nuanced dog-whistling article, is it?
    God knows , its either a fact or a lie about of who does run these cities , the rest of the article doesn't really matter , my point is it runs against the Biden views , should those Democrat run cities not use their powerful autonomy and do something different and prove to Trump and the Republicans the right way of supporting all lives in its cities .

    This bit probably bothers you

    But for the realities of their daily economic life and security, African-Americans have lived largely under Democratic politicians who have happily taken their votes come election time, and then blame police officers, Republicans, the White House and history for their own tragic failures.'

    Is it true or not

  28. #538
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    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie View Post
    The ethos of the US seems to be to look after number one and to pay as little in tax as possible. In what other country do you find such a huge proportion of the population not demanding a universal health care system and not demanding a ban on personal firearms? And the US accounts for almost half of the personal gun ownership in the world, it is said. Political candidates (usually very old white men) need to prostitute themselves to raise the many millions of dollars it takes to run for election and many appointments in the judicial system are political. It's a sick society in many ways and those at the bottom suffer most.
    I'm so glad there's no inequality in the UK.

  29. #539

    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    God knows , its either a fact or a lie about of who does run these cities , the rest of the article doesn't really matter , my point is it runs against the Biden views , should those Democrat run cities not use their powerful autonomy and do something different and prove to Trump and the Republicans the right way of supporting all lives in its cities .

    This bit probably bothers you

    But for the realities of their daily economic life and security, African-Americans have lived largely under Democratic politicians who have happily taken their votes come election time, and then blame police officers, Republicans, the White House and history for their own tragic failures.'

    Is it true or not
    Of course it's not true

  30. #540
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    Re: Justice for George Floyd petition

    George was Covid-19 positive when he died, and his body also contained methamphetamine, fentanyl and cannabinoids according to the toxology report.

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