UK Covid-19 death figures

[Croesy Blue]

So you don't blame the uk government for the number of deaths in wales at all then?

[lisvaneblue]

So you don't blame the uk government for the number of deaths in wales at all then?

Only as much as you'd blame the Senedd for deaths in England

[Croesy Blue]

Only as much as you'd blame the Senedd for deaths in England

Idiot

[splott parker]

It’s obvious that the ‘blue’ in Lisvaneblue’s user name is more to do with the colour of his political rosette than his football one. Must be eating at him the Tory shambles that’s enfolding day by day.

[lisvaneblue]

[QUOTE=splott parker;5083242]It’s obvious that the ‘blue’ in Lisvaneblue’s user name is more to do with the colour of his political rosette than his football one. Must be eating at him the Tory shambles that’s enfolding day by day.[/QUOTE

My comments have been to do with healthcare in Wales during the pandemic. It’s been a shambles but the colour to blame is red.

Time and time again posters on this board have had a go about Westminster making a mess of Covid in Wales. Time and time again I point out that healthcare in Wales is run by the Senedd, and Uk Gov runs same in England

My voting colours vary, my football colours have been blue since first game at Ninian in 1952

[trampie09]

I think everyone gets it.

They also get that any effective lockdown that the WAG might theoretically have put forward at an earlier stage couldn't have worked without an economic package alongside - and that means the UK government. They also get that the main public health messages received by the Welsh public have come from the UK government. I think that is also the case in Scotland where Nicola Sturgeon has been effective with a Scottish information campaign, but one that inevitably follows London.

You even suggested a few posts back that the WAG could have introduced quarantine for Welsh people flying into UK airports. How could that possibly work - without the full co-operation of other UK authorities. It is a very useful demonstration of how many holes there are in your assertion that 'responsibility for healthcare rests solely with the Senedd'. In practice there are major limits on how that devolved responsibility can be exercised.

England has typically followed the Celtic countries as regards Covid, I remember putting up a list of actions and dates by the Celts and then the dates that Bojo and the English followed suit.

[xsnaggle]

England has typically followed the Celtic countries as regards Covid, I remember putting up a list of actions and dates by the Celts and then the dates that Bojo and the English followed suit.

That may be because it is agreed in meetings and then the first ministers rush to be the first to announce it, as Ms Sturgeon was accused of ding some time ago. "Looked at me, I'm a lEaDer/

[Croesy Blue]

But health care isn't the biggest contributer to covid deaths. It's how the lockdown was managed.

[lisvaneblue]

But health care isn't the biggest contributer to covid deaths. It's how the lockdown was managed.

Do you honestly believe that Wales, Scotland and N. Ireland weren’t party to discussions on the lockdown and in agreement with what was going to happen and the timing of it.? They would have been first in the queue to complain that the wool was pulled over their eyes etc, but nothing said to disown it.

The lockdown was at the heart of the pandemic healthcare policy...stay at home etc

[Baloo]

Do you honestly believe that Wales, Scotland and N. Ireland weren’t party to discussions on the lockdown and in agreement with what was going to happen and the timing of it.?

This represents some significant back-peddling on the position you adamantly adopted yesterday.

[lisvaneblue]

[QUOTE=Baloo;5083308]This represents some significant back-peddling on the position you adamantly adopted yesterday.[/QUOTE

In what way.

[CCFCC3PO]

But health care isn't the biggest contributer to covid deaths. It's how the lockdown was managed.

A great point and succinctly made.

[trampie09]

20200603_100847.jpg

Interesting figures, Wales figures the best of the home countries and England's figures the worst.

[trampie09]

Do you honestly believe that Wales, Scotland and N. Ireland weren’t party to discussions on the lockdown and in agreement with what was going to happen and the timing of it.? They would have been first in the queue to complain that the wool was pulled over their eyes etc, but nothing said to disown it.

The lockdown was at the heart of the pandemic healthcare policy...stay at home etc

Sturgeon banned gatherings of over 500 people back in March, Bojo followed suit 4 days later.
Scotland said no new jury trials, England followed suit 6 days later.
Wales announced school closures first, England last.
Wales brought into law that employers had to enforce 2m distancing rule, don't think England have done that.
Wales stopped people going to beauty spots when England still allowed it.

Bojo and England are miles behind the Celts, Sturgeon shows leadership and Bojo follows but unfortunately for England often quite some time behind.

[CCFCC3PO]

Did anyone watch PMQs today. Boris "proud of his record", and took every Starmer question as an attack. Was also careful not to mention the US crisis until asked.

40,000 people lying in coffins and urns, and he is proud of how his Government responded. A Goodison Park full of people, dead.

[The Lone Gunman]

Did anyone watch PMQs today. Boris "proud of his record", and took every Starmer question as an attack.

I did and to be honest I was disappointed with Starmer. I believe, given the wealth of evidence, facts and figures at his disposal, he could and should have been much more forceful.

[the other bob wilson]

I did and to be honest I was disappointed with Starmer. I believe, given the wealth of evidence, facts and figures at his disposal, he could and should have been much more forceful.

I don't think that's his style. Starmer's more like an accurate counter puncher, but quite often those in charge of the judging prefer a more aggressive style - he's got four plus years of this to come, as long as he stays in his job, and I think your point will become more relevant as the months and years go on.

[CCFCC3PO]

I don't think that's his style. Starmer's more like an accurate counter puncher, but quite often those in charge of the judging prefer a more aggressive style - he's got four plus years of this to come, as long as he stays in his job, and I think your point will become more relevant as the months and years go on.

He is getting into Johnson's head. It seemed poignant that the Government leader was losing control as the exchange wore on. A bit like this whole shambles. The question about R rate needed an answer. I suspect it was either higher than when the grading system putting us at level 4 had it (0.5-0.9) or Johnson just didn't know.

[Grievous Angel]

I did and to be honest I was disappointed with Starmer. I believe, given the wealth of evidence, facts and figures at his disposal, he could and should have been much more forceful.

Yep, Starmer missed a real opportunity today. He allowed Johnson to act like a bully without commenting on it. The comment about "casting aspersions on the efforts of tens of thousands" presented Starmer with an opportunity for a sound bite and he totally missed it.

[CCFCC3PO]

Yep, Starmer missed a real opportunity today. He allowed Johnson to act like a bully without commenting on it. The comment about "casting aspersions on the efforts of tens of thousands" presented Starmer with an opportunity for a sound bite and he totally missed it.

He already had the soundbite - an own goal of horrific proportions - when Johnson said "I am proud of my Government's record". 40,000 dead and hundreds of thousands of friends and relatives will feel cheated by that.

[the other bob wilson]

Did anyone watch PMQs today. Boris "proud of his record", and took every Starmer question as an attack. Was also careful not to mention the US crisis until asked.

40,000 people lying in coffins and urns, and he is proud of how his Government responded. A Goodison Park full of people, dead.

I think your Goodison Park could be an Emirates with its 60,000 capacity in reality. Johnson seemed to be putting all of his eggs in one basket because he wanted to attack Starmer all of the time for doing what the opposition leader should do. Apparently, we're all united behind the Government and are not impressed by anyone who dares to be critical - seemingly, the focus groups the Tories use are reporting back that we don't want conflict between parties.

[xsnaggle]

I think your Goodison Park could be an Emirates with its 60,000 capacity in reality. Johnson seemed to be putting all of his eggs in one basket because he wanted to attack Starmer all of the time for doing what the opposition leader should do. Apparently, we're all united behind the Government and are not impressed by anyone who dares to be critical - seemingly, the focus groups the Tories use are reporting back that we don't want conflict between parties.

But in fairness historically PMQs is never about the PM actually answering a question, God forfend! It's more like a weekly episode of the Punch and Judy show and always has been. KS attacks PM, PM bites back, friendly MP asks friendly question, PM answers, KS attacks, PM bites back, and so on and so on. You might be entertained watching PMQs but you should never expect to actually glean any serious information from them.

[CCFCC3PO]

But in fairness historically PMQs is never about the PM actually answering a question, God forfend! It's more like a weekly episode of the Punch and Judy show and always has been. KS attacks PM, PM bites back, friendly MP asks friendly question, PM answers, KS attacks, PM bites back, and so on and so on. You might be entertained watching PMQs but you should never expect to actually glean any serious information from them.

Starmer wasn't attacking anything. He was questioning. As he has been in his first few weeks as Leader of the Opposition.

[PontBlue]

I think your Goodison Park could be an Emirates with its 60,000 capacity in reality. Johnson seemed to be putting all of his eggs in one basket because he wanted to attack Starmer all of the time for doing what the opposition leader should do. Apparently, we're all united behind the Government and are not impressed by anyone who dares to be critical - seemingly, the focus groups the Tories use are reporting back that we don't want conflict between parties.

That's because intellectually challenged Boris can only remember one excuse at a time so just repeats it whatever is asked.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Only as much as you'd blame the Senedd for deaths in England

So are you saying that Westminster has as much control in Wales as the Senedd has in England? Think about your answer before you make a fool of yourself.