Yes ive heard several politicians as well as Drakeford. I just dont believe its the main cause of the spread.Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman
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Yes ive heard several politicians as well as Drakeford. I just dont believe its the main cause of the spread.
What do you reckon is the main cause? Or any significant cause? It’s really hard to know what to believe as there is so much conflicting ‘expert’ opinion, but what’s your take on it?
KI heard from a doctor specialising in microbiology that the main risk is person to person contact by being within one metre of someone for more than 10 minutes particularly if indoors
Yeah I agree it happens and people have no doubt caught it and spread it that way.
However its simply passed by person to person contact. Problem is these are areas where restrictions/closures affect businesses and the economy.
Id say the number 1 area for spreading is probably hospitality during the night. Of course our world class track and trace is an utter shambles so we cant check anywhere near enough contacts. If say schools , universities , the workplace are all ahead of people mixing in others households as a spreader
Just an opinion of course.
See my reply to Tuerto.😃
It seems that a few petulant fools - plus Tory spokesmen of course - moaning gets turned by the media into ‘a stream of criticism’. Anything to divert from kids going hungry I suppose.
I'd put serious money on the purchase of non essential goods are way down the pecking order of spreading this virus
Would you accept that most virus spread has happened indoors with the longer period of time you are indoors, especially if not socially distancing, the more likely you are to come into contact with it? Essential goods, non-essential goods doesn't really make a difference but it's unjustifiable to suggest shops stop selling essential items.
If people are wearing masks and socially distancing then, well, this all seems a bit OTT as well as depressing.
Are we entering a dystopian society
No.
No, were trying to avoid a Trumpian society
The virus spreads most easily in crowded confined spaces especially where people are engaged in activities which result in higher numbers of virus particles being expelled. The risk of becoming infected is in large part determined by how long someone is in contact with an infected person, for how long and how infectious the person is. The NHS Covid-19 app for contact tracing defines a high risk encounter as one where an individual has been within 2 metres of someone who has tested positive for Coronavirus for at least 15 minutes during 1 day (of course it cannot determine whether someone is indoors or outdoors which is a major determinant of infection risk).
This is why people socialising indoors represent a much higher risk and people active outdoors and socially distancing present a low (negligible?) risk. It follows there is not much evidence to suggest shopping in a supermarket in controlled conditons makes a very significant contribution to case numbers. This is likely because encounters with other people shopping are mostly transient so the exposure is too brief to result in transmission and also the large size of the store and controlled numbers of shoppers.
According to WOL the Welsh Government’s abrupt policy change last Thursday was due to Conservative MS Russell George saying it was "unfair" to force independent clothing and hardware retailers to shut while similar goods were on sale in major supermarkets. In other words the policy change was made for narrow party political reasons ahead of public health concerns about the risk of virus transmission. Unfortunately the resulting fiasco has created a situation where attention has been deflected from the serious situation Wales finds itself in.
If the Welsh Government had planned this policy properly and followed the science and also sought the expertise of the supermarkets in good time then this situation would have been avoided. It sounds like a partial U-turn will be announced later which will sensibly allow supermarkets to use their discretion on the purchase of non-essential items. Lets hope that the focus can then move back onto far more important public health matters.
Amen to that.
Hopefully the public health experts on here defending such an absurd policy will crawl back under their rock.
I think it's an entirely correct policy. why should people go sauntering down the jeans aisle or looking at shoes during a 2 week lockdown?
if it is allowed then it dilutes the seriousness of the message that this is a short sharp lockdown to minimise the disease as much as possible. a half arsed approach would be a complete waste of time
Yes the jean aisle in Asda and Tesco is often so busy we get the kind of stampede we see in Supermarkets when they start their Black Friday deals.
How rude, the ‘public health experts’ on here, as you refer to them, were the ones who were being level headed and in their view the two weeks terrible hardship of not being able to purchase non essential goods was not such a massive deal. The dramatic screamers & shouters were the ones who were likening it to a two year ban on buying bread and water. The ‘public health expert’ accusation obviously works both ways as the ‘open the lot’ point of view because the virus wouldn’t spread was borne out of their vast medical knowledge. Yeah right!
Paaaaleeease. The drama is coming from the public health experts who think we are going to get quadruple the amount of cases if we dare to let some old biddy pick up a fresh pair of thermals with their weekly shop.
I'm confused by your third paragraph - are you saying the Labour party took on board what a Conservative MEP complained about for "narrow party political reasons"? I ask because I'm not sure who benefitted from them - maybe I'm being naive , but it seems to me that one party thought that someone in another party made a reasonable point and acted upon it.
https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/27/matt-...ital-13485447/
Talking of complete idiots
Im sure we can all agree that if this clown was to get a serious dose of the covids it will be karma at its finest.
Disclaimer: In this instance the "clown" I am referring to is Hancock not Sludge.
Lol 😆
The Welsh Government asked for trouble by using such vague terms as "essential" and "non essential", but this piece
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...wales-12112959
helps explain what are regarded as essential items which can be still be bought - must say it's a wider list than I was expecting to see.
So, can anybody who has been moaning about measures which, after all, are only going to be in place for less than a fortnight now, come up with any item classed as non essential which they feel they will have desperate need for before 9 November - not forgetting of course that these can, almost certainly, still be purchased online.
How close is this article to what is the wider feeling in Wales I wonder?
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...pendence-trust
As a moaner, before I answer your question I have a quick one for you: have you been in any supermarkets since Saturday?
Yes, did my weekly shop yesterday morning and was able to get everything I wanted.
And how was it in there? Were the staff managing to keep the hordes of non-essential shoppers at bay?
I've been in three supermarkets since Saturday. On the way home from work yesterday evening, I called into Morrisons in Llanishen to get some milk and cereals. The first thing that greeted me as I passed through the barriers was a large display of toys positioned where they usually stack boxes of bottled beers. The Sky article you linked suggested supermarkets are not able to sell books or stationery, but these were readily available in Morrisons along with DVDs and CDs. The aisle where these items are stocked was operating as normal.
They sell a limited range of clothes in Morrisons these days, mostly stuff for young kids, but the aisle where these are stocked was blocked off, as was the aisle where the homeware is kept. They were blocked at either end by large pallets stacked with boxes of unwrapped produce. One of the knock-on effects of this was less room in the shop's central aisle. The other was that the store had to abandon the socially-distanced queuing system it's had in place for the last three or four months because those queues usually begin in the aisles that are now blocked off. Great work, WAG.
Onto B&M next door, where I was after some sweets I'm particularly partial to. This was hilarious. I wondered what the staff would manage to do in there as almost everything sold in B&M could be classified as non-essential. Their answer to the WAG's policy was to put a bit of gaffer tape at chest height across a couple of the aisles with hastily-printed pieces of A4 paper attached saying 'Please Only Buy Essential Goods'. There weren't many people in the shop (it was 7:15pm) and those that were there had completely ignored the signs. Literally everybody who was queuing up for the tills had items that were almost exclusively in the non-essential category. Naturally enough, the staff couldn't have cared less.
Today I popped over to Lidl in Splott to get my stock of canned drinks for work - something I do once a week. All of the central display units which usually stock all of the weird and wonderful non-food items that Lidl sells were turned back to front. This set me wondering how many people ever actually go into Lidl with a specific non-essential item in mind. I doubt it's many. I only ever go there for food or drink, but I come out with all sorts of shit.
To me, the whole thing looks exactly what it is - a pointless, petty shambles which has been put in place for no good reason.
Here's a question for you and any other non-moaners: earlier in the year, when the virus was at its height in Wales, supermarkets were free to sell non-essential goods. We also weren't required by the WAG to wear face coverings while shopping in these stores. So what has changed? Why was it OK for supermarkets to sell non-essential good in March, April and May, but now it is allegedly outlawed? It's almost as if this measure hasn't been thought through properly.....
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