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Thread: Pubs

  1. #26

    Re: Pubs

    It's worth remembering that if we were following English rules, South Wales would be in a Tier 3 lockdown, meaning all pubs and restaurants would be shut.

  2. #27

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Tom Simmons, the chef and co-owner of Thomas in Pontcanna, Cardiff, said: "The spend in our restaurant is around 70% on food and drink - and we will lose customers who know they can't have a drink with their meal. Many won't come back because of that."

    "I don't see any reason or logic behind this. All it will do is lead to people gathering at home and drinking instead - it would be structured with restaurants and pubs, not in people's homes."

    The chief executive of one of Wales' largest breweries says she wants the Welsh Government to prove that Covid is being spread in pubs and restaurants.

    "Where is the scientific evidence that you are more at risk in a pub than you are at home or in a supermarket," said Connie Parry of Tomos Watkin brewery in Swansea.

    Meanwhile, Folly Farm adventure park and zoo in Pembrokeshire announced it would be closing, saying it was "heavily reliant" on the indoor part of the business.

    Ben Francis, of the Federation of Small Business, said it was "incredibly important" that promised funding "can be rolled out as a matter of urgency".

    He added: "There is no getting away from the fact that today's announcement will come as a devastating blow to those indoor entertainment and hospitality firms that have fought tooth and nail to protect jobs, remain viable and provide a safe environment for their staff and customers this year."
    ^^^what he said^^^

  3. #28

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    I know....
    Probably doesn't trust vaccines either.

  4. #29

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Trigger View Post
    What was the point in allowing all these pop up Christmas bars to set up in the last week or so.
    I suppose the data changes on a daily basis and the government have to react to what the experts are saying. The state can't legislate for people who take the piss, they're not in a position where they can be selective with peoples choices based on their sensibilities. What we don't want is very high hospital admissions over the winter leading to more death and stress on health workers. I've not seen the data, but if these new rules mean that some people don't die this winter and health workers aren't stressed to shit and back over the winter, then so be it. I'd rather we take a cautious approach, even if the evidence later shows that it was unwarranted.

  5. #30

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    I suppose the data changes on a daily basis and the government have to react to what the experts are saying. The state can't legislate for people who take the piss, they're not in a position where they can be selective with peoples choices based on their sensibilities. What we don't want is very high hospital admissions over the winter leading to more death and stress on health workers. I've not seen the data, but if these new rules mean that some people don't die this winter and health workers aren't stressed to shit and back over the winter, then so be it. I'd rather we take a cautious approach, even if the evidence later shows that it was unwarranted.
    I agree with you, but it does make you think about just two weeks for the firebreak lockdown which we came out three weeks ago today some seven weeks before Christmas - I think today's decision proves that the earlier lockdown should have been longer.

  6. #31

    Re: Pubs

    Long closure for pubs I reckon.

    Johnson is looking at another vote in February to extend the tiers into March. With the 5 day piss up in the house coming up and people packing out the shops on Boxing Day I cant see the r rate coming down.

    Cant see Drakeford lifting this until into the Spring.

  7. #32

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    I know....
    No evidence just a billion graphs showing covid infections reducing over the summer.....I don’t necessarily agree with the Welsh gov on this but lockdown do stop the spread, they just do untold other damage too. Roll on vaccinations hey

  8. #33

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by goats View Post
    No evidence just a billion graphs showing covid infections reducing over the summer.....I don’t necessarily agree with the Welsh gov on this but lockdown do stop the spread, they just do untold other damage too. Roll on vaccinations hey

  9. #34

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by NYCBlue View Post
    Probably doesn't trust vaccines either.
    You mean Gates’ micro chip implants? So he can beam us to a new planet he’s been building

  10. #35

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    I agree with you, but it does make you think about just two weeks for the firebreak lockdown which we came out three weeks ago today some seven weeks before Christmas - I think today's decision proves that the earlier lockdown should have been longer.
    Yup, we did seem to come out of the two week lockdown quickly, with little restriction, it does seem that the transmission could've been managed better.

  11. #36

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman View Post
    I have very little faith in most people. Indeed, I have very little faith in our species, full stop. However, having been to a couple of pubs and restaurants on a small handful of occasions since this crap began, I can testify that a large majority of the people who were present were being as careful as possible, and the staff at the venues themselves had done pretty much everything asked of them in terms of social distancing measures.
    We've never met but thanks to years on this board I think I know your rough demographic so I'm going to take a punt and assume that the times you've been to the pub have been similar to mine, i.e not down St Mary's St at night on a weekend, where I think it's a very different story.

    It's incredibly unfair that local pubs are being punished when they're doing things properly though, a lot won't survive this latest round of rules

  12. #37

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    We've never met but thanks to years on this board I think I know your rough demographic so I'm going to take a punt and assume that the times you've been to the pub have been similar to mine, i.e not down St Mary's St at night on a weekend, where I think it's a very different story.

    It's incredibly unfair that local pubs are being punished when they're doing things properly though, a lot won't survive this latest round of rules
    There are grants available, whether or not they're enough to cover staff and other costs isn't something i know. The other issue is bosses who are using this pandemic as an excuse to bail out, reduce staff (many of whom are on zero hour contracts and minimum wage) Because they're not making enough for the shareholders -see Toby carvery-Harvester-Like they have no responsibility towards their staff, and that twat who runs Wetherspoons, ****ing about with workers conditions etc, while taking taxpayers cash. I do feel for the independents, sole traders etc. I just hope that these grants can keep them afloat and that when this shit is over that there is a boom in hospitality so that they can claw back whatever is lost.

  13. #38

  14. #39

    Re: Pubs

    People will do what they want, unfortunately that’s the culture we have now. By doing so it means we could have another 2-3 years of these lockdowns until enough people can be convinced to have a vaccine that will limit its spread sufficiently to allow the NHS to deal with the virus each winter and the backlog of other delayed conditions. Unfortunately the demise of the Great British pub will be a small price to pay for us to eventually come out of this.

  15. #40

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    There has to be data or expert opinion based on facts. Whether they're correct or not is another thing altogether.
    Drakeford himself has stated that the biggest problem by a distance in Wales is household transmission. The evidence that transmission is occurring at any significant rate in pubs and restaurants is thin to put it mildly - the paper the WAG used to justify their recent firebreak lockdown confirmed as much.

    You'll remember a couple of weeks ago that I was upset when the noble First Minister and his merry men deemed that the Welsh public couldn't be trusted to meet one another on a socially-distanced basis in each other's gardens. This meant I couldn't visit my terminally ill sister-in-law and, more importantly, most of her closest friends couldn't visit her either. It was, however, fine for people to meet up with others from up to four households in pubs and restaurants. The theory apparently was that the pubs and restaurants are such regulated environments at present that the risk of transmission in such settings was very slim. Nevertheless, here we are a couple of weeks further down the line and those places are shut again anyway.

    As you know, I went to my local for the first time in months on a midweek evening a couple of weeks ago. It was like a military operation - table booked in advance, full details of me and my mate logged, table service only, plastic screens up between tables, masks required when using the toilets, etc. To be honest, it wasn't much fun, but it was good to see my friend again and I felt confident that the chance of picking up the virus from anyone except him was absolute zero. I was supposed to be seeing Kate for the first time since February on Saturday, but Drakeford's put a stop to that. I know I'm biased as I cannot stand the man, but this latest measure seems totally over the top to me.

  16. #41

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    ohh..i've nothing to add i thought it said pubes

  17. #42
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    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by IanD View Post
    Hidden in a Times article, basically all this takes people's eyes off Brexit. If hospitality is closed = less demand for optional food and drink purchases. This frees up transport/warehousing to keep the flow of food going post Brexit. Better to have people moan about pubs closing/restrictions on groups gathering than have riots on the streets when the food doesnt get through to supermarkets....thinks government. Keep people at home, stifle protest, take back control.
    More preudoi-political bullshit.

    The virus and Brexit are 2 completely separate issues. You'll be telling us next the virus was manufactured and spread all over the world just so we, the British, took our attention off Brexit.
    Oh hang on - isn't that what you already just implied?
    Less food and drink in restaurants and pubs to free up transport for post brexit.
    Restrictions to prevent mass food riots?

    I suppose the Labour party would have stayed in Europe, so not needed the transport freed up, and could have let everyone do as the pleased in the pandemic because there would be no danger of food riots.

    Yeah, right!!!!

    you are joking. Please tell me this is a woosh!

  18. #43

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    We've never met but thanks to years on this board I think I know your rough demographic so I'm going to take a punt and assume that the times you've been to the pub have been similar to mine, i.e not down St Mary's St at night on a weekend, where I think it's a very different story.
    Indeed, and if that's the case then shut the city and town centres from 6:00pm. But don't shut the entire country's pubs and restaurants down just because you can.

    It's a pity the city council aren't in charge of this. Those twats would close down the city centre in a heartbeat given a chance.


  19. #44

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman View Post
    Indeed, and if that's the case then shut the city and town centres from 6:00pm. But don't shut the entire country's pubs and restaurants down just because you can.

    It's a pity the city council aren't in charge of this. Those twats would close down the city centre in a heartbeat given a chance.

    You got my vote as have all the well run local pubs and landlords and patrons who know how to behave across Wales its a disgusting decision and a shameful gutlessness one

  20. #45
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    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    There are grants available, whether or not they're enough to cover staff and other costs isn't something i know. The other issue is bosses who are using this pandemic as an excuse to bail out, reduce staff (many of whom are on zero hour contracts and minimum wage) Because they're not making enough for the shareholders -see Toby carvery-Harvester-Like they have no responsibility towards their staff, and that twat who runs Wetherspoons, ****ing about with workers conditions etc, while taking taxpayers cash. I do feel for the independents, sole traders etc. I just hope that these grants can keep them afloat and that when this shit is over that there is a boom in hospitality so that they can claw back whatever is lost.
    It's not just about grants for owners, it is also about people who work all week and only get the weekend to pop to the pub and relax and have a few beers in a covid-controlled atmosphere. Instead people will give more profits to supermarkets and lash it up in each others houses and nothing will change.

    Hasn't anyone noticed that once again the closure isn't for 2 weeks but 17 days. That is deliberately measured to take in 3 weekends when most restaurants and pubs do their business. It doesn't affect any other businesses in the same way so the 3 weekend scam can only be targeting one part of the economy.

  21. #46

    Re: Pubs

    Who even knows what the best thing to do any more is. The few times I was out before the lockdown everyone seemed to behaving themselves ok but who knows what goes on in other areas.

    I think the main problem is the 4 governments in the U.K. are so focused on self governance that they couldn’t coordinate if their lives depended on it.

    Wales only having the 2 week lock down was sensible when there was no extension to the furlough but then England decided they needed to lockdown so it was extended.

    Just goes to show people who go into politics are ****ing useless at needing to do any actual problem solving.

  22. #47

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    It's not just about grants for owners, it is also about people who work all week and only get the weekend to pop to the pub and relax and have a few beers in a covid-controlled atmosphere. Instead people will give more profits to supermarkets and lash it up in each others houses and nothing will change.

    Hasn't anyone noticed that once again the closure isn't for 2 weeks but 17 days. That is deliberately measured to take in 3 weekends when most restaurants and pubs do their business. It doesn't affect any other businesses in the same way so the 3 weekend scam can only be targeting one part of the economy.
    its also about young folk working and say in Uni, , earning some keep behind a bar , to help their families that cannot afford to support them , the pub is also an emotional support for some lonely single folk , there are moral issues at stake and perhaps ones of liberty and choice

  23. #48
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    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by Grangenders View Post
    People will do what they want, unfortunately that’s the culture we have now. By doing so it means we could have another 2-3 years of these lockdowns until enough people can be convinced to have a vaccine that will limit its spread sufficiently to allow the NHS to deal with the virus each winter and the backlog of other delayed conditions. Unfortunately the demise of the Great British pub will be a small price to pay for us to eventually come out of this.
    No it is not, and it is totally unnecessary. Destroy something that has endured for hundreds of years, something which as epitomised British culture for generations just because they cannot think of anything better to do.
    I've been castigated for saying this before but it seems to be being driven by people who really do want pubs closed permanently, just like you say

  24. #49

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman View Post
    Drakeford himself has stated that the biggest problem by a distance in Wales is household transmission. The evidence that transmission is occurring at any significant rate in pubs and restaurants is thin to put it mildly - the paper the WAG used to justify their recent firebreak lockdown confirmed as much.

    You'll remember a couple of weeks ago that I was upset when the noble First Minister and his merry men deemed that the Welsh public couldn't be trusted to meet one another on a socially-distanced basis in each other's gardens. This meant I couldn't visit my terminally ill sister-in-law and, more importantly, most of her closest friends couldn't visit her either. It was, however, fine for people to meet up with others from up to four households in pubs and restaurants. The theory apparently was that the pubs and restaurants are such regulated environments at present that the risk of transmission in such settings was very slim. Nevertheless, here we are a couple of weeks further down the line and those places are shut again anyway.

    As you know, I went to my local for the first time in months on a midweek evening a couple of weeks ago. It was like a military operation - table booked in advance, full details of me and my mate logged, table service only, plastic screens up between tables, masks required when using the toilets, etc. To be honest, it wasn't much fun, but it was good to see my friend again and I felt confident that the chance of picking up the virus from anyone except him was absolute zero. I was supposed to be seeing Kate for the first time since February on Saturday, but Drakeford's put a stop to that. I know I'm biased as I cannot stand the man, but this latest measure seems totally over the top to me.
    Could well be over the top, i'm not disputing that, i've not read up on anything to be honest in order to sway my opinion. I would have thought (like delm alluded to) that the issue is much greater in the city centre bars, pubs, especially in the suburbs are essentially restaurants now, i'm sure that they can be regulated.

    I do have some sympathy with Drakeford though, even with that prick Boris, mistakes are going to be made, the info isn't always going to add up etc. Drakeford is certainly more cautious. I'd like to see what he's basing his decision making on before i have a concrete opinion. Most people have had a **** full, but i don't think that anecdotal evidence based on preference helps anyone. We have to trust the scientists and medical bods.

  25. #50

    Re: Pubs

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    It's not just about grants for owners, it is also about people who work all week and only get the weekend to pop to the pub and relax and have a few beers in a covid-controlled atmosphere. Instead people will give more profits to supermarkets and lash it up in each others houses and nothing will change.

    Hasn't anyone noticed that once again the closure isn't for 2 weeks but 17 days. That is deliberately measured to take in 3 weekends when most restaurants and pubs do their business. It doesn't affect any other businesses in the same way so the 3 weekend scam can only be targeting one part of the economy.
    I couldn't care less about people who want to have a pint on the weekend.

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