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Thread: Bacuna

  1. #21

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by cardiff55 View Post
    Ah well, the good news is 2 and a half years have gone by, so only two to go!! Perhaps Norwich will take hime and Vaulks for £12m??!!!!
    We gave him a contract that was so disproportionately good we will be stuck with him for the duration of a deal that no other club in their right mind would have done. Thanks Colin Wanker, the downside of your period of management will hang about like chlamydia.

  2. #22

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by LeningradCowboy View Post
    Because we only had three other players in that position (Arter, Gunnarsson, and Ralls).
    Yeah but the point was why not just keep Demour if he's hardly being used then clearly he wasn't needed much. Just seemed an expensive transfer for the sake of it.

  3. #23

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by 2b2bdoo View Post
    Yeah but the point was why not just keep Demour if he's hardly being used then clearly he wasn't needed much. Just seemed an expensive transfer for the sake of it.
    The signings of Damour and Warnock paint an accurate picture of Warnock's transfer dealings.

    I really liked Damour and thought he was an excellent addition to the squad. Neat and tidy with a good pass, who also racked up a lot of yards. The fact he was unknown, came from an unheralded second-tier French team and arrived on a free transfer made it all the better. I remember Warnock saying the recommendation came from the same source that had suggested he sign Drogba in his younger years. Warnock was (and no doubt still is) great at things like this.

    However, Bacuna is the polar opposite. In horse-racing terms, he's "exposed". You know what you're going to get and he's unlikely to make a real splash. Add in the fee and the contract length and it's not good business. Fair enough, he's still in-and-around the first XI every week and I don't dislike him, just that he's a bit too much "6/10" for me.

  4. #24

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Perhaps one to move on especially if his reported high wages see true, we have a few great lads in the U23 squad bring them on now Mick , please .
    have to agree with you; move him on.
    Spedger

  5. #25

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch Mort View Post
    We gave him a contract that was so disproportionately good we will be stuck with him for the duration of a deal that no other club in their right mind would have done. Thanks Colin Wanker, the downside of your period of management will hang about like chlamydia.

  6. #26

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch Mort View Post
    We gave him a contract that was so disproportionately good we will be stuck with him for the duration of a deal that no other club in their right mind would have done. Thanks Colin Wanker, the downside of your period of management will hang about like chlamydia.
    Perhaps you could enlighten us as to exactly how much the transfer fee was and exactly how much Bacuna is earning, so that we can all make an informed decision as to whether it was a reasonable bit of business or not. If you don't have this information then it is just guesswork and supposition on your behalf, hardly grounds for insulting our ex Manager in the way you have.

  7. #27

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    Perhaps you could enlighten us as to exactly how much the transfer fee was and exactly how much Bacuna is earning, so that we can all make an informed decision as to whether it was a reasonable bit of business or not. If you don't have this information then it is just guesswork and supposition on your behalf, hardly grounds for insulting our ex Manager in the way you have.
    I think his transfer fee was £3.1m which, if you looked at the Reading messageboards at the time was regarded by their fans as good business. The fee is not an issue for me but I think the 4 and a half year contract was too long and if you research his salary online £27k per week comes upon a number of sites and has also been quoted on here in the past as being on a par with Morrison and second only to Smithies. When playing midfield he has never looked value for money to me. In terms of insulting our ex manager, as far as I am concerned this is one of many reasons to do so.

  8. #28

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnojek View Post
    The signings of Damour and Warnock paint an accurate picture of Warnock's transfer dealings.

    I really liked Damour and thought he was an excellent addition to the squad. Neat and tidy with a good pass, who also racked up a lot of yards. The fact he was unknown, came from an unheralded second-tier French team and arrived on a free transfer made it all the better. I remember Warnock saying the recommendation came from the same source that had suggested he sign Drogba in his younger years. Warnock was (and no doubt still is) great at things like this.

    However, Bacuna is the polar opposite. In horse-racing terms, he's "exposed". You know what you're going to get and he's unlikely to make a real splash. Add in the fee and the contract length and it's not good business. Fair enough, he's still in-and-around the first XI every week and I don't dislike him, just that he's a bit too much "6/10" for me.
    Damour and Bacuna......

  9. #29

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch Mort View Post
    I think his transfer fee was £3.1m which, if you looked at the Reading messageboards at the time was regarded by their fans as good business. The fee is not an issue for me but I think the 4 and a half year contract was too long and if you research his salary online £27k per week comes upon a number of sites and has also been quoted on here in the past as being on a par with Morrison and second only to Smithies. When playing midfield he has never looked value for money to me. In terms of insulting our ex manager, as far as I am concerned this is one of many reasons to do so.
    Bacuna's with Unique Sports Management isn't he? I'm sure a 4 and a half year deal for a middling Championship player while we were in the Prem had nothing to do with him being with Warnock's son's agency

  10. #30

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch Mort View Post
    I think his transfer fee was £3.1m which, if you looked at the Reading messageboards at the time was regarded by their fans as good business. The fee is not an issue for me but I think the 4 and a half year contract was too long and if you research his salary online £27k per week comes upon a number of sites and has also been quoted on here in the past as being on a par with Morrison and second only to Smithies. When playing midfield he has never looked value for money to me. In terms of insulting our ex manager, as far as I am concerned this is one of many reasons to do so.
    So you don't really know what the fee was or how much he earns. The length of contract means very little nowadays anyway. I actually agree with you in terms of Bacunas position in the team. I wouldn't have him in any team that I picked because to me he is lazy and gets caught out of position too often. That isn't down to his lack of ability, its his attitude on the pitch. That is something that you only find out when he is at the club unfortunately. Every player signed is a gamble to some extent. Some come off, others don't. As to your attitude to Warnock, you don't have to like him but to engage in snide remarks and direct insults is childish in the extreme and very disrespectful to a man who picked the club up by its bootstraps, connected the club to the fans for the first time in years and took us to the Premier League on a shoestring budget within 18 months. Something that I will never forget anyway.

  11. #31

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    I actually agree with you in terms of Bacunas position in the team. I wouldn't have him in any team that I picked because to me he is lazy and gets caught out of position too often. That isn't down to his lack of ability, its his attitude on the pitch. That is something that you only find out when he is at the club unfortunately.
    Are you serious? Bacuna wasn't some unknown youngster when Warnock signed him on a four-and-a-half year deal for a reported fee of £4 million. He was 27 years of age, had previously played 116 league games for Aston Villa and had made 59 Championship appearances for Reading. So are you suggesting Warnock knew nothing about Bacuna's attitude and abilities and just took a wild, speculative punt?

    I'm interested in some of your comments about the former City boss. You suggest Warnock "connected the club to the fans for the first time in years." It follows, therefore, that you believe there had previously been a disconnection between the club and its fans. So who do you reckon was responsible for bringing about that situation?

  12. #32

    Re: Bacuna

    I seem to remember Bacuna being touted as a Gunnarsson replacement when he was signed.

  13. #33

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    So you don't really know what the fee was or how much he earns. The length of contract means very little nowadays anyway. I actually agree with you in terms of Bacunas position in the team. I wouldn't have him in any team that I picked because to me he is lazy and gets caught out of position too often. That isn't down to his lack of ability, its his attitude on the pitch. That is something that you only find out when he is at the club unfortunately. Every player signed is a gamble to some extent. Some come off, others don't. As to your attitude to Warnock, you don't have to like him but to engage in snide remarks and direct insults is childish in the extreme and very disrespectful to a man who picked the club up by its bootstraps, connected the club to the fans for the first time in years and took us to the Premier League on a shoestring budget within 18 months. Something that I will never forget anyway.
    Hang on a sec, if you're not willing to accept the widely reported fee we paid for Bacuna, how can you claim that Warnock only had a "shoestring" budget in 17/18? How do you know that? It seems to me that any manager who can afford to make a signing like Gary Madine (with his reported fee of £6 million) is hardly operating on a shoestring budget.

    As mentioned earlier in this thread, Warnock was very good at a certain type of signing (Bosmans, usually from lower division clubs) and woeful when it came to players bought for significant fees and when he did sign one who has been a regular in the Premiership this season, he kept on leaving him out!

    As for Bacuna, I think that, if he was really seen as a replacement for Gunnarsson, he's been a poor one because he has little of the tactical discipline that Gunnar did and he certainly doesn't possess the same leadership qualities. I do feel sorry for him this season though because he's been shifted around from pillar to post. He was struggling at right back in Neil Harris' latter days here and I'm not convinced by him as an attacking player - for me, his stamina and running power makes him a natural box to box midfielder and I agree that he might be worth a try as a right wing back.

  14. #34

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Hang on a sec, if you're not willing to accept the widely reported fee we paid for Bacuna, how can you claim that Warnock only had a "shoestring" budget in 17/18? How do you know that? It seems to me that any manager who can afford to make a signing like Gary Madine (with his reported fee of £6 million) is hardly operating on a shoestring budget.

    As mentioned earlier in this thread, Warnock was very good at a certain type of signing (Bosmans, usually from lower division clubs) and woeful when it came to players bought for significant fees and when he did sign one who has been a regular in the Premiership this season, he kept on leaving him out!

    As for Bacuna, I think that, if he was really seen as a replacement for Gunnarsson, he's been a poor one because he has little of the tactical discipline that Gunnar did and he certainly doesn't possess the same leadership qualities. I do feel sorry for him this season though because he's been shifted around from pillar to post. He was struggling at right back in Neil Harris' latter days here and I'm not convinced by him as an attacking player - for me, his stamina and running power makes him a natural box to box midfielder and I agree that he might be worth a try as a right wing back.
    Warnock got us into the Premier League whilst spending around £10m including the Madine fee. If that's not a shoestring budget these days, I don't know what is. Also, I didn't say that the fee for Bacuna wasn't £3m, it might have been but it was undisclosed, as are his wages and I was challenging the previous posters opinion about Warnock wasting money on him. In order to ascertain that, you would need to know exactly how much he was earning and the exact fee, which no one does. Another point I would make about some of Warnocks signings (especially Madine and Bacuna) is that any manager trying to bring players in during the January window is going to have to pay an inflated fee and accept longer and more expensive player contracts. Its just a fact of life nowadays, as most clubs donít really want to sell and players arenít keen to uproot themselves either, at that time of year. Continually criticising Warnock for his signings ignores all the good things he did for the club and is unfair in my opinion. PS. I wouldn't play Bacuna at right wing back in preference to NG, Sang or Osei-tutu. To me he is an ok squad player but thats about it.

  15. #35

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman View Post
    Are you serious? Bacuna wasn't some unknown youngster when Warnock signed him on a four-and-a-half year deal for a reported fee of £4 million. He was 27 years of age, had previously played 116 league games for Aston Villa and had made 59 Championship appearances for Reading. So are you suggesting Warnock knew nothing about Bacuna's attitude and abilities and just took a wild, speculative punt?

    I'm interested in some of your comments about the former City boss. You suggest Warnock "connected the club to the fans for the first time in years." It follows, therefore, that you believe there had previously been a disconnection between the club and its fans. So who do you reckon was responsible for bringing about that situation?
    See you have added another £1m onto Bacunas fee, so you have no idea how much it was either. It was undisclosed but a number of ‘sources’ indicate around £3m. A manager only finds out was a players attitude and motivation is when he sees him on the training ground and when the chips are down in the first team. Perhaps you think that the selling team should point out his defects when the negotiations are going on !! The disconnect between the club and fans was down to Slade and then Trollope's style of management, playing players out of position, lack of direction in the teams tactics etc etc - no passion or charisma mainly. Warnock changed that in the space of about two months, particularly by bringing Bamba in. You can just carry on your vendetta against the club heirarchy on your own by the way - its just bloody boring now.

  16. #36

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    See you have added another £1m onto Bacunas fee, so you have no idea how much it was either. It was undisclosed but a number of ‘sources’ indicate around £3m.
    Sincere apologies. I Googled 'Cardiff sign Bacuna' and the first report to appear was this one:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47071577

    However, I am happy to bow to your superior knowledge as regards transfer fees. After all, who can forget your scoop regarding the huge loan fee Cardiff got from Sheffield United for Gary Madine? Admittedly such a fee has never actually been reported anywhere, but you sound like a man who gets the inside track to me.

    You claim: "A manager only finds out was a players attitude and motivation is when he sees him on the training ground and when the chips are down in the first team."

    I guess, therefore, that Messrs Warnock, Harris and McCarthy all believe that Bacuna's attitude and motivation are without fault, as all three have selected him on a regular basis.

    As for your assertion that the disconnect between the club and the fans was simply down to Russell Slade and Paul 'Twelve Games' Trollope, you maybe onto something there. After all, what sort of an idiot would imagine that either of those two would be a good managerial appointment for an ambitious Championship club?

    https://www.cardiffcityfc.co.uk/news...t-team-manager

    https://www.skysports.com/football/n...as-new-manager

  17. #37

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman View Post
    Sincere apologies. I Googled 'Cardiff sign Bacuna' and the first report to appear was this one:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47071577

    However, I am happy to bow to your superior knowledge as regards transfer fees. After all, who can forget your scoop regarding the huge loan fee Cardiff got from Sheffield United for Gary Madine? Admittedly such a fee has never actually been reported anywhere, but you sound like a man who gets the inside track to me.

    You claim: "A manager only finds out was a players attitude and motivation is when he sees him on the training ground and when the chips are down in the first team."

    I guess, therefore, that Messrs Warnock, Harris and McCarthy all believe that Bacuna's attitude and motivation are without fault, as all three have selected him on a regular basis.

    As for your assertion that the disconnect between the club and the fans was simply down to Russell Slade and Paul 'Twelve Games' Trollope, you maybe onto something there. After all, what sort of an idiot would imagine that either of those two would be a good managerial appointment for an ambitious Championship club?

    https://www.cardiffcityfc.co.uk/news...t-team-manager

    https://www.skysports.com/football/n...as-new-manager
    No fee was reported for Bacuna, so it is all just speculation, as you know. Subsequent team selection by different managers is nothing to do with me but my opinion is that when the team is struggling his head drops pretty quickly and he makes basic errors. This is actually generally borne out by his performances recently. Slade was brought in to do a job of cutting costs by getting rid of expensive players and to ‘steady the ship’ after the debacle that was Ole Gunnar Solskjaer. To be fair, he probably did a pretty good job within those parameters but it was just unfortunate that in so doing he turned the team into something so turgid it was like watching paint dry. Also, believe me, 12 games of Paul Trollope was more than enough. We were going nowhere, other than down into League One under him but he appeared the logical appointment when Slade went and was generally well accepted when appointed. It all went downhill pretty quickly though. At the point both were appointed both were a reasonable decision, for differing reasons, but hey why let that get in the way of a bit of good board/owner bashing, as is your usual preference. PS. The loan fee for Madine was generally reported at the time as a six figure sum plus a bonus if they got promoted, which they did. That would be a fairly standard sort of arrangement between clubs at the time. No doubt you think we let him go there for nothing.

  18. #38

    Re: Bacuna

    On the other hand CuraÁao are top of their World Cup group.

  19. #39

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    The loan fee for Madine was generally reported at the time as a six figure sum plus a bonus if they got promoted, which they did.
    Generally reported? Go on then, give us a link.....

    I've asked before to no avail, but if it was generally reported that City got a handsome loan fee and a bonus if Sheffield United got promoted, I'm sure a man of your calibre can find one. Just the one will do.

    Thanks in advance.

  20. #40

    Re: Bacuna

    Quote Originally Posted by dml1954 View Post
    Slade was brought in to do a job of cutting costs by getting rid of expensive players and to ‘steady the ship’ after the debacle that was Ole Gunnar Solskjaer.
    “I’m delighted to appoint Russell Slade as Manager. The stability, integrity and experience that he brings is something I feel is essential for Cardiff City. He is capable of turning a group of players into an organised, tight-knit team, with great team spirit, who will work hard for each other while playing an attractive style of football. I ask that our supporters offer him a chance to prove his long term value to our club, giving him and his players their full support as we try to earn our place in the Premier League under his guidance."

    Vincent Tan, 06/10/2014.

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