To me the greatest player ever

[lardy]

Messi is the greatest for me, incredible player and an incredible consistency

Pele was undoubtedly a brilliant player but his goalscoring record is suspect, half of the goals he counts came in friendlies and a whole host of them came against what were effectively pub teams in Brazil's regional championships.

I wouldn't nominate Pele myself, so this is not me being defensive about him, but is the Brazilian pub defence thing that gets said actually true?

The other greats, garrincha, jairzinho, whoever you want to look at, didn't have anything like his goal scoring record. If it was pub defences, surely they'd be up there with him.

He's still Brazil's record scorer, only a few have scored more world cup goals than him; I think his record has been adjusted already and can be accepted.

Messi is the greatest all round talent in my view. Goals, dribbling, passing, he can do all of these to a greater level than just about anyone.

[City123]

I wouldn't nominate Pele myself, so this is not me being defensive about him, but is the Brazilian pub defence thing that gets said actually true?

The other greats, garrincha, jairzinho, whoever you want to look at, didn't have anything like his goal scoring record. If it was pub defences, surely they'd be up there with him.

He's still Brazil's record scorer, only a few have scored more world cup goals than him; I think his record has been adjusted already and can be accepted.

Messi is the greatest all round talent in my view. Goals, dribbling, passing, he can do all of these to a greater level than just about anyone.

Yeah the way Brazil's league are structured is strange in that they played in a regional championship as well as the national championship, so for instance the Sao Paulo regional league has top flight teams like Santos but also sides from the 2nd, 3rd and sometimes even 4th tiers. Imagine the standard of those sides in the 60s.

His international record is obviously very good and shows he was a brilliant player like I said, but he often gets shoved into these discussions based on the 1,000 goals thing which is suspect