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Thread: Palestine Israel

  1. #321

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Taunton Blue Genie View Post
    The BBC broadasts 'Songs of Praise', 'Prayer for The Day', 'Sunday Worship', 'Act of Worship', 'Daily Service', 'Heaven and Earth' and many other religious programmes besides the one you went on to comment on - all of which makes your comment above rather silly.
    Are you joking! With the very rare exception, few people would discover anything about the Gospel by watching SOP.

    As for 'Heaven & Earth' - there would be more helpful spiritual material in The Simpsons.

    Unfortunately the BBC have no idea which way is up.

  2. #322

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Well let's see, what about the most atheistic company in Europe, the BBC. They spent £1.5M in producing "SON OF GOD" in 2001 and naturally had a willing atheist at hand to host it:-

    "Jeremy Bowen, a former Middle East correspondent for BBC News, was chosen to present the programme for its UK broadcast. Despite not being religious, he was drawn to the programme for its use of scientific and historical information. As well as presenting, Bowen also narrated and scripted large portions of the series. He stated that he brought a degree of scepticism to the show: before the first episode aired, he admitted that he did not think that you could "corroborate anything that was in the Gospels".

    The first episode of Son of God, "The Real Man", documents Jesus's life up to his temptation, and details the historical evidence for his existence. Bowen visits Jerusalem, where he calls Jesus's death "one of the best attested facts in ancient history".[e 1] He cites the Romano-Jewish historian Josephus as one of 80 sources that confirms that Jesus existed and that describes him as "a wise man who did surprising feats, ... won over followers from among Jews and Greeks, ... was accused by the Jewish leaders, [and] was condemned to be crucified by Pilate"

    The full article can be found HERE

    Seems like not even the BBC can shout for your team on this one?
    Well in 1000 years it will found that mick McCarthy existed

    But he didn't have magic powers or rise from the dead

    So some bloke might or might not have existed and was possibly called Jesus 🤔

    According to a load of blokes long dead

    What about his old man and the big place in the sky ? 🤔

    It's all bollocks

  3. #323

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Are you joking! With the very rare exception, few people would discover anything about the Gospel by watching SOP.

    As for 'Heaven & Earth' - there would be more helpful spiritual material in The Simpsons.

    Unfortunately the BBC have no idea which way is up.
    Most people have no interest in the gospel

    Why do you think that is ?

  4. #324

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Are you joking! With the very rare exception, few people would discover anything about the Gospel by watching SOP.

    As for 'Heaven & Earth' - there would be more helpful spiritual material in The Simpsons.

    Unfortunately the BBC have no idea which way is up.
    No, I wasn't joking. I stated facts whereas you made the most ludicrous and unsubstantiated sweeping statement.

  5. #325

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Well let's see, what about the most atheistic company in Europe, the BBC. They spent £1.5M in producing "SON OF GOD" in 2001 and naturally had a willing atheist at hand to host it:-

    "Jeremy Bowen, a former Middle East correspondent for BBC News, was chosen to present the programme for its UK broadcast. Despite not being religious, he was drawn to the programme for its use of scientific and historical information. As well as presenting, Bowen also narrated and scripted large portions of the series. He stated that he brought a degree of scepticism to the show: before the first episode aired, he admitted that he did not think that you could "corroborate anything that was in the Gospels".

    The first episode of Son of God, "The Real Man", documents Jesus's life up to his temptation, and details the historical evidence for his existence. Bowen visits Jerusalem, where he calls Jesus's death "one of the best attested facts in ancient history".[e 1] He cites the Romano-Jewish historian Josephus as one of 80 sources that confirms that Jesus existed and that describes him as "a wise man who did surprising feats, ... won over followers from among Jews and Greeks, ... was accused by the Jewish leaders, [and] was condemned to be crucified by Pilate"

    The full article can be found HERE

    Seems like not even the BBC can shout for your team on this one?
    I know a woman who can do surprising feats

    From Bridgend

    She's a magician , of a sort

    But nobody has written a book about her

  6. #326
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Palestine Israel

    This is an interesting piece on the changing attitudes of in the USA where Christian evangelicals (and the Republican Party) are seen by Israel as their natural allies (despite their antisemitism) whilst American Jews are increasingly breaking from the ideology of Zionism and uncritical support of Israel.

    https://newpol.org/we-anti-zionists-...r-of-u-s-jews/

  7. #327

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    I know a woman who can do surprising feats

    From Bridgend

    She's a magician , of a sort

    But nobody has written a book about her
    Unfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.

  8. #328
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Unfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.
    I don't know about others, but I have no problem believing that a minor Jewish prophet and agitator called Jesus (or the original version of that name) lived, annoyed the religious hierarchy, and was executed by the Romans. Either one man or a number of different people from the same period whose stories were conflated in the (sparse) written records. That is very different from accepting all the supernatural stuff that was and is wrapped around the story and the way the cult turned into a series of linked belief systems over the next two millennia - systems that were used to control large parts of the global population through the Church.

    You believe in the literal truth of the Old Testament! You believe in the truth of the four main gospels - which contradict each other and were written 30-100 years after the execution of Jesus by non-eye witnesses working in the propaganda unit of the new cult. But despite all your blind faith and credulousness the best you can come up with as proof of your beliefs is Jeremy Bowen and a sensationalist BBC drama-doc that was best remembered for its ludicrous 'facial reconstruction' punchline. Have you read the link you posted?

  9. #329

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    I don't know about others, but I have no problem believing that a minor Jewish prophet and agitator called Jesus (or the original version of that name) lived, annoyed the religious hierarchy, and was executed by the Romans. Either one man or a number of different people from the same period whose stories were conflated in the (sparse) written records. That is very different from accepting all the supernatural stuff that was and is wrapped around the story and the way the cult turned into a series of linked belief systems over the next two millennia - systems that were used to control large parts of the global population through the Church.

    You believe in the literal truth of the Old Testament! You believe in the truth of the four main gospels - which contradict each other and were written 30-100 years after the execution of Jesus by non-eye witnesses working in the propaganda unit of the new cult. But despite all your blind faith and credulousness the best you can come up with as proof of your beliefs is Jeremy Bowen and a sensationalist BBC drama-doc that was best remembered for its ludicrous 'facial reconstruction' punchline. Have you read the link you posted?
    I'd like to see a dramatisation of a non-magic story of Jesus. just the contemporary history.
    a Jewish reformer railing against corruption in the theocracy that he lives under, eventually becomes too much of a thorn in the side of the powers that be who have him bumped off.

  10. #330

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Unfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.
    A man with followers existing and that being recorded at a point in time is a very different thing to an entity clicking his fingers and making a talking snake

  11. #331

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    I don't know about others, but I have no problem believing that a minor Jewish prophet and agitator called Jesus (or the original version of that name) lived, annoyed the religious hierarchy, and was executed by the Romans. Either one man or a number of different people from the same period whose stories were conflated in the (sparse) written records. That is very different from accepting all the supernatural stuff that was and is wrapped around the story and the way the cult turned into a series of linked belief systems over the next two millennia - systems that were used to control large parts of the global population through the Church.

    You believe in the literal truth of the Old Testament! You believe in the truth of the four main gospels - which contradict each other and were written 30-100 years after the execution of Jesus by non-eye witnesses working in the propaganda unit of the new cult. But despite all your blind faith and credulousness the best you can come up with as proof of your beliefs is Jeremy Bowen and a sensationalist BBC drama-doc that was best remembered for its ludicrous 'facial reconstruction' punchline. Have you read the link you posted?
    Yes, and I watched the series some 20 years ago as it went out on a weekly basis.

    The particular point being addressed was SLUDGE insisting that Jesus Christ did not exist, my answer which uses the unlikely instument that is the BBC, answers that question clearly and leaves no doubt whatsoever. Also given the fact that someone who remains an atheist (to this day as far as I am aware) is saying the history is irrefutable re Christ Jesus, then you can hardly say I have called a loaded witness to the stand.

    As for your assumptions about the accuracies of the Gospels, I am happy to discuss your best example of this, fire away.....

  12. #332

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Unfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.
    No evidence at all

    Body

    Grave

    Nothing

    If you believe in something written 2000 years ago or whenever it was to be irrefutable evidence of Jesus christ , God and the great gig in the sky then you have failed I am afraid

    Some bloke walking around being nice to people 2000 years ago is not factual evidence of someone being able to do miracles or his dad up in the clouds actually existing

  13. #333

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    Yes, and I watched the series some 20 years ago as it went out on a weekly basis.

    The particular point being addressed was SLUDGE insisting that Jesus Christ did not exist, my answer which uses the unlikely instument that is the BBC, answers that question clearly and leaves no doubt whatsoever. Also given the fact that someone who remains an atheist (to this day as far as I am aware) is saying the history is irrefutable re Christ Jesus, then you can hardly say I have called a loaded witness to the stand.

    As for your assumptions about the accuracies of the Gospels, I am happy to discuss your best example of this, fire away.....
    Don't be such a sap

    Some bloke was a bit of a cult 2000 years ago , did a few public speaking events then got done over by the Romans

    That's not existence of God, heaven, Jesus christ his son , the parting of the waves and a few loaves of hovis and a tin of tuna feeding 5000 homeless

  14. #334

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Takes a Cardiff boyo to prove the existence of Jesus. In 2000 years there will be a cult of Jeremy. Couldn't make it up.

  15. #335

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    No evidence at all

    Body

    Grave

    Nothing

    If you believe in something written 2000 years ago or whenever it was to be irrefutable evidence of Jesus christ , God and the great gig in the sky then you have failed I am afraid

    Some bloke walking around being nice to people 2000 years ago is not factual evidence of someone being able to do miracles or his dad up in the clouds actually existing
    I see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood

  16. #336

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    I see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood
    You're completely ignoring the fact that many of us, Sludge included, aren't disagreeing with the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" that there may well have been a man called Jesus who had followers. What we, and undoubtedly the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" disagree with is the rest water into wine, parting of the red sea, the animals went in two by two and of course the world was made in 7 days greatest hits

  17. #337

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    I see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood
    He's saying there might have been a hippy walking around 2000 plus years ago who was a bit of a chilled out , friendly chap .

    He's not saying he fed starving people in their thousands , taught blind men how to see or helped bed ridden people walk

    This is hard work

  18. #338

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    You're completely ignoring the fact that many of us, Sludge included, aren't disagreeing with the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" that there may well have been a man called Jesus who had followers. What we, and undoubtedly the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" disagree with is the rest water into wine, parting of the red sea, the animals went in two by two and of course the world was made in 7 days greatest hits
    He does what he wants,
    He does what he wants,
    Jesus Christ/God,
    He does what he wants.

  19. #339

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    You're completely ignoring the fact that many of us, Sludge included, aren't disagreeing with the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" that there may well have been a man called Jesus who had followers. What we, and undoubtedly the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" disagree with is the rest water into wine, parting of the red sea, the animals went in two by two and of course the world was made in 7 days greatest hits
    I'm ignoring NO facts, Sludge stated that Jesus didn't even exist. That is now dealt with. He does.

    Now to your questions.

    Well done for getting one appropriate question re Jesus - Water into wine.

    * The Red Sea appears in the OT - Moses not Jesus.
    * Creation was in 6 days, not 7.

    So with regard to all the above, would you like to confirm that your issue is with the existence and power of God?

    If so, what is your own origin model for complex DNA, the Universe and the existence of all things?

  20. #340

    Re: Palestine Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by truthpaste View Post
    I'm ignoring NO facts, Sludge stated that Jesus didn't even exist. That is now dealt with. He does.

    Now to your questions.

    Well done for getting one appropriate question re Jesus - Water into wine.

    * The Red Sea appears in the OT - Moses not Jesus.
    * Creation was in 6 days, not 7.

    So with regard to all the above, would you like to confirm that your issue is with the existence and power of God?

    If so, what is your own origin model for complex DNA, the Universe and the existence of all things?
    What evidence is there of the existence of Moses and of the veracity of the stories, including the creation story, that have been attributed to him?

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