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Don’t you know by now that the boomer generation clearly knows best? The evidence is all around you.Originally Posted by az city
Walking onto a racecourse in front fast travelling thoroughbread horses is not something a protestor should do. There could have been more fatalities or severe injuries.
Emily Davison sadly died for a cause no one could disagree with but she may have been judged differently if shes survived but some jockeys and horses killed.
I think you've just managed to take this thread to a new level. I can just imagine Bill Baily reading your post out in one of his stand-up routines.
I've read some bollox on here and you've had some tough competition so to be fair, well done.
Just to post something in true CCMB style (by some) it would go along the lines of....
The stupid b*tch deserved it.
Of course she didnt deserve it. What happened was clearly tragic and I clearly havent expressed myself well.
Escalating protests where you are putting peoples lives at serious risk is not the way to go about it.
Theres one thing causing a severe disruption in peoples lives put putting lives at severe risk isnt the way to go about it.
The sad truth is that this is exactly what governments and corporations and apathy are doing to millions of people every day.
Try not to think in such narrow terms. It's a trap we're programmed to fall into. Have a read about Cognitive Dissonance.
There have been floods washing out the roads in Spain recently. Should drivers be free to give the floods a good kicking? The floods won't do it again, the drivers will feel a tonne wetter and police time won't be wasted (unless they use those roads to answer a call).
Sorry, for me, this is another example of a slight absence of logic or reason.
You cannot make any assumptions from someone's opposition to people blocking the M25 in relation to climate change in 2021 to someone else throwing themselves in front of a horse in 1913 about votes for women.
There have been thousands of illegal protests around the world; some may be just, some weren't. Time will tell.
By your logic, no one can call for Mick McCarthy to be sacked, because people used to call for Alex Ferguson to be sacked a year into his tenancy. Or no one can protest a war in 2021 because people also protested going to war against Nazi Germany, and they were wrong to do so. You just can't make assumptions and you can't easily compare two totally different scenarios.
It's different scenarios, so you are presenting a strawman argument.
No one is saying that votes for women wasn't critical and a wholly just movement. The point there is that there were no democratic means to protest. Women literally could not vote. They couldnt enact change by democratic means.
However, climate change activists can vote. They can protest, they can lobby and they can (and do!) enact change, as no doubt they have helped make the UK one of the most rapidly decarboning countries in the world.
You can support the message (or not!) and not support the means. There's dozens of examples of that. I support trans rights for example, but I don't support harassing Labour MPs about it. I support a two-state solution in Palestine/Israel, but I don't support hounding jews. I support insulating British homes, but I don't support people blocking roads they have no right to do.
Huh? Are you comparing floods to people LOL
it's no more ridiculous than you saying that hundreds of drivers should be allowed to get out of their cars and give some protesters a good kicking before getting back in their cars and carrying on their journey
I was just wondering about your methods of disruption control, cos there are plenty of them out there and will be more coming. The increased ferocity and frequency of environmental disasters have been brought about by our decision to pump toxic shite into the air. Should we give ourselves a good kicking? How about dragging people from their cars while they idle outside schools? What should we do with those planning airport expansions? (Apart from give them knighthoods).
But climate change is an existential crisis.
You're drawing the incorrect inference from my post.
Clearly at the time it wasn't universally regarded as just otherwise there would have been universal suffrage.
You do realize the Earth is in danger? As in, all humans will go down with it too.
There's ways and means to protest but holding up people going to work, small businesses trying to survive, emergency vehicles etc etc is not one of them so yes a good kicking is what they deserve.
I'm not sure how many emergency vehicles would use the motorway.
You have to be consistent though - what about all the other lives disrupted by climate change? All the deaths, illness, displacement and failed crops. We could've done something about all this decades ago but chose not to. Would you give a kicking to an oil company exec who hushed up the impact of climate breakdown?
No I do understand your point. I get what you are saying; "At some point in time illegal demonstrations that didn't appear just at the time were subsequently proved to be so". I get that, and I take your point and agree. But it's just theoretical. There's plenty of other illegal demonstrations that weren't just then and are still considered such.
Either way, the key issue is democracy. Nearly Any protest was illegal in Communist states in the second half of the 20th century and and clearly many of those, in time, are now seen as just. However, that doesn't mean that in a democratic state in 2021 that every illegal protest that exists is just or will be seen as such in the future.
The fact is that there are means to protest legally within our democratic structures and that's how people should do it. I simply don't believe what they are doing is just or fair.
I also don't believe (and I say this as someone who has a lot of sympathy for the cause) that what they are doing will work. It will piss people off and turn them against them.
XR are a bit kinda militant middle class lefty for my liking, but there's loads of things I would agree with them on, and things they could do such as educate on throwaway electrical products, educate on the unsustainability of the single market, educate on the global food trade, educate on China's role in this, educate on wearing jumpers when it's cold etc!!) but I just don't agree on this...sorry
There was an interview with one of the group on GMTV a couple of days ago.
Said theyd been trying to get their voices heard for 30 years. The 2 presenters just shouted him down throughout the interview. He ended up storming off. It was shocking interviewing by a mainstream TV show.
The video of the interview is here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zpTIrx6uAA
Will I get arrested by a 'policemanists' if I get out of my car and sit down on the M25 to say eat a sandwich , if I wasn't a protestor ?
I saw that, they had no interest in listening to anything he was saying. Although surely Insulate Britain could have found someone in their ranks who'd had their house insulated to speak on their behalfhe was like a lamb to the slaughter
Only one way to find out.
I genuinely think they put him up because he sounds working class.I saw that, they had no interest in listening to anything he was saying. Although surely Insulate Britain could have found someone in their ranks who'd had their house insulated to speak on their behalf
He was totally out of his depth, and as you allude, fell at the first hurdle.
They could put up one of the vicar's as spokesperson as he also represents God's words as well as loft insulation , or that chap that's at every protest 🤔
If the term car crash television hadn’t been coined before, it would have been invented after that - nobody comes out of it with any credit.
Agree. Putting someone up who doesnt appear to have insulation was crazy.
Madeley is trying to be Piers Morgan though shouting down people when they try to reply.
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